Shadowrun
Shadowrun Play => Character creation and critique => Topic started by: Devil on <12-31-15/1831:23>
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So I need to make a "tank" character, or at least someone that can fight well, for an upcoming game. Unfortunately I don't have enough time to obsess over it like I usually do, so I could use some help.
I'd like to make a Human Street Samurai style character who is obsessed with Western Movies. The goal would be to be able to use two revolvers and look damn good doing it.
No adepts please, since the group is already chalked fulled of awakened characters. I've been told not to worry too much about min-maxing and to just make a fun character.
Anybody feel like helping me out some?
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Tweaked a samurai build I had laying around. Still has a ton of Nuyen to burn and a few points of Karma after the tweaks. 7 Edge, splash of charisma, but hurting in the skill department. Not real fast but 17 dice on defense tests before Agile Defender. I'm sure there are more pistol accessories to add, and probably a few odds and ends.
Probably could pick up some Sleeping Tiger armor and add some more mods to the Armor and guns. Grab a spare vehicle and some spare SINs to burn up the cash? Eh. This should get you in the ballpark anyway.
Movement: 18/36
Karma: 6 remaining
Composure: 9
Judge Intentions: 10
Lift/Carry: 7 (60 kg/40 kg)
Memory: 6
Nuyen: 45,555
== Priorities ==
Metatype: C - Human
Attributes: B - 20 Attributes
Special: E - Mundane
Skills: D - 22 Skills/0 Skill Groups
Resources: A - 450,000¥
== Attributes ==
BOD: 3
AGI: 6 (9)
REA: 5 (8)
STR: 1 (4)
CHA: 4
INT: 5 (6)
LOG: 1
WIL: 5
EDG: 7
== Derived Attributes ==
Essence: 0.04
Initiative: 10 (15) + 2d6
Rigger Initiative: 15 + 2d6
Astral Initiative:
Matrix AR Initiative: 15 + 2d6
Matrix Cold Initiative: 6 + DP + 3d6
Matrix Hot Initiative: 6 + DP + 4d6
Physical Damage Track: 10
Stun Damage Track: 11
== Limits ==
Physical: 7
Mental: 5
Social: 5
Securetech PPP: Arms Kit [-1] (Must be visible)
Securetech PPP: Legs Kit [-1] (Must be visible)
Astral: 5
== Active Skills ==
Etiquette : 1 Pool: 5
Intimidation : 1 [Physical] Pool: 5 (7)
Locksmith : 1 Pool: 10
Perception : 6 Pool: 12
Pistols : 6 [Revolvers] Pool: 16 (18)
Sneaking : 6 [Urban] Pool: 15 (17)
== Knowledge Skills ==
12 points of presumably cowboy related things
== Contacts ==
Gang Leader (4, 1)
Fixer (5, 2)
== Qualities ==
Agile Defender
Biocompatability (Cyberware)
Family Curse
Jack of All Trades Master of None
Perfect Time
Phobia (Uncommon, Mild) (Toxic Spirits)
SINner (National) (CAS)
Weak Immune System
== Lifestyles ==
Medium 1 months
== Cyberware/Bioware ==
Bilateral Coordination Co-processor - Alpha
Cerebellum Booster Rating 1
Datajack - Alpah
Muscle Replacement Rating 3 - Used
Reaction Enhancers Rating 3 - Used
Reakt
Reflex Recorder (Skill) (Pistols)
Smartlink - Alpha
Synaptic Acceleration
== Armor ==
Ares Victory: Big Game Hunter 16
+Custom Fit
+Gear Access
+Gel Packs
+Liner - Insulation (6)
+Thermal Damping 2
+Holster
Ares Victory: Wild Hunt 12
+Gear Access
+Liner - Insulation (6)
+Thermal Damping 2
+Holster
Bike Racing Helmet 2
+Gas Mask
+Single Sensor Rating 2
+Ultrasound
Securetech PPP: Arms Kit 1
Securetech PPP: Legs Kit 1
== Weapons ==
Grenade: Flash-Bang
Pool: 8 Accuracy: 7 DV: 10S (10m Radius) AP: -4 RC: 3
Grenade: Fragmentation
Pool: 8 Accuracy: 7 DV: 18P(f) (-1/m) AP: +5 RC: 3
Grenade: High Explosive
Pool: 8 Accuracy: 7 DV: 16P (-2/m) AP: -2 RC: 3
Ruger Super Warhawk
+Ammo Skip
+Custom Look
+Long Barrel
+Personalized Grip
Pool: 16 (18) Accuracy: 7 DV: 9P AP: -2 RC: 3
Ruger Super Warhawk
+Ammo Skip
