Shadowrun
Shadowrun General => Gear => Topic started by: badneighbor on <08-31-15/0858:06>
-
Hey all,
I was looking over some character options and I got to thinking about the possibility of building a character's combat skills around using grenades. Seemed like the sort of thing to check with you folks. I'm sure I'm not the first to ever have this idea, so have any of you tried building/playing a character like this? How did it go? Would you recommend it? Interested in your thoughts.
-
Well, it's a rather expensive way to fight.
Pepperpunch grenades would be the cheapest ones. You can do it if you are otherwise a very strong character with melee capability (Strength helps to increase your reach)
Bolas are of particular interest since they can be used to hit someone with two or three grenades simultaneously.
If you get immunity to your attack you can be a very scary combatant (chemical seal and gas grenades)
For a pink Mohawk game certainly doable - with mirror shades you'll soon have problems through civilian casualties and property damage.
-
Barring chemical seal, you can get an immunity to a specific toxin. These are only good for a single dose though.
-
IMO most chemicals take too long, even the instant ones. Smoke, Flash, Concussion, and a mix of different radius explosives and you're good to go.
If you go with high strength and thrown weapon skill you can also carry an assortment of sharp, pointy, and/or electrified objects. And grab a decent Blade skill for back up.
The other thing you'll want is Armor from the Ares line of specialty armors for the Gear Access quality since you'll be constantly readying a new weapon each action.
I tried to build this character as an adept but kept running out of money and was never quite happy with the results, but it certainly can be done.
-
Ah, like the grenade adept from the fiction near the end of Run & Gun? That was badass. And terrifying.
As others have said, it's an expensive idea. You need to budget your grens or else you'll be out of money fast.
A dwarf/ork Adept can be very effective with throwing weapons. I'd suggest a few throwing knives for times when you just don't want an explosion or someone isn't worth the money (why waste a grenade on a ganger when a throwing knife will get them to leave you alone?). You definitely need Gear Access on your armor like Hobbes suggests. Throwing knives also work for when it's just one or two opponents left. Again, it's about budget.
Adept powers can make you more flexible too. Missile Mastery is great for saving money... Ask your GM if he'd allow you to count hitting someone with the grenade as an improvised thrown weapon, and then having it go off from the impact (if it's motion sensing). The downside being it'd take more than just 3 hits to get it where you want it-- If you miss the opponent, you roll for scatter, no matter how many hits you had. That's how I'd rule it.
Nimble Fingers, Rapid Draw, and maybe one or two other powers would also be helpful (beyond the obvious of Improved Ability).
Grenades are quite varied on what they can do. A gas mask or armor with chemical seal can mean a CS or Pepper Punch grenade can be great. HE grenades and frag grenades can take care of drones and people. Flash-bangs are great for taking out groups non-lethally-- That they have no damage fall-off means it's perfect for certain situations. Doing things like throwing a grenade into a room of hostiles is perfect for making an entrance too, even if it doesn't do much (like a frag into a widely-spread group of armored targets).
-
I'm not sure on Adepts being the best way to do the throwing weapon thing. For a high resources cyber'd character you can spend 10k on "ammo" and be set for a years worth of runs for a relatively trivial expense. Plus DataJack for remote detonation becomes an easy thing instead of something that costs a PP. The wireless bonus for throwing knives is hilarious btw.
Anyway, I suspect the optimal way to do this specific build is medium to high resources and Augmentation. Metahuman or not. Although the Metahuman version will likely get pretty tight on skills and edge, but certainly doable. It's essentially a standard melee Samurai build with Thrown weapons instead of a firearm skill. Shake a bit more cash loose for the weapons budget.
If you're stumped throw up a post down in the character creation sub-form and you'll get lots of suggestions.
-
You don't need remote detonation when you can be good enough to always land the hit with it set to motion sensor.
-
Bolas are of particular interest since they can be used to hit someone with two or three grenades simultaneously.
I saw the boom bolas on run and gun and its really nasty, but you need wireless to detonate them on your next action
- what happens when the target have a Rating 6 jammer? I looked up the grenades and they fall into the rating 2 device category, how do you overcome this snag?
-
More for traps and whatnot. Cheap drone flying or hiding nearby watching the area, *boom* on demand, as needed. Or when you need a distraction to make your exit. Many uses for clever characters.
