Shadowrun
Shadowrun Play => Character creation and critique => Topic started by: nerankori on <02-24-17/0002:19>
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Shadowrun doesn't have a neat set of rules for someone being a full-body cyborg,so I tried to draft something up in Chummer.
In particular,I figure that the enhanced agility and strength from cyberlimbs should allow for a reasonable level of competence in physical combat and other such challenges,so the rest is invested into matrix stuff.
The concept for the character,broadly,is that of a corp scientist who became obsessed with creating a full cyborg body that could be mass produced or custom made,and marketed to both civilians and soldiers. So they embezzled both money and resources to experiment on themselves,and were publically shamed and dismissed when found out. Subsequently,they run in order to further their research,and refine the capabilities of the body they built for themselves. (This is the explanation for the choice of skills/knowledges)
The only thing not yet covered in the sheet is non-cyber gear.
That said,this is obviously a first draft,and it won't see use in a real campaign anytime soon,so I'd obviously want to hear your thoughts on refining it.
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B7bKsrZFgY3wbTNLVWJ3SXBpZms (https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B7bKsrZFgY3wbTNLVWJ3SXBpZms) (PDF)
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B7bKsrZFgY3waUJYWVRRMFdma00 (https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B7bKsrZFgY3waUJYWVRRMFdma00) (Chummer file)
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I did an outline of a cyborg body here as well https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1U2seEcVXFFPOuiiVPonvRT3ht6-LtAvALGRcwxx5oSw/edit#gid=0
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I did an outline of a cyborg body here as well https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1U2seEcVXFFPOuiiVPonvRT3ht6-LtAvALGRcwxx5oSw/edit#gid=0
I don't appear to have permission to access that doc,maybe you could set it to "hidden but can be seen by people with the link"
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https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1U2seEcVXFFPOuiiVPonvRT3ht6-LtAvALGRcwxx5oSw/edit?usp=sharing think this is assuming alpha ware and biocompatibility
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Nice document Rooks.
I was wondering about this, made a burnt out adept with all the cyber limbs/torso, grabbed a qi focus force 4, improved reflexes 1 (2) with it, etc. Came out to a lot cheaper vs synaptic and minus the skull, was pretty decent on essence at 2.x something.
Took mentor spirit Chaos as well for the +physical limit (adept) which I think most cyber torso/limbs have a tough time with? (unsure here, newbie at the system)
Mainly I wanted to use skimmers + wall running to just go super fast, and they were 'accident prone' and generally disliked vehicles in general as a theme. Came out to decent limits and dice pools, though the skills were a bit rough.
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If you wanted to play a full-body cyborg, why not be a rigger with an anthrodrone? Having an anthrodrone you're basically always rigging is surprisingly powerful... It's easy to have seriously high initiative (like 12+5d6) and the bonuses from a control rig make it hella intense. Your arms count as cyberlimbs for upgrades, and they still go as fast as cars for some reason. You're immune to Stun damage (and can wear armor, meaning a simple Armor Jacket can make you immune to anything smaller than an Assault Rifle). There's more benefits, I just can't think of any right this minute.
The main drawback is being able to be hacked, of course. But that's not as big a problem as it sounds. And, as long as you have a Garage asset as part of your Lifestyle, you don't have to spend as much money on repairing it.
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If you wanted to play a full-body cyborg, why not be a rigger with an anthrodrone? Having an anthrodrone you're basically always rigging is surprisingly powerful... It's easy to have seriously high initiative (like 12+5d6) and the bonuses from a control rig make it hella intense. Your arms count as cyberlimbs for upgrades, and they still go as fast as cars for some reason. You're immune to Stun damage (and can wear armor, meaning a simple Armor Jacket can make you immune to anything smaller than an Assault Rifle). There's more benefits, I just can't think of any right this minute.
The main drawback is being able to be hacked, of course. But that's not as big a problem as it sounds. And, as long as you have a Garage asset as part of your Lifestyle, you don't have to spend as much money on repairing it.
The main issues I thought about are 5e not having much stuff on anthrodrones yet,as well as perpetually still having a vulnerable meat body,instead of just adding all that ware and upgrades onto the characters "real" body. But yes,I agree that's one way to go about it.