+Custom Look
+Long Barrel
+Personalized Grip
+Smartgun System, Internal
Pool: 16 (18) Accuracy: 9 DV: 9P AP: -2 RC: 3
Unarmed Attack
Pool: 8 Accuracy: 7 DV: 4S AP: - RC: 3
== Commlink ==
Nixdorf Sekretar (ATT: 0, SLZ: 0, DP: 6, FWL: 2)
Transys Avalon (ATT: 0, SLZ: 0, DP: 6, FWL: 6)
+Add Module (Cyberdeck module) [Program Carrier]
== Gear ==
Ammo: Explosive Rounds (Heavy Pistols) x30
Contacts Rating 3
+Flare Compensation
+Image Link
+Vision Magnification
Earbuds Rating 3
+Audio Enhancement Rating 3
Fake SIN (Bobbi) Rating 4
+Fake License (Restricted Bioware License) Rating 4
+Fake License (Restricted Cyberware License) Rating 4
+Fake License (Military Armor License) Rating 4
+Fake License (Automatic Weapons License) Rating 4
Grenade: Flash-Bang
Grenade: Fragmentation
Grenade: High Explosive
Lockpick Set
Medkit Rating 6
Monocle Rating 4
+Thermographic Vision
+Vision Enhancement Rating 3
Restraint, Containment Manacles
Single Pack, Electronic Parts x2
Survival Kit
== Vehicles ==
GMC Sidewinder (SUV)
+Sensor Array Rating 2
MCT Fly-Spy (Minidrone)
+Sensor Array Rating 3
+Camera Rating 3
+Omni-directional Microphone Rating 3
+Laser Microphone Rating 3
+Directional Microphone Rating 3
+Motion Sensor Rating 3
+Olfactory Sensor Rating 3
+Atmosphere Sensor Rating 3
+Geiger Counter Rating 3
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Warhawk as a single weapon is nice...firing both of them, ummm, how often are you hitting with a 10DP assuming no negative modifiers?
Better off specializing in semi-automatics and using something w/BF to give the target a -2DP modifier to defense. Yes, less dmg potential but greater chance of doing damage in the first place.
What's the Military Armor License for? MilSpec armor are all F. Since there aren't any R rated Milspec armors this is a license for a category of none.
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I'd recommend going with Ambidexterity and the ammo select system to alternate between Warhawks. You still get the two-pistol shooter feel, but you don't gimp your dice pool and can have a ton of special ammo types available to you.
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Big Game Hunter Armor is considered impolite, so License. Before I tweaked the build for the OPs request of Dual Pistols it had Automatics. It also had a monowhip and a Hardwire for Perception, but I needed to fit in the Bi-lateral Co-processor so skills and 'ware got shuffled.
In general Dual weapons in 5th edition is fairly inefficient, but the OP said dual pistols so there you go. I don't have traditional Soaky tank lying around so I went with the high defense pool and not-quite-heavy-armor.
26? Dice of Defense tests while dodging should get him through a Saloon full of angry gunslingers.
Oh, and Motorcycle, spare SIN rating 4, and fully loaded Sleeping Tiger Armor should burn up the rest of the cash. Because chrome cowboys should have a steel horse. Spare SIN 'cause why not. And the third set of armor so you've got a Heavy load out, a sneaky load out, and a everyday load out. Why? Because you've got money to burn.
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I'd recommend going with Ambidexterity and the ammo select system to alternate between Warhawks. You still get the two-pistol shooter feel, but you don't gimp your dice pool and can have a ton of special ammo types available to you.
Bi-lateral Co-processor = Ambidexterity. Ammo Skip is the Ammo Select thingy. So... Check and Check ! : )
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I would prefer Restricted Armor Licence over Military Armor Licence...
but I guess that's quibbling...
and nobody likes a quibbler.
