Shadowrun
Shadowrun General => General Discussion => Topic started by: Antique on <08-26-19/1333:23>
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So, am I missing something?
Just bought the pdf and been reading the rules.
And it look like without spending edge it is impossible to kill an average unarmored john doe in a single attack?
A heavy pistol as DV4, max for an assault rifle is DV5. A fireball lobbed by a Magic 6 mage is DV3 unless he is increasing drain.
So against body 3 it takes 7 net hits on average (6 on assault rifle, less on full auto) on the attack to kill the John doe.
So 21 dice pool needed to shoot to kill...
With a burst fire a handgun need 5 net hits so you only need 19 dice pool.
In brief, one shot one kill is impossible, baring incredible luck or spending all your edge.
Am I missing a rule that prevent that?
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The DVs are lower, but soak is just Body now. Average Joe Schmo will be trying to soak with 2 or 3 dice, so there's a good chance he'll eat most of the damage. A full-auto burst can be split into two semi-auto bursts, and as far as I have read there is nothing preventing both bursts from going at the same target. So two DV 6 (+ net hits) bursts against a soak pool of 3 means they will be pretty dead.
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There's optional rules for weaker grunts that can apply to civvies.
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No you are not missing something. It was one of my issues with the system as described. You need absurd die pools to drop someone instantly without edge or optional rules.
While I kind of like the reduced base damage as incredibly high base damages make flesh wounds almost impossible without tank armor. It does have some negatives as well. I think if damage increased by 2dv per net hit it might work out better but allow armor to soak. That way a highly skilled operative has a decent chance to one shot a mook without blowing edge on what should be a trivial task.
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In addition to multiple attacks on the same target, Semi Auto will add +1 DV or Burst Fire can add +2 DV, Explosive rounds are +1 DV, Called Shot is -4 Dice and +2 DV, plus the Edge actions.
So Ares Predator, Burst Fire, Explosive Ammo, Called Shot, is 8 DV total at - 4 Dice. Should be a one shot kill, vs a random wage slave.
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If you have a guy tied up in a chair and you put a gun to his head and pull the trigger.. he's just dead.
But yes, in actual combat situations, it's kind of hard to eliminate someone in one shot. (but not really, if you have 2 edge available for a knockout blow...)
It's supposed to be the point. Combat's meant to be something of an interactive back and forth to at least SOME degree, rather than a game of Rocket Tag.
That way a highly skilled operative has a decent chance to one shot a mook without blowing edge on what should be a trivial task.
Again, via Knockout Blow a skilled operative is just one shotting rather reliably. Probably even trivially. This is what Edge is FOR. The action only costs 2 Edge... aren't you one of the people who say Edge gain is so easy you're always getting 2 edge/round and therefore the cap should be higher?
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If you have a guy tied up in a chair and you put a gun to his head and pull the trigger.. he's just dead.
But yes, in actual combat situations, it's kind of hard to eliminate someone in one shot. (but not really, if you have 2 edge available for a knockout blow...)
It's supposed to be the point. Combat's meant to be something of an interactive back and forth to at least SOME degree, rather than a game of Rocket Tag.
That way a highly skilled operative has a decent chance to one shot a mook without blowing edge on what should be a trivial task.
Again, via Knockout Blow a skilled operative is just one shotting rather reliably. Probably even trivially. This is what Edge is FOR. The action only costs 2 Edge... aren't you one of the people who say Edge gain is so easy you're always getting 2 edge/round and therefore the cap should be higher?
Yup. There are some positives to this system and overall I like the lowered damage for this. It just has odd interactions at certain ends of the spectrum.
But I think Hobbes just displayed that with enough system mastery it may end up being more rocket tag like. That isn’t super min maxed build issues it’s just basic combat decisions getting the base damage up really high given the low soak pools.