Shadowrun
Shadowrun General => Gear => Topic started by: Poindexter on <05-03-14/2349:22>
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Actually, im pretty sure it did.
While running an extraction, the getaway vehicle was clearly photographed.
Assuming we fear retribution from the offended party, what should we do with this truck?
Did we just lose 25k?
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I wouldn't think that you would have to get rid of it. If you have the ground vehicle maintenance skill all you would have to do is paint it that and add it to a new SiN using some one with a computer or hacking skill. Then get some one with a forging skill to give it a new license on the other SiN. At least that's how my GM runs it.
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If all else fails, all you need is 100 kilos of plastic explosives, 10 kilos of ball bearings, and a proximity detonator. Then, when the cops come to pick it up and possibly try to arrest people...
This post brought to you by the Swordfish Psychopaths. Swordfish Psychopaths... when you absolutely must send a message every fragger within five blocks can see.
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When the Rigger book comes out, we should see the returns of vehicle mods such as spoof chips and morphing license plates. Until then, see if your GM will houserule a conversion of those items.
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cant you hack the photo?
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When the Rigger book comes out, we should see the returns of vehicle mods such as spoof chips and morphing license plates. Until then, see if your GM will houserule a conversion of those items.
we might just sorta "assume" the rigger would have bought those things had they been available in the book, and forget about it.
"Old Kentuky Shark" if you will.
"Those are my morphing license plates and they have BEEN there."
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I would do it like this in 4th, and you can houserule things work the same in 5th until the relevant book comes out (I actually got the idea from a news paper article where criminals do a similar thing).
-put chameleon paint, a morphing licence plate and a spoof chip on it
-do your homework and take pictures of cars of the same model while your computer guy hacks their node for the information needed for the spoof chip
-program your chameo paint, your morphing licence plate and your spoof chip (or have it done) to change so they display the information of the vehicles you just photographed.
-drive around and if the cops take pictures of your car, they will check the database and find the other person and go annoy him/her.
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Assuming you now use a manual fake license plate, all you got to do now is replace it and repaint the car.
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Or search for a car with the same colour as yours and match the fake licence plate.
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I didn't think that you need a physical license plate on your vehicle. I thought the entire vehicle's information would be placed on his license which the license is attached to the SiN. Which you must always keep a SiN displayed otherwise you look suspicious, and would attract the attention of the police.
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A SIN? Prolly not, just its own info. And whether it broadcasts depends on whether the car was connected to GridGuide. A license plate is just a visual thing, if the car ain't broadcasting the rest, they're not going to catch it.
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Aren't license plates just a locked RF tag. They would be cheaper to make than physical plate.
If so, would they be a government issue number like today, or the vehicle's VIN?
Either way, you could have unlocked it and a have databank of "legitimate" plate numbers, and an unlocked RF tag.
Hacking the camera photo is much harder once copies have been made.
If your diving one of the top 3 most popular models of vans, with one of the most popular colors it will be much harder for them to find you, especially if the plates are changed.
I.E. Van Quality Blandness.
I wouldn't say that you lost 25K, you can still try to use it as a trade in for a new van.
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...Hacking the camera photo is much harder once copies have been made...
Odds are security footage will only be stored in one location (the host the camera is slaved to).
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Depends on how the system is set up. Border crossings, for example, are set up to send copies of information to multiple people.
If it's a camera set up that way, it may take a major shadowrun just to deal with the security footage. If it's not, then it's a simple hack. I think it depends on the building the camera is on.
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Depends on how the system is set up. Border crossings, for example, are set up to send copies of information to multiple people.
If it's a camera set up that way, it may take a major shadowrun just to deal with the security footage. If it's not, then it's a simple hack. I think it depends on the building the camera is on.
It's a pretty well connected organization.
Offices in many major cities.
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Edit: Worded this badly and someone else pointed it out.
Basically, I'm saying that if the GM won't allow the other suggestions and hacking isn't feasible, I gave you a nice Plan B ;)
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It's a pretty well connected organization.
Offices in many major cities.
So... A pretty high rating security host then.
You can't avoid host ratings when breaking the protection of the file
(even if you first abuse a direct connection with a slaved device)
Paydata runs against high rating hosts are never easy....
...it still make little sense why they would make multiple copies of the footage and store it in multiple locations
I still think OP will be able to find the footage stored in a secure file in the host the camera is slaved to
I still think their Decker should have a decent shot at breaching the host and altering the footage
(not unnoticed... and not without taking loads of matrix damage.... but hopefully he will make before his deck is bricked...)