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Thanks so much, folks. Lots of excellent ideas here. Bilateral Coordination Co-processor is found in which book? I'm also struggling with finding Long Barrel and some others. I tend to use Chummer 5.
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Hard Targets for Long Barrel and B.C.Cp. Chummer 5.177 has them if you've updated recently.
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There is something weird about this math.
So agi 9 + skill 6(+spec)+reflex recorder= 9+8+1=18+ smartlink=20. Why does it say 18?
dual 10's is doable vs low prof ratings. Though Deputies might be better as they are not SS.
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The Taurus omni isnt the best revolver but you can switch between heavy pistol and light ammo for it I guess its a thought
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You really should look into something like the Fianchetti 100 Machine Pistol... just changing Hobbes build from pistols to auto and adding gas vent 4 and an extended clip you can 6 shot FA with both guns for a -1 DP modifier while giving both targets a -5 Defense Pool modifier...greatly increases the likelihood of hitting.
And face it, there will be a run sooner or later where pistol range is out of range...automatics let's you use an assault rifle when the pistol doesn't cut it.
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With edge 7 on a combat Sammie, I would find a way to fit revels in murder and daredevil if possible.
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Being a cowboy isn't about revolvers or even pistols. It especially isn't about using old fashioned weapons. Back in their day those were the best, but you bet they'd be using better guns if they were available.
That said I would use certain themes. Cowboys had a special bond with their horse. Yours will be a steel one, but you should love it all the same. Using the gecko grip mod from rigger 5.0 makes you able to go just about anywhere. Could be a fun one.
You want to be the full package. A cowboy should be able to hold his own with his fists, maybe a knife. From there you have you sidearm. Probably a pistol. Finally you have your big gun, you Winchester or double barrel death dealer. Maybe you need range or just more damage. Up to you how you pick it.
For cyber I reccomend jacking up your reaction. Passes help you kick ass while the raw stat is good for driving, dodging, and QuickDraw (always important for a cowboy).
Look at characters like Raylan Gibbons from Justified or Spike Speigal from Cowboy bebop for ways you can stay cowboy without needing a ten hallow hat, Spurs, and a six shooter.
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There is something weird about this math.
So agi 9 + skill 6(+spec)+reflex recorder= 9+8+1=18+ smartlink=20. Why does it say 18?
dual 10's is doable vs low prof ratings. Though Deputies might be better as they are not SS.
Chummer seems to not be calculating the Smartlink on the stat lines for the Guns. Odd, I thought it did that?
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With edge 7 on a combat Sammie, I would find a way to fit revels in murder and daredevil if possible.
Original build had R.i.M. OP said not too optimized and R.i.M. is the poster child of optimized.
Being a cowboy isn't about revolvers or even pistols. It especially isn't about using old fashioned weapons. Back in their day those were the best, but you bet they'd be using better guns if they were available.
That said I would use certain themes. Cowboys had a special bond with their horse. Yours will be a steel one, but you should love it all the same. Using the gecko grip mod from rigger 5.0 makes you able to go just about anywhere. Could be a fun one.
You want to be the full package. A cowboy should be able to hold his own with his fists, maybe a knife. From there you have you sidearm. Probably a pistol. Finally you have your big gun, you Winchester or double barrel death dealer. Maybe you need range or just more damage. Up to you how you pick it.
For cyber I reccomend jacking up your reaction. Passes help you kick ass while the raw stat is good for driving, dodging, and QuickDraw (always important for a cowboy).
Look at characters like Raylan Gibbons from Justified or Spike Speigal from Cowboy bebop for ways you can stay cowboy without needing a ten hallow hat, Spurs, and a six shooter.
Yeah, I didn't have that kind of build laying around and the OP wanted something more or less complete. I'll take a pass at something later today if I get time. I do like the Chrome Cowboy concept. The problem becomes limited skill and stat points to get the, as you call it, "full package". Can't do it under priority generation without leaving something important out.
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Chrome Cowboy Version 2. Just can't do it all. Need too many stats and skills. This one goes with Gun Kata so your melee weapon is a pistol. Longarms and Pistol skills give you a variety to pick from. Slightly faster, slightly more soak, much less dodge. Still needs bullets and a few more gun mods but you've got a few Nuyen and Karma to burn.
