Shadowrun
Shadowrun Play => Character creation and critique => Topic started by: Bladesworn on <02-13-11/2236:48>
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I'm thinking of creating a "Speedy/Arsenal/Red Arrow" type of shadowrunner. Young human guy who uses trick arrows and high tech gadgets and weapons. Now... for the combat/survival edge, which would be better, cyber or adept? I hear with Adept, it's better in the long-run as you can buy more powers, abilities, and grow a lot easier. With Cyber/Bio/Augmentation, you start off quicker with cool stats and other stuff, but as time goes on it's harder to improve upon those implants and the damage toll is worse.
With the character type, it seems cyber/bio/augmentation is the natural way to go with the gear dependence and gadgets... but I though I get everyone's opinion first.
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Best way to go is almost always to go for and adept with essence or 2 worth of ware.
That way you pretty much get the best of both worlds.
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Not what you're asking, but it occurred to me that this concept would make an intertesting hacker/technomancer. That way, some of the more cartoonish arrows would be possible in VR. 8) ?
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As far as theme goes, cyber sounds like a stronger fit to me.
As far as which is better, both can do the job pretty well, though Max is right: the strongest builds will likely be an Adept with a 1-2 point essence hole to fill with choice cyber. As you gain karma you build your Adept abilities, as you gain nuyen you yank out the old cyber and put higher grade and more in.
That said, consider some other things too. Like, does your GM use background counts rarely or frequently? By the writing in SM just being on a random street in a city is likely to have a BC of 1, so if your GM uses this often you may like full cyber.
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To me it just seems more like a mater of taste, both work well, just depends on if you wanna play a cybered up guy or a mystical archer type
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Thematically, Roy's much more of an Adept (despite his cocky demeanor, he's actually a fairly spiritual guy, and a very dedicated martial artist/athlete). Missile Mastery is right up his alley, Improved Ability (throwing, archery, unarmed, lots of 'em!), and anyone that starts out a comic book character "theme" is well served by several of the more generically physical Adept powers (to run, jump, sneak, etc).
If you wanted to keep with the recent grim, gritty, angsty, version of him since Rise of Arsenal (quite possibly the worst comics ever written), you could always make him an Adept with a point of Magic missing thanks to a big lame cyberarm he doesn't like. Roy's always been my number one dude in the whole DC universe...so I've got fairly strong opinions about the direction they've gone with him lately. >:(
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Thematically, Roy's much more of an Adept (despite his cocky demeanor, he's actually a fairly spiritual guy, and a very dedicated martial artist/athlete). Missile Mastery is right up his alley, Improved Ability (throwing, archery, unarmed, lots of 'em!), and anyone that starts out a comic book character "theme" is well served by several of the more generically physical Adept powers (to run, jump, sneak, etc).
If you wanted to keep with the recent grim, gritty, angsty, version of him since Rise of Arsenal (quite possibly the worst comics ever written), you could always make him an Adept with a point of Magic missing thanks to a big lame cyberarm he doesn't like. Roy's always been my number one dude in the whole DC universe...so I've got fairly strong opinions about the direction they've gone with him lately. >:(
I didn't read Rise of Arsenal myself, more of a Green Arrow fine then Roy myself
But yeah i think adept does fit better, just get lots of trick arrows :P
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I didn't read Rise of Arsenal myself...
For the love of God, don't ever change that.
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I didn't read Rise of Arsenal myself...
For the love of God, don't ever change that.
I just wish someone would have said that to me before I read countdown
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Rise of Arsenal is worse. It really is. It's worse than Countdown, worse than Ultimatum, worse than Brand New Day. It's worse than Civil War, worse than One Year Later, worse than Dark Knight Strikes Again. It's worse than Identity Crisis, Spider Man/Black Cat: Evil That Men Do, or Ultimates 3.