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Realistically, it's impossible to avoid having data copied nowadays, even in systems that aren't specifically designed for redundancy. I would think that a wireless Matrix would be the epitome of the LOCKSS (lots of copies keeps stuff safe) concept that exists in digital curation today. For the sake of game play, the GM might make it a single file you need to locate and edit.
If that doesn't work and I wasn't planning on making this into its own run, I'd probably just have the driver buy a new fake license. Assuming the old license was on a fake SIN, he should be able to shed the burned license without a problem while keeping the SIN if it's done sooner rather than later.
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yeah, i dont think altering the file is gonna be an option.
I think its all about changing the truck.
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yeah, i dont think altering the file is gonna be an option.
I think its all about changing the truck.
Totally. But like people have said, a paint job, maybe a tiny bit of body work, and a changed license plate is fine. Especially if you know for certain that all they got photographic evidence, then all you've got to change is what's visible to the eye. Buying a new SIN and changing the ownership of the car to that SIN would also likely be enough if you think someone may have gotten some AR information from it (anything information it tells them, like if it had a specific purchase number, would almost certainly be removed before you bought it, and if it isn't a simple Hardware test would be the most required to change it).
Destroying or ditching it isn't very necessary. Especially because, with the lack of vehicle mods available in 5th edition, it's not like people are gonna be like "Man, two Toyota Gophers with a ramming plate and mechanical arms in three days? What are the odds?"
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OK, last question.
Lets assume, for one reason or another, i decide to take no action whatsoever to prevent the offended party from tracking me down. The vehicle is registered to my fake lvl 1 SIN. What must be done to track me down?
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OK, last question.
Lets assume, for one reason or another, i decide to take no action whatsoever to prevent the offended party from tracking me down. The vehicle is registered to my fake lvl 1 SIN. What must be done to track me down?
They could take the license plate number or other car details and find which car it is; possibly by going to the manufacturer and checking files to see when it was sold. If that didn't work (since it wasn't bought legally) then the next step would probably be to just look for it. With streetlight cameras and security drones that wouldn't require an impossible amount of work. If they found the car, then they could check which SIN it's registered to. From there, they could find out where the SIN's owner is currently residing and try to arrest you.
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OK, last question.
Lets assume, for one reason or another, i decide to take no action whatsoever to prevent the offended party from tracking me down. The vehicle is registered to my fake lvl 1 SIN. What must be done to track me down?
They could take the license plate number or other car details and find which car it is; possibly by going to the manufacturer and checking files to see when it was sold. If that didn't work (since it wasn't bought legally) then the next step would probably be to just look for it. With streetlight cameras and security drones that wouldn't require an impossible amount of work. If they found the car, then they could check which SIN it's registered to. From there, they could find out where the SIN's owner is currently residing and try to arrest you.
really? hmmmm
I assumed I'd be more screwed than that.
nice to know, assuming there are no dissenting opinions...
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Burned? Not yet.
But here are the Halloweeners for Cocktail Hour! ;D
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Realistically, it's impossible to avoid having data copied nowadays ...
A private corporation's security footage is not being copied to a zillion locations... Who told you that?
Would be far to easy for a rival corporation to get hold of sensitive security footage if that was the case.
The more paranoid the corporation, the more control would they want to have of their security footage.
They probably send the information away to a secure central location (in SR5 that would be their security host)
or they might store the data in their camera server (in SR5 that would be a device on premises).
...and in addition to this they might or might not make a hardcopy of the file (maybe once per day or once per week).
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How things happen exactly is up to your GM. But if this was my table, I'd say that the team needs to decide between repainting the van and getting a new fake license for it (easiest method), or they should consider finding the evidence and editing or destroying it. In order to destroy or edit the evidence, the team would need to act very fast - assuming someone took that photo or was monitoring the camera, an organization-wide APB might have been put out.
The easiest thing is to change out the plates, color, and registration chip. Unfortunately, rules for this haven't been put in yet, so I'd probably fudge something for my players. Cost would likely be Rating x 200 nuyen for the license/chip. Paint would be a flat 500. Plates would probably be another 500, simply because they need to be clean and not reported missing any time soon. Total cost around 2,000 nuyen.
If your GM is clever, he/she will use this as an opportunity for a security goon to hire the team. The team does this job for nearly free, and the evidence disappears.
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Realistically, it's impossible to avoid having data copied nowadays ...
A private corporation's security footage is not being copied to a zillion locations... Who told you that?
Would be far to easy for a rival corporation to get hold of sensitive security footage if that was the case.
The more paranoid the corporation, the more control would they want to have of their security footage.
They probably send the information away to a secure central location (in SR5 that would be their security host)
or they might store the data in their camera server (in SR5 that would be a device on premises).