== Info ==
Movement: 18/36
Karma: 2
Human
Composure: 8
Judge Intentions: 10
Lift/Carry: 5 (30 kg/20 kg)
Memory: 4
Nuyen: 5925
== Priorities ==
Metatype: D - Human
Attributes: B - 20 Attributes
Special: E - Mundane
Skills: C - 28 Skills/2 Skill Groups
Resources: A - 450,000¥
== Attributes ==
BOD: 3
AGI: 6 (9)
REA: 5 (10)
STR: 2
CHA: 5
INT: 5
LOG: 1
WIL: 3
EDG: 5
== Derived Attributes ==
Essence: 0.03
Initiative: 10 (15) + 3d6
Rigger Initiative: 15 + 3d6
Astral Initiative:
Matrix AR Initiative: 15 + 3d6
Matrix Cold Initiative: 5 + DP + 3d6
Matrix Hot Initiative: 5 + DP + 4d6
Physical Damage Track: 10
Stun Damage Track: 10
== Limits ==
Physical: 6
Mental: 4
Social: 5
Custom Ballistic Mask [+2] (Only for intimidation, Must be visible)
Securetech PPP: Legs Kit [-1] (Must be visible)
Vashon Island: Sleeping Tiger [+1] (Must be visible)
Astral: 5
== Active Skills ==
Gymnastics : 1 (group skill) Pool: 10
Intimidation : 6 [Physical] Pool: 11 (13) +1 with custom pistols
Locksmith : 1 (karma) Pool: 10
Longarms : 6 [Shotguns] Pool: 15 (17)
Navigation : 1 (group skill) Pool: 6
Perception : 6 from Hardwire Pool: 11
Pilot Ground Craft : 1 (Karma) Pool: 11
Pistols : 6 [Revolvers] Pool: 16 (18)
Running : 1 ( group skill) Pool: 3
Sneaking : 6 [Urban] Pool: 15 (17)
Survival : 1 (group skill) Pool: 4
Swimming : 1 (group skill) Pool: 3
Tracking : 1 (group skill) Pool: 6
== Knowledge Skills ==
12 points of cowboy stuffs
== Qualities ==
Biocompatability (Cyberware)
Code of Honor: Avenging Angel
Distinctive Style
Impassive
Jack of All Trades Master of None
Perfect Time
SINner (National) (CAS)
== Lifestyles ==
low 1 months
== Cyberware/Bioware ==
Active Hardwires Rating 6
Bilateral Coordination Co-processor
Bone Lacing (Aluminum)
Datajack
Muscle Toner Rating 3
Reaction Enhancers Rating 3
Reflex Recorder (Skill) (Pistols)
Smartlink
Wired Reflexes Rating 2
== Armor ==
Custom Ballistic Mask 2
+Gas Mask
+Single Sensor Rating 3
+Ultrasound Rating 2
Securetech PPP: Legs Kit 1
Vashon Island: Sleeping Tiger 13
+Chemical Protection 1
+Custom Fit
+Fire Resistance 2
+Insulation 2
+Newest Model
+Nonconductivity 2
+Ruthenium Polymer Coating 3
+Thermal Damping 3
== Weapons ==
Ares Desert Strike
+Imaging Scope
+Shock Pad
+Stock
Pool: 15 Accuracy: 7 DV: 13P AP: -4 RC: 3
Mossberg AM-CMDT
+Smartgun System, Internal
Pool: 15 (17) Accuracy: 7 DV: 12P AP: -1 RC: 2
Ruger Super Warhawk
+Ammo Skip
+Custom Look
+Long Barrel
+Personalized Grip
+Smartgun System, Internal
+Speed Loader
Pool: 16 (18) Accuracy: 9 DV: 9P AP: -2 RC: 2
Ruger Super Warhawk
+Ammo Skip
+Custom Look
+Long Barrel
+Personalized Grip
+Smartgun System, Internal
+Speed Loader
Pool: 16 (18) Accuracy: 9 DV: 9P AP: -2 RC: 2
Unarmed Attack
Pool: 8 Accuracy: 6 DV: 4P AP: - RC: 2
== Martial Arts ==
Gun Kata
+Close Quarter Firearms (Pistols)
== Gear ==
Activesoft (Perception) Rating 6
Contacts Rating 3
+Low Light
+Flare Compensation
+Image Link
Crowbar
Earbuds Rating 3
+Audio Enhancement Rating 3
Fake SIN (Pat) Rating 4
+Fake License (Driver's License) Rating 4
+Fake License (Concealed Carry Permit) Rating 4
+Fake License (Restricted Cyberware License) Rating 4
+Fake License (Restricted Bioware License) Rating 4
Gecko Tape Gloves
Medkit Rating 3
Miniwelder
Monocle Rating 4
+Thermographic Vision
+Vision Magnification
+Vision Enhancement Rating 2
Survival Kit
Tool Kit (Locksmith)
== Vehicles ==
Harley-Davidson Scorpion (Chopper)
+Sensor Array Rating 2
If you could drop to Resources "C" you could go with Stats A, Skills B and get the do it all in a fight kinda build. I may have to try that next....