Honestly. And not just because I love(d) the character, either. It was just bad writing, coming several decades too late to be as "edgy" as it was desperately trying to be. I don't want to post spoilers in case you lose a bet and half to read it, or something, but let me know if you want them; I'll gladly spill details to keep someone away from this train wreck.
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Personnaly, I think that both have very similar capabilities, and the choice shall be defined by the "mood" or "style" that either option can give to the character.
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I would have to say adept for sure. Centering is crazy, add another (centering skill number here) dice as a complimentary skill to *first grade* stealth/athletics, *second grade* ranged weapons, and so on makes a great shot, or even Centering against penalties, such as injuries, vision, or cover will give you a couple extra successes. Make it a Zen like ability where the world seems to slow down around you *read as flavor text as centering is a free action* makes it a ton like green hornet (another cool gadget oriented guy). Attuning to your bow gives you a -1 T# to hit, which stacks with laser sights which some bows can mount. Step into the Magicians way with a level of Spell power will allow you to cast some before combat spells like armor or levitation. Magic loss can be off set with geise like being a vegitarian or an hour of meditation each morning.
cognition metamagic to reduce karma cost of skills by one, Infusion metamagic to pump up your known powers to higher levels, not to mention all the delightful powers like face sculp, kinesics, oh the list goes on. So yeah Adept for sure, add some bio like mnemonic enhancer and some cyber like a smartlink and you rock
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Centering isn't as good as people think it is. It takes a free action, and free actions are valuable. Centering negates your ability to charge so you are trading your charing +2 for your centering +X. It also negates your ability to use a Called Shot.
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Free actions are cool, but they're not terribly rare. Centering can be very, very, nice with the right other stuff going on in the same build.
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I'd still rather Called Shot for +4 DV usually.
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sure, but if you're suffering from visibity, wound, gas, or drug mods you can use centering to drop the T# back down making it easier to get successes
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And the Multi-tasking adept power gives you 2 free actions on every combat pass
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I'd still rather Called Shot for +4 DV usually.
Right...but who says you can't do both? ;D Sometimes (in instances like this) it can be worth it to just attack once, using a Simple as a Free. Using Adept Centering to (partially or wholly) negate the penalty for Calling a Shot, for instance, can make for some pretty nasty attacks.
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And the Multi-tasking adept power gives you 2 free actions on every combat pass
When not directly involved with combat, so not much of help in this situation.
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In state of the art 2064 it states
"Multi-tasking grants the adept the ability to gather information from multiple senses simultaneously and also to concentrate on two separate actions/thoughts at the same time. The adept may use two free actions per initiative phase."
sounds like centering and calling a shot isn't out of the question.
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In state of the art 2064 it states
"Multi-tasking grants the adept the ability to gather information from multiple senses simultaneously and also to concentrate on two separate actions/thoughts at the same time. The adept may use two free actions per initiative phase."
sounds like centering and calling a shot isn't out of the question.
SotA 2064 is nine years out of date in-game, and seven years (and an edition) behind out-of-game. Many of us are talking SR4, not SR3, and the most recent version of Multi-Tasking specifically does not give the extra Free Action in combat (sadly).
Centering works differently, as well, since the core mechanic no longer allows for directly affecting the target number of a roll. Instead of making a shot easier (always lowering the TN), it makes a shot less hard (by letting you ignore some penalties) -- a small distinction, maybe, but an important one. For Centering to do you any good, you have to have some penalties to face in the first place...but ignoring them can make for some awesome shots. :)
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Given the way the recoil rules work, it's pretty easy to always have some penalties to ignore.
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Given the way the recoil rules work, it's pretty easy to always have some penalties to ignore.
Thats what the recoil compensation is for, no need to use centering to reduce recoil penalties.
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Given the way the recoil rules work, it's pretty easy to always have some penalties to ignore.
Thats what the recoil compensation is for, no need to use centering to reduce recoil penalties.
But you can use centering to reduce the penalties from other things such as vision modifiers