...and in addition to this they might or might not make a hardcopy of the file (maybe once per day or once per week).
I was referring to how digital curation is handled today, which does involve copying to a number of locations, some actively and some passively. While magnetic tape isn't used in 2075, I can't believe that digital forensics is a completely dead field. At the very least, the file would exist on the host (probably for a period of time defined by a moving wall) and there would be a master copy in the essentially-inaccessible archive. The host copy would exist until the company's disposition schedule says otherwise, but since storage is effectively unlimited in 2075, the archival copy is, for all intents and purposes, permanent. Specifically, the treatment of the file would depend on whether or not the company followed a life-cycle or a continuum model. Admittedly, this is probably a more interesting thought exercise for people with degrees in digital archives and records management, but I can tell you with absolutely certainty that companies and organizations for whom security is a top priority copy material much more sensitive than, "last-Thursday's security footage" on a regular basis. It's done (hopefully) in a controlled fashion, but it's done.
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I was referring to how digital curation is handled today
Me too.
(But with references to what would be used in SR5)
...but I can tell you with absolutely certainty that companies and organizations for whom security is a top priority...
I happen to work at such a company ;)
...on a regular basis. It's done (hopefully) in a controlled fashion, but it's done.
I am not saying you have all the time in the world to alter the file located in the host.
Eventually (maybe every night or so) the file will be moved to a File Archive.
But hacking in SR5 is pretty quick....
It does not take days to make a hack attempt on a host. It take seconds.
(recovering from the biofeedback might take days, though)
If your shadowrun team notice that the van is caught on camera as you leave the scene your hacker can hack the host and alter the footage long before you reach your safe-house. At least he can make an attempt to do it. With no way of avoiding Host ratings when cracking the file protection the decker will be spotted. Question is rather if he can manage to alter the file before his deck is fried, he is dumped from the matrix and/or his physical location traced.....
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Yeah, unless you're a hella good hacker, you risk putting yourself into more danger. Link-locking, actual death if they have Black IC, and of course overwatch and the GOD, or just a simple Trace Icon action.
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I was referring to how digital curation is handled today
Me too.
(But with references to what would be used in SR5)
...but I can tell you with absolutely certainty that companies and organizations for whom security is a top priority...
I happen to work at such a company ;)
...on a regular basis. It's done (hopefully) in a controlled fashion, but it's done.
I am not saying you have all the time in the world to alter the file located in the host.
Eventually (maybe every night or so) the file will be moved to a File Archive.
But hacking in SR5 is pretty quick....
It does not take days to make a hack attempt on a host. It take seconds.
(recovering from the biofeedback might take days, though)
If your shadowrun team notice that the van is caught on camera as you leave the scene your hacker can hack the host and alter the footage long before you reach your safe-house. At least he can make an attempt to do it. With no way of avoiding Host ratings when cracking the file protection the decker will be spotted. Question is rather if he can manage to alter the file before his deck is fried, he is dumped from the matrix and/or his physical location traced.....
Yeah, I'd probably grant the decker a small window of time immediately after the run to try to go back and scrub evidence. Like you said, even if I give them an hour, the actual Matrix work only takes seconds, so they should be fine assuming the exfil goes smoothly. I'm with firebug, though. It all seems more risk than it's worth.
It's the most secure companies that are generally most in need of strong archival policy, largely for legal reasons. Having worked on the archival side of things for DOD-contracted institutions (paperwork! more paperwork!), there's obviously a tension between access control and functionality, but I don't think a camera feed is going to occupy the same digital landscape as [spoiler alert] Damien Knight's illegitimate child's address.
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Seriously? Every vehicle, every person, is captured on some camera or another every hour of every day, so long as they're moving through anything that isn't a Z-zone. The issue is, and for the most part in SR the issue has always been, the sheer amount of data the people have to plow through in order to get your ass. So it comes down to whether or not the corporation is able to a) get the data, b) sift through the massive amounts of data, and c) care enough to do A and B. GridGuide isn't owned by Knight Errant, and though they undoubtedly have a 'pursuit of suspect' agreement, there's still going to be a metric ton of stuff to go through.
For the most part, though, I tend to think that unless you committed some brutal crime or another, so long as you were professional about everything, there's only so far that the corp you hit is going to go - whether willing to go, or able to go, because GridGuide &c. isn't going to just fork information over for the asking. Information is valuable, after all, and is catching your ass within the 3 days it's going to take you to unload the stuff you got going to be worth the cost of catching you? The 20¥ per request for the data from GridGuide, and after all, backtracking someone is going to take a lot more than two or three requests? Etc. etc. And if it isn't Knight Errant after your sorry (truck), then so long as you got off that corp's property, the truck is probably free and clear.
