Shadowrun
Catalyst Game Labs => Catalyst's Shadowrun Products => Topic started by: AJCarrington on <01-30-15/1640:57>
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A new Tumblr entry: The Proofing Process... (http://catalystgamelabs.tumblr.com/post/109608672701/the-proofing-process)
A pretty detailed summary of the process CGL is currently using to proof books prior to sending them to print.
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Aww, they used one of my pages. ;)
Freelance editing is as sexy as it looks--which is to say, not sexy at all.
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That is pretty nifty - I love the behind-the-curtain look at things. It gives me even more respect for Catalyst that they're going to lengths to show some transparency when they don't need to.
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An unique opportunity to see how the proofing process works...
Bloody Business, page 116
Though still the dominant syndicate accross the Iberian Peninsula and along the French Riviera up to Monaco, the Asociacón has suffered from competition by the Arabic Al-Akhirah Aswad Mayia in Andalusia with ties to AA corporation Meridional Agronomics.
The correct spelling is "Al-Akhirah Aswad Majid" or "Al-Akhirah Aswad Mayid". Shadows of Europe uses the latter to originally introduce it on page 157. It clearly states the last word is the Arabic for "Glorious", which is actually transliterated in English as "Majid" (however, I wonder if "Mayid" is not the regular transliteration in Spanish).
"Mayia", which appeared in Shadows of Europe, Ghost Cartels, Vice and The Clutch of Dragons, is a repeated mistake that carries on, with no actual meaning in Arabic.
Also, I somewhat doubt Rolf Bremen should only be in his late forties in 2075, as he already was head of S-K Prime for some time in february 2061, and had been a MET2000 mercenary long before that.
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That is pretty nifty - I love the behind-the-curtain look at things. It gives me even more respect for Catalyst that they're going to lengths to show some transparency when they don't need to.
They're showing transparency after they delivered a string of sub-par products. I'm amazed that the process they show is all new for them and seen as an improvement: it should be a standard process for any serious publishing company.
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That is pretty nifty - I love the behind-the-curtain look at things. It gives me even more respect for Catalyst that they're going to lengths to show some transparency when they don't need to.
They're showing transparency after they delivered a string of sub-par products. I'm amazed that the process they show is all new for them and seen as an improvement: it should be a standard process for any serious publishing company.
No one is debating the fact that this should be considered standard practice. I certainly am not anyway. What I'm saying is that Catalyst is making every effort possible to regain that trust that they lost, and they should be commended for doing so.
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Yup i agree. It seems to be working. Run faster was an almost infinitely better product than street grim. Keep up the good work gents
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That is pretty nifty - I love the behind-the-curtain look at things. It gives me even more respect for Catalyst that they're going to lengths to show some transparency when they don't need to.
They're showing transparency after they delivered a string of sub-par products. I'm amazed that the process they show is all new for them and seen as an improvement: it should be a standard process for any serious publishing company.
You mean products that merely show that they're produced by imperfect and fallible humans rather than god-like beings with no flaws? The latter seems to be what the modern gamer expects out of a book these days despite how unrealistic it is.
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At least they are talking about it. :)
We as players have asked for more communication from them and this is one such step.
Not every item they put out will be ground breaking news or even a revelation, but by sharing the path along the way with us it will reassure a lot of folk they ARE trying.
Of course the Proof is in the P.U.D.D.I.N.G (Putting Up Demonstrably Desirable Information for eNhancing Gameplay) ;)
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It's not so much a difference in process as it is a difference in scale. I was brought on post-Run & Gun, so I can't really speak to how many people were proofing a single ms back then, but it's expanded significantly.
Thanks for the Arabic typo catch--I suspect that it's a matter of a typo surviving various editions. I can catch typos in German, but that's an extremely redundant skill when it comes to Shadowrun.
Age is a tricky thing for people who have worked for probably the single-richest sapient being in the Sixth World and then moved on to working for one of the richest humans in the Sixth World.
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The post said the process is new, not all-new, and it would be a mistake to assume many of the elements in this process were not in place in previous processes. Put simply, having multiple peope review and comment on PDFs has always been part of the process. The changes are more about how those comments are gathered and processed.
Jason H.
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Thanks Jason...great seeing you post more frequently these days.as noted above, the increased communication is noted and appreciated. Now if we could just figure out how to get you to include some juicy leaks and tidbits... ;)
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I've been meaning to do that for a while. Trying to work it into the schedule.
Jason H.
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End each month with a paragraph of 'What we did this month that we can talk about". A great way to end the last Friday of each month by reflecting on how much was accomplished and a way to track the individual teams at a single moment. Can even use it to realign your time with the individual teams for the upcoming month.
Thanks Jason for all you have given us within this amazing universe called Shadowrun.
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I've been meaning to do that for a while. Trying to work it into the schedule.
Jason H.
You've been meaning to give us juicy leaks and tidbits? I can get behind that.