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What skills do you think need to be added?
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Would liked to have worked in a melee ability other than "shoot them in the face". Purely style reasons. Mechanically "shoot them in the face" gets the job done.
Standard melee build blues, needs moar stats, moar skills, moar 'ware, just to have a duplicate and less efficient way of dealing damage.
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Cool build, cool idea! I like the theme of it :)
One thing i noticed though: To use Wired Reflexes and Reaction Enhancers combined, you have to run them on WiFi. And i couldn't found any commlink in your list so far. Maybe you just forgot it. But keep in mind to buy the best firewall you can get, so the enemy hacker can't just fry your brain from down the road (or slave all your cyberware in your decker's PAN - not that i would recommand that either, if you don't trust him 100%...).
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The build still has money and karma left. Whatever Comlink the OP would want could be purchased. Personally I let the decker handle it when possible.
Honestly the best matrix defense is to leave wireless off until your first action, turning on wireless on all devices is a free action so.... meh.
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Thank you, folks. That character is pretty awesome, Hobbes. I like the majority of your choices, both mechanically and thematically. I keep wondering if there is any way to make The Cowboy Way into a viable build. Gun Kata is mechanically superior for this build. I get that, but I'm considering trying for a build that leans more towards bdyer's advice of maximizing edge usage... and then maybe I'd focus on called shots!?! That might let me take The Cowboy Way for good use. I'd be losing the ability to melee well with guns, I think, though, which is not at all ideal.
I realize that I can't have it all, but i"m still gonna try to reproduce the character in chummer and tweak it. I'll share it if I come up with anything.
Additional builds and advice are both extremely helpful.
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The build still has money and karma left. Whatever Comlink the OP would want could be purchased. Personally I let the decker handle it when possible.
Honestly the best matrix defense is to leave wireless off until your first action, turning on wireless on all devices is a free action so.... meh.
Turning everything off is a Free Action. There's nothing explicit in the core book that I can recall about turning everything on. The only thing that springs to mind is Change Device Mode, a Simple Action.
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The build still has money and karma left. Whatever Comlink the OP would want could be purchased. Personally I let the decker handle it when possible.
Honestly the best matrix defense is to leave wireless off until your first action, turning on wireless on all devices is a free action so.... meh.
Hm, I'm not sure. At chargen you can easily get a R7 Firewall. Nothing that will stop a decker from hacking you, but it will delay his actions. Turning your WiFi on as a Free Action is still a Free Action at the beginning of your Initiative Phase. This could be too late in a 4v4 stand and shoot. But i guess this is heavily dependant on your runner party, your 'ware and the type of enemy you're expecting to meet.
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The build still has money and karma left. Whatever Comlink the OP would want could be purchased. Personally I let the decker handle it when possible.
Honestly the best matrix defense is to leave wireless off until your first action, turning on wireless on all devices is a free action so.... meh.
Hm, I'm not sure. At chargen you can easily get a R7 Firewall. Nothing that will stop a decker from hacking you, but it will delay his actions. Turning your WiFi on as a Free Action is still a Free Action at the beginning of your Initiative Phase. This could be too late in a 4v4 stand and shoot. But i guess this is heavily dependant on your runner party, your 'ware and the type of enemy you're expecting to meet.