-
Bolas are of particular interest since they can be used to hit someone with two or three grenades simultaneously.
I saw the boom bolas on run and gun and its really nasty, but you need wireless to detonate them on your next action
- what happens when the target have a Rating 6 jammer? I looked up the grenades and they fall into the rating 2 device category, how do you overcome this snag?
Have a datajack, a receiver dongle and or fresnel fabric for your cloths (laughting at jammer is optional)
-
Have a datajack, a receiver dongle and or fresnel fabric for your cloths (laughting at jammer is optional)
no what I meant is, when you throw the bola at the target, but the target has an area jammer - so once the grenade enters the radius it loses its wireless capability so you can't trigger it anymore. I doubt you can put a datajack on the grenade or a fresnel fabric on it too
-
You can send a command through your noise canceling capabilities. Otherwise just set a timer.
-
where can I see the mechanics for setting the timer? =)
-
P. 181
-
ah so that's where it is hiding,
- So it is included on the Simple action to set the timer and throw 1 grenade. Does it become a complex action when you set the timer on 2-3 grenades on a boom bola + throw it at a target?
-
Simple action to "Ready" a weapon. Gear access lowers this to Free.
Simple action to change the grenade from one setting to another. Set different Grenades to different settings so the kind you need is typically ready to go. For someone with a lot of dice in throwing you can likely set most of them to motion sensor and let them explode on impact. 'cause you'll hit your target 90% or more of the time.
Simple action to throw.
Properly set up, Free action ready the grenade (Tomahawk, whatever) you've got pre-set to what you need, Simple Action Aim, Simple Action Throw.
-
I think grenades are different from shurikens and knives that you can ready X grenades = Agility/2. 1 Combat Turn is 3 seconds, I think it will eat more time to enter how much delay the timer will be. So 1 simple action will ready 1 grenade, so a bola with 2-3 grenades will take 2-3 simple actions to set the timer before throwing - I think this is fair.
-I dont think motion sensors will be effective as there is the Right Back At Ya! interrupt action and the enemy caster can put a wall and intercept it mid-flight.
-
If you link the grenades you only have to activate one - the other will go up out of sympathy ;)
-
If you link the grenades you only have to activate one - the other will go up out of sympathy ;)
where can I find that mechanic?
-
You mean where can I find the rules that explosives will explode when they are in close proximity to other exploding explosives?
Right next to the rules that your character needs to breath to stay alive. ;D
-
Hmmm, yeah fair enough, if they are tied together on a bola the pressure wont push them away - but that makes it too OP if the thrower could throw like 3 boom bolas then that would be 6-9 grenades. The only chance would be to quickly find the grenade with the activated timer and do something about it, A caster putting up a wall to block the grenades in mid flight or have movement to quickly get out of range.
-
Bear in mind that bolas (including boom bolas) are an exotic weapon, so don't use thrown, and I personally wouldn't allow them to be used with multiple attacks, as they are neither melee weapon nor firearms (I would allow it for knives and shuriken, but can't see the rules that do).
They are also thrown at a target, not as grenades at a location (the cinematic spin round and round target then when they stop, go boom), it is only on misses that you worry about scatter.
-
Bear in mind that bolas (including boom bolas) are an exotic weapon, so don't use thrown, and I personally wouldn't allow them to be used with multiple attacks, as they are neither melee weapon nor firearms (I would allow it for knives and shuriken, but can't see the rules that do).
they are still thrown weapons even if they use the exotic weapon skill.
They are also thrown at a target, not as grenades at a location (the cinematic spin round and round target then when they stop, go boom), it is only on misses that you worry about scatter.
Bolas can do one of two types of damage based on their use.
When thrown to hit a target, make an Exotic Ranged Weapon
(Bolas) Attack Test (use the DV and AP stats on the left side of
the slash for monofilament bolas).
When thrown with the intent of wrapping around a
specific location on an opponent use the appropriate Called
Shot Location modifier to determine success. A standard bola
requires the target to make an immediate Agility + Gymnastics
[Physical] Test with a threshold of the attacker’s net hits; if they
fail, they fall prone.
they can be used in 2 ways - thrown at a target normally, and the other one that entangles the target
-
Yes, but not thrown as grenades,