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You've been meaning to give us juicy leaks and tidbits? I can get behind that.
I am very purposefully taking this entirely out of context. ;D
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I've been meaning to do that for a while. Trying to work it into the schedule.
Jason H.
Thanks Jason. Very much hope that this sorts out and you can establish a regular(ish) schedule.
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You mean products that merely show that they're produced by imperfect and fallible humans rather than god-like beings with no flaws?
If it's just due to "imperfect and fallible humans", then who wrote the books before the marked decrease in quality?
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You mean products that merely show that they're produced by imperfect and fallible humans rather than god-like beings with no flaws?
If it's just due to "imperfect and fallible humans", then who wrote the books before the marked decrease in quality?
different slightly more perfect people? What does it matter? This thread is about moving forward and onward!
I for one love the new attempt at transparency. Run faster's quality has me excited for data trails and beyond :)
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You mean products that merely show that they're produced by imperfect and fallible humans rather than god-like beings with no flaws?
If it's just due to "imperfect and fallible humans", then who wrote the books before the marked decrease in quality?
The process in the past was effective because the team wasn't always so scattered. Now that there are freelancers from all corners of the world involved, it meant a significant change to the way things were done before. This is what led to the decrease in quality. Now that the processes have been adapted, we're seeing a marked increase in quality. If you want to blame people for the past, feel free. But the rest of us want to move forward.
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What does it matter?
Well, what A4B's claim boils down to that there neither is a problem nor will there be an improvement, because we're all fallible humans and how dare you expect anything better than SG? Which is kinda funny given that this thread is about CGL admitting that there have been problems and they are trying to fix them (by using the new features of Adobe 4.0, but that's another story ;)).
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What does it matter?
Well, what A4B's claim boils down to that there neither is a problem nor will there be an improvement, because we're all fallible humans and how dare you expect anything better than SG? Which is kinda funny given that this thread is about CGL admitting that there have been problems and they are trying to fix them (by using the new features of Adobe 4.0, but that's another story ;)).
I'm not convinced that we read the same post. Or maybe we just took different things from it. I took A4BGs post to mean that people make mistakes, period. I never got a "neither is there a problem nor will there be an improvement" from his post at all. He said that people these days expect everything to be perfect right off the bat, which is both assinine and bound to lead to disappointment. Once in a blue moon, I agree wholeheartedly with A4BG, and this is one of those times.
What you've decided, Sengir, is to take up a cause that has nothing to stand on. You're either saying that Catalyst can do no right, or you're saying Catalyst can do no wrong. The truth is in the middle. Catalyst is made up of human beings who made mistakes, have owned those mistakes, and are implementing the necessary changes to prevent those mistakes from happening again. It's as simple as that.
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I took A4BGs post to mean that people make mistakes, period.
Grinder wrote that CGL delivered "sub-par products", which is basically what the blog post says. A4B's response was that these products, which the makers themselves admitted to be somewhat improvable,"merely show that they're produced by imperfect and fallible humans rather than god-like beings with no flaws" and that anybody expecting something better (like the guys who make the products in question) is just an entitled little brat.
You're either saying that Catalyst can do no right, or you're saying Catalyst can do no wrong.
[citation needed]
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I did just say that people make mistakes.
I did not make any such accusation.
Now, despite that I did not state such a thing, the sheer number of vocal complainers amongst the Modern Gamers these days does put my opinion at the point of believing that most Modern Gamers (be they RPG players, minis game players, video game players, MMO players or board game players) are overly entitled anymore and that the 'blog' in question would not have been necessary in the slightest if it weren't for that trend.
I never intended on stating that portion of the opinion, but given the false accusation of calling people such I felt the need to put it out there as my opinion alone and without actually accusing anyone of anything.
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Grinder wrote that CGL delivered "sub-par products", which is basically what the blog post says. A4B's response was that these products, which the makers themselves admitted to be somewhat improvable,"merely show that they're produced by imperfect and fallible humans rather than god-like beings with no flaws" and that anybody expecting something better (like the guys who make the products in question) is just an entitled little brat.
Well, since you can read A4BG's response to your... weird interpretation, I won't bother responding to this bit.
[citation needed]
If you think I'm wrong in how I've interpreted your words, then guess what? I'm not alone. You did the same thing with A4BG's post, and now you're acting like a tool about my interpretation of your post. Pot, meet kettle.
Let's not derail this thread any further - I think most of us can agree that Catalyst is moving forward in the correct direction. That's what this post was all about - giving some transparency to the issue(s) that Catalyst was dealing with, and showing how they're resolving these issues. Run Faster did a great job of showing that the new proofing process works well, but getting this behind-the-scenes look is very reassuring to me and (based on the posts here) many others. So rather than bitch and moan about the woes of the past, let's talk about moving forward and how Catalyst is treating our beloved Shadowrun world. For my money (literally), Catalyst is doing a great job.