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What else would you need besides what's in Rigger 5.0? And your "vulnerable meat body" could be miles away; even your own teammates might not know your actual location or what you look like. A rigger can easily get like... 6+ Noise Reduction; distance won't be an issue.
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What else would you need besides what's in Rigger 5.0? And your "vulnerable meat body" could be miles away; even your own teammates might not know your actual location or what you look like. A rigger can easily get like... 6+ Noise Reduction; distance won't be an issue.
I see,I haven't looked into Rigger 5.0 yet,I don't have access to many of the more recent materials. Thanks for bringing it up.
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Anthro drone is nice. Thought maybe a neoteny dwarf or gnome in a rigger cocoon could work possibly if you wanted to be closer. Could try and do the whole men in black or mecha thing
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To save you some trouble, Rigger 5.0 offers about five different anthrodrones and mentions a few extra features for them (all their limbs are drone cyberlimbs, and can be modified as such, anthrodrones have 8 + (1/2) BOD condition monitor boxes like metahumans, they can use metahuman equipment) as well as mods (drone-specific mods, and vehicle mods that drones can also get). Extra stuff for riggers in general too, like the Target Device action to increase your offensive dice pools even more.
The anthrodrones are the Criado Juan (a dirt-cheap, 8000 nuyen anthrodrone with poor stats), the Horizon Little Buddy (an even cheaper drone at 2000, the size of a five year old), the MCT Kenchiku-Kikai (20,000 nuyen; the size of an ork, used for industrial work and comes with both arms at 8 STR), the NeoNET Juggernaut (too rare to start with, but it's a heavily armored riot-control drone that comes with two weapon mounts for 100,000), there's the hard-to-pronounce "SAEDER-KRUPP DIREKTIONSSEKRETAR" who's name I just copy-pasted (40,000 nuyen, but it's buyable in chargen and has some solid stats like the highest Speed of all anthrdrones), and the Shiawase I-Doll (20,000; comes with Realistic Features upgrade to look more human, but not enough to fool anyone without more upgrades or full-body clothing).
A solid variety of choices.
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Nice document Rooks.
I was wondering about this, made a burnt out adept with all the cyber limbs/torso, grabbed a qi focus force 4, improved reflexes 1 (2) with it, etc. Came out to a lot cheaper vs synaptic and minus the skull, was pretty decent on essence at 2.x something.
Took mentor spirit Chaos as well for the +physical limit (adept) which I think most cyber torso/limbs have a tough time with? (unsure here, newbie at the system)
Mainly I wanted to use skimmers + wall running to just go super fast, and they were 'accident prone' and generally disliked vehicles in general as a theme. Came out to decent limits and dice pools, though the skills were a bit rough.
think this one is it https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1kOgvLrMEJ70S878h0XHphKc6NmarVKJeDwmMWQ3t3a4/edit?usp=sharing
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@Firebug I think the problem is the intent (full cyborg, usually a combat monster) vs rules (drones are hella fragile). Especially if you read the 'drones treat armor like clothing' strictly, even for anthro drones, to disallow armor or spending a lot of the mod points on armor or similar to get the same effect in a very fragile container. So unfortunately, even if you get the drone that works out well for recon, there's something much more satisfying for a PC to be in the thick of things usually.
@Rooks, nice document again. I still think an improved reflexes 1 + 1 from qi focus (8 karma + 12k nuyen) is the cheapest init upper rather than using synaptic booster 1 or 2 (190k/2k = 95 karma). Otherwise, I'd go full ware as well. Only need to keep 2 magic which is doable with an odd setup of Att E, Magic B, Resource A, Meta D, Skill C (doing this off memory) when I built it. Using the mentor spirit for +2 physical potential so your phys checks aren't anemic.
Just to clarify though, can you even take adapsin on creation? I am still a bit fuzzy on the rules.