For a corporation, catching a shadowrunning team is all about the bottom line. Will it be better for their bottom line in the long run to hunt down and blow your team away, or would it be more expensive to do so? Your job is to make it simply not worthwhile to find and frag your bod, whether by making it incredibly difficult to do, or by making the materiel expenditures and death benefits for the kill teams sent after you far too expensive.
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Seriously? Every vehicle, every person, is captured on some camera or another every hour of every day, so long as they're moving through anything that isn't a Z-zone. The issue is, and for the most part in SR the issue has always been, the sheer amount of data the people have to plow through in order to get your ass. So it comes down to whether or not the corporation is able to a) get the data, b) sift through the massive amounts of data, and c) care enough to do A and B. GridGuide isn't owned by Knight Errant, and though they undoubtedly have a 'pursuit of suspect' agreement, there's still going to be a metric ton of stuff to go through.
For the most part, though, I tend to think that unless you committed some brutal crime or another, so long as you were professional about everything, there's only so far that the corp you hit is going to go - whether willing to go, or able to go, because GridGuide &c. isn't going to just fork information over for the asking. Information is valuable, after all, and is catching your ass within the 3 days it's going to take you to unload the stuff you got going to be worth the cost of catching you? The 20¥ per request for the data from GridGuide, and after all, backtracking someone is going to take a lot more than two or three requests? Etc. etc. And if it isn't Knight Errant after your sorry (truck), then so long as you got off that corp's property, the truck is probably free and clear.
For a corporation, catching a shadowrunning team is all about the bottom line. Will it be better for their bottom line in the long run to hunt down and blow your team away, or would it be more expensive to do so? Your job is to make it simply not worthwhile to find and frag your bod, whether by making it incredibly difficult to do, or by making the materiel expenditures and death benefits for the kill teams sent after you far too expensive.
The team extracted a young girl from a low-medium security area without firing a shot, and with no injuries or destruction of property occurring on either side. Alarms were triggered, and the exit was a bit sloppy, but could have gone way worse.
Considering that after reading what you just wrote, i almost feel comfortable just chilling and doing nothing. Almost.
A new paint job would be nice anyway...
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I'd say we need the rigger book so we can get electrochromic paint, but we all know what happens when the rigger book gets released.
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I'd say we need the rigger book so we can get electrochromic paint, but we all know what happens when the rigger book gets released.
A dragon gets assassinated?
Serioiusly, what does happen when a rigger book gets released?
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I'd say we need the rigger book so we can get electrochromic paint, but we all know what happens when the rigger book gets released.
A dragon gets assassinated?
Serioiusly, what does happen when a rigger book gets released?
The rigger book is always the last book released in an edition. Rigger Black Book was followed by SR2; Rigger 2 was followed by SR3; Rigger 3 was followed by Rigger 3 Revised was followed by SR4.
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Wasn't Arsenal the SR4 rigger book? I've borrowed it a couple times from someone in the group I'm playing with as reference material for that story I'm writing in the fanfiction section. That book is pretty heavy on vehicle mods and weapons that would work well in vehicles.
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It has a decent amount of gear, but in terms of actually being Rigger 4 (eqv.)...meh. Tons of rules for modifying vehicles and new vehicle stats, but not much on the rules side of things otherwise. Rigger 3, on the other hand, had the type of hyper-specific rules (including an entirely new type of rigger) that Shadowrun players have come to expect.
People used to joke about the refusal to release Rigger 4 as Catalyst's grand plan to keep 4th edition alive.
http://www.shadowrun.com/forums/discussion/25891/rigger-4-at-last/p1
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The team extracted a young girl from a low-medium security area without firing a shot, and with no injuries or destruction of property occurring on either side. Alarms were triggered, and the exit was a bit sloppy, but could have gone way worse.
Considering that after reading what you just wrote, i almost feel comfortable just chilling and doing nothing. Almost.
A new paint job would be nice anyway...
As you said, a new paint job on the truck and you should be okay. Maybe invest in some chameleon coating for the truck, that way you don't have to repaint every time. Just switch to another paint scheme and your good to go.
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I just bought Stolen Souls and it seems to contain some the equipment described above, at least in connection to extractions.
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I'd say we need the rigger book so we can get electrochromic paint, but we all know what happens when the rigger book gets released.
A dragon gets assassinated?
instantrimshot.com
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I just bought Stolen Souls and it seems to contain some the equipment described above, at least in connection to extractions.
Yup. Chameleon coating, Spoof Chips, Morphing License Plates, Smuggling Compartments.