Change linked device mode is a free action.
Turning off wireless, it's no longer linked.
Changing device mode is a simple action.
Since everything's off and not linked, you have to turn them on one at a time.
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Change Linked Device Mode - Free action p. 163. Leave the Gun(s) Plugged in via the UDP, the Wired Reflexes and Reaction Enhancers are already plugged into your spine so I'd think those would count as Direct Neural Interface. YMMV. If the GM calls you've got to flip each one on individually then so be it. The bonuses to Initiative are retro active during the turn so you'll still get the initiative bonus when its all said and done. You'll have to decide between +2 smart link bonus and +2 Defense bonus during the first couple moments of a firefight if you get caught completely off guard. Annoying, but hardly critical. Again, Perfect Time for the Win when it comes to gunslingers.
I like to leave stuff turned off while sneaking. The chances of being spotted in AR are usually better than the meat suit getting spotted, unless your Decker has the bandwith to slave the teams gear. Once you go loud, flip everything on and go, presuming you've got decent matrix cover.
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yes, the wired reflexes or something that is plugged in to the datajack can be turned on at the same time as a free action... you're assuming that the word any is the same as the word all but let's not get into that.
You did however say everything...you have one datajack and more than one gun and presumably a commlink and whatever else you have that is off.
and once you turned on everything, you have to connect it to a PAN or it's easily bricked.
while I don't worry about the guns getting bricked...you can always take one off your disabled/dead opponent...a bricked wired reflexes is a bummer.
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You can slave things after the 3 to 6 seconds of shooting is done. Action economy is the bane of Deckers in combat. They'd have to be stopping whatever they're doing to make a matrix perception check to notice you turned on your devices, then start the Marking process. Since when you turn the devices on the gun bunny would be turning them on in silent running there isn't any kind of pop up alert for the enemy hacker. The enemy hacker would have to be foregoing whatever complex actions they were doing to be constantly Pinging for silent running icons. Seems unlikely when they're getting shot at.
But, IMO, if you don't have decent matrix cover, you just stay wireless off the whole time. Risk>Reward.
Also the UDPs don't say one way or the other how many devices can physically plug in. No reason you couldn't have some kind of hub to plug multiple devices into. The conservative RAW interpretation is one, but that seems unnecessarily restrictive given that you can have dozens of devices wirelessly connected. GM call, YMMV.
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Get a stealth dongle and run silent what you need or use a program module to slot a wrapper program, then make the things you want to hide look normal.
On a revolver I see no reason to go with wireless enabled unless you are using a smartgun, periscope, or ammo selection. If you plan to be in shitty areas, those wireless features may not even work (notice equal to device rating kills wireless functionality, FYI). Invest in noise cancelation devices if you plan to use wireless. Also, batteries. Electronics don't run on nothing. So of this is a gun you intend to leave sitting for a rainy day, don't count on it turning on with full power. Anyone with a game boy they haven't played in months can attest the battery is likely dead or almost dead when you turn it on. Not a great state of affairs on gear you are counting on. Of course, many GMs don't bother with this level of detail (but I'm a great nut, so...)
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You can slave things after the 3 to 6 seconds of shooting is done. Action economy is the bane of Deckers in combat. They'd have to be stopping whatever they're doing to make a matrix perception check to notice you turned on your devices, then start the Marking process. Since when you turn the devices on the gun bunny would be turning them on in silent running there isn't any kind of pop up alert for the enemy hacker. The enemy hacker would have to be foregoing whatever complex actions they were doing to be constantly Pinging for silent running icons. Seems unlikely when they're getting shot at.
But, IMO, if you don't have decent matrix cover, you just stay wireless off the whole time. Risk>Reward.
Also the UDPs don't say one way or the other how many devices can physically plug in. No reason you couldn't have some kind of hub to plug multiple devices into. The conservative RAW interpretation is one, but that seems unnecessarily restrictive given that you can have dozens of devices wirelessly connected. GM call, YMMV.
except the rules don't mention using hubs, so no. buy additional datajacks if you want- that's in the rules. if you want to houserule hubs- i don't see a problem. But that's a houserule and we're discussing what's applicable to most tables. The rest of this post- spot on.