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lol ya make your cybernetic body your qi focus
also theres a list of drones here
https://www.dropbox.com/s/8beo2cj953po35f/SR5%20TOOL%20Equipment%2C%20Drones%20%28buyable%29%2C%20Compiled%20List.pdf?dl=0
also theres a transys maid drone for like 8k in stolen souls for 12k you can get it to look human and wear an armored jacket (since it doesnt have any armor to begin with)
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Nice. Don't have that book. Does it bypass the uncanny valley or still always considered rigger inside the drone for the watlam check?
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@Firebug I think the problem is the intent (full cyborg, usually a combat monster) vs rules (drones are hella fragile). Especially if you read the 'drones treat armor like clothing' strictly, even for anthro drones, to disallow armor or spending a lot of the mod points on armor or similar to get the same effect in a very fragile container. So unfortunately, even if you get the drone that works out well for recon, there's something much more satisfying for a PC to be in the thick of things usually.
It has been stated by people who worked on Rigger 5.0 that anthrodrones can wear armor like people, however it does not stack with their (usually minimal) base armor because it's "not vehicle armor". As well, anthrodrones all have 8 + 1/2 BOD condition boxes and 4 cyberlimbs, meaning every anthrodrone has a minimum of 12 boxes. So, anthrodrones are not fragile at all actually. Yes, a PC with 20 armor will have a higher dice pool than a drone with 14, but that PC is not completely immune to Stun damage. Once you have enough armor to begin changing the majority of strikes to Stun, you're golden.
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Well according to Realistic Features:
This can range from a simple coating of realistic-looking skin
made from a synthetic material, to a full covering of living
tissue fed by an artificial circulation system with devices
to simulate organs. The realistic features mod has
a Rating of 1 to 4. The Rating sets the threshold of the
Perception Test to recognize the machine as artificial.
Assensing tests show it has no aura so...
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Meta [E] Human(1), Attributes 20, Magic [D] Adept, Skills [C] 28/2, Resources [A] 450,000
Initial attributes:
B5 A1 R5 S1 W5 L3 I5 C3
Qualities:
Restricted Gear (Adapsin) 10karma
Biocompatibility(cyberware) 5karma
Way of the Burnout 20karma(does not count towards positive qualities)
Redlinner 10karma
25 Karma worth of negative qualities.
Skills:
To be decided by player
Ess Cost
0.45 10000 Skull
0.9 20000 Torso
0.6 45000 Arm (Customized to 6) w/Redlinner 6[8]
0.6 45000 Arm (Customized to 6) w/Redlinner 6[8]
0.6 45000 Leg (Customized to 6) w/Redlinner 6[8]
0.6 45000 Leg (Customized to 6) w/Redlinner 6[8]
0.2 30000 Adapsin
0.8 190000 Synaptic Booster [2]
4.75 430000 Total
You'll have to fill the capacity of the cyberlimbs post-chargen with run money.
Of course, you could swap Synaptic Booster to Boosted Reflexes and use the savings
to start using up the capacity in chargen.
Your MR at this point is 0 w/a maximum of 1.
I'd spend that last 5 karma to increase MR to 1 and at least get Combat Sense [1].
So assuming you go with the Synaptic Booster you attributes look like:
BOD 5
AGI 1[3], Cyberlimbs 6[8]
REA 5[7]
STR 1[3], Cyberlimbs 6[8]
WIL 5
LOG 3
INT 5
CHA 3
ESS 1.25
EDG 3
PhyMon 9
StunMon 11
M-Limit 6
P-Limit 6
S-Limit 5
Post Chargen you can add +2 AGI/STR to each limb to get to 8[10].
The rules aren't clear on this but my assumption is the cyberlimb can't add the 3rd enhancement
to AGI or STR as humans are normally limited to 10… but that's for GM to decide.
Also note that the German Language rules has an optional rule that would allow you to use the
cyberlimbs AGI for movement and the STR for P-limit since all 4 limbs are cyber. Again, that's
for your GM to decide.
The reduced PhysMon due to Redlinner will eventually not matter much since you'll eventually add enough armor enhancement (which stacks with whatever your wearing) that usually you'll be taking stun damage more often than physical. A pain editor should be added as soon as possible before increasing your MR to 2 otherwise you'll lose the ess discount from Burnout.
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Way of the Burnout 20karma(does not count towards positive qualities)
Seriously? Because I read a Way as a positive Quality, even if it is odd and doesn't increase cost after chargen. Any support for that?
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Way of the Burnout 20karma(does not count towards positive qualities)
Seriously? Because I read a Way as a positive Quality, even if it is odd and doesn't increase cost after chargen. Any support for that?
RAW it's a positive quality because he forgot to write it explicitly in the section. However the freelancer Mystic has posted that RAI is that they do not count against positive limits.
http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=23294.0
Mystic confirms it in this thread but there is an earlier thread where he points it out that I can't find at the moment.
And I forgot Burnout is 15 points not 20...mea culpa
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Aha, thank you so much!
(*goes off to re-calculate several build ideas...*)
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@Firebug- Makes sense, eventually get enough armor, most things are stun, and it works out nice. The thing is... does your character actually work inside or closer to it? I think the main issue I had with riggers vs a cyborg character was them not being close enough to the action to help or always in the 'van'. Does Rigger cocoon fix this? or does it just look silly supposedly?
@Pap- Great build, that's basically what I did... if you save 1 essence due to not taking Synapse, you can get away with Improved Reflex 1, karma 8, 12k nuyen (qi focus) for the same bonus. Basically going magitech 'armor' or cyborgness. Also, that nuyen saved, you can do a lot more with it like increasing the limbs with the initial enhance, get a car and some weapons, slot in a cyberweapon, buy a R4 Fake SIN, etc. I actually did just a cybernetic license in that case, since, I carried no 'firearms' except in the arms, though unsure if that's legal?
edit: Nvm, I can't fit in the skull in the above build, but if you're willing to go partial or none, then it works out with some essence left over.
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@Firebug- Makes sense, eventually get enough armor, most things are stun, and it works out nice. The thing is... does your character actually work inside or closer to it? I think the main issue I had with riggers vs a cyborg character was them not being close enough to the action to help or always in the 'van'. Does Rigger cocoon fix this? or does it just look silly supposedly?
I assume you've never looked into drones before? Every drone has a sensor array installed; this is how they see and hear and everything. They aren't just little RC cars with guns attached. When a rigger jumps in to a drone via the matrix, they basically are that drone, and through its sensors can see and hear and do everything a metahuman can, possibly better (as the camera and mic can be modified). The rigger doesn't have to be close at all to help, they're doing everything through the drone. The rigger is the drone, the drone is in the action, helping.
A rigger cocoon is mainly intended for bigger vehicles, or if the rigger wants to use an offline, direct-connection via a data cable. It prevents hacking, but it stands out and doesn't make them immune to damage (so it's still possible for them to be hurt, just less likely).
Being potentially hacked is a fair concern, but there's ways to avoid it, and your team's hacker should be ready to deal with any enemy deckers as fast as possible, so pulling a Full Matrix Defense and biding time can work out for you. It's worth mentioning that being able to be hacked is, in my opinion, a fair trade for being completely immune to mana spells, which include spells like Stunbolt, Control Actions, Control Thoughts, Mind Probe, (Non-Improved) Invisibility, and so on. As well, you don't have an aura has some benefits.
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as an alternative in bullets and bandages theres a dust off drone its supposed to be for transporting patients in high risk areas but a lot of people use it for personal transport vehicles as it flies pretty sure you could slap on some drone limbs on it if you really wanted to
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@Pap- Great build, that's basically what I did... if you save 1 essence due to not taking Synapse, you can get away with Improved Reflex 1, karma 8, 12k nuyen (qi focus) for the same bonus. Basically going magitech 'armor' or cyborgness.
Background count will drop your Qi Focus below the rating needed to keep Improved Reflexes running. Also with a Magic of 1 you're going to have to be aware of Focus addiction tests, and you won't be able to use a Force 6 Qi Foci until after you raise your Magic anyway. Max Foci is Magic times 5, and Improved Reflexes 1 is a Force 6 Qi Foci.
Look at good ole Adrenaline Boost for your Adept PP, stacks with almost everything, even Boosted Reflexes.