Shadowrun
Shadowrun General => General Discussion => Topic started by: Raithe on <03-24-11/0928:33>
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I was perusing SR Attitude the other night and a rather random thought struck me..
Over the last decade now the Stage/Street magician, the grand illusionist and such have all been quite the hit in popular culture. But what on earth do you think actually happens to that profession/life calling when the world suddenly discovers real magic in Shadowrun?
Does it fade away under the harsh lights and the Awakened spark of real levitation, magical pyrotechnics and the like? Does sleight of hand and cunning technical ability with non-magical illusions linger on?
I mean, can you imagine the likes Pen & Teller or David Copperfield having to compete against people who can become invisible, throw flames around a stage, levitate objects around and stage and actually read the thoughts of the audience?
You have these groups of old-school Magicians.. the Magic Circle and such-like... Passing tricks and traditions down to promising kids.. with influence and contacts all over the place. Can you imagine how well they might have survived into the awakened world? Would people forget about simple sleight of hand tricks and technical illusion? Or would they have to adapt and get showmanship inspired awakened mages brought into the fold? Combining technical wizadry with "real" illusion? Or just left as this embittered tradition taking its last breaths as the world moves on?
Heh, or the bunch of runners caught up against someone they think is an actual mage so they take what precautions they can..but never realise he's just an incredibly talented sleight of hand artist with some tech gimmicks..
Either way, is that anything people have had thoughts over or might get some inspiration to consider..
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"Significantly advanced technology my Hoop! Any significantly advanced magic is indistinguishable from technology!"
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Well, Real Magic doesnīt work that well on screen, IIRC. So at least thereīs still room for stage magic.
And really, the number of people doing actual magic on the streets for everyone to see are close to nil (like, 1% of the population, and even then most are adepts or limited magicians). When noone around knows what a real magician looks like itīs probably a sweet career posing as one, doing parlour tricks for your income.
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Actually, Stage Magic popularity could possibly increase in such a scenario:
A) Stage Magic is not just about the trick, it's about the entertainment. Penn and Teller aren't just talented pretidigitators, they're also professional entertainers. As such, you need more than just the Talent...you'd actually need some, well, talent :)
B) A stage magician can perform 100 tricks in an hour (depending on your definition of a 'trick') Let's say that boils down to maybe 10 decent tricks replicatable by magic. That would still require some decent drain/sustaining capability, without the mage getting any rest time
C) Actual mages represent this tiny fraction of the population, and can command a great deal of money from any number of secure, ongoing sources. Therefore, it would only be a tiny fraction of that tiny fraction whom would even consider such a career, so it's hardly going to kill the vaudeville industry
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I can see it being part of some acts, too; Spray FAB around, just to prove you're not using Magic.
EDIT: "Nothing up my sleeve, and poof, nothing in my Astral plane."
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I've been working on ideas for a "Shadows of Winnipeg" thoughts (Seeing as that's where I live now), and mentioned Free Spirit Buskers. I'm sure they'd be very popular, and it's not like they need the money they'd make off doing their acts. They'd probably keep it, but still...
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I've been working on ideas for a "Shadows of Winnipeg" thoughts (Seeing as that's where I live now), and mentioned Free Spirit Buskers. I'm sure they'd be very popular, and it's not like they need the money they'd make off doing their acts. They'd probably keep it, but still...
There is definitely the option for that to happen :)
But the thought of free spirit buskers (Plural) is a concerning statistic.
A) Only free spirits who take the Realistic form power can manifest as a normal person (without betraying their true nature by a glowing aura or somesuch). How open are these free spirits supposed to be?
B) Only free spirits with an interest in Musical arts (and having spent Karma to learn the skills) would care. This is an assumed small subsection of the population
Any one free spirit doing anything? Yep, completely open to that.
But given the dramatically low population of Free Spirits in the SR4 world, I just find it tricky to rationalise any group of them banding together for any reason (let alone at a Jam session :P )
Of course, it would be awesomely cool ;D
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Winnipeg has a major spiritualist part to it's culture that I've noticed. I don't even think the natives know how far it goes, so Free Spirits are fairly free to go around in Winnipeg as long as laws aren't being broken.
Also, I figure that "The Forks Market" would have a strong positive emotional environment to it, which leaks into the Astral Plane, and attracts Free Spirits. I certainly feel it around the place, it's a very calming and soothing place, yet ancient and... Hard to describe in words. Timeless is the best I can use to describe it, despite the combination of old and new buildings, I wouldn't be surprised if I walked around a corner and saw some classic (New France Colonial Era!) Voyageurs looking around for some tanned skins.
That said, Free Spirits aren't recognized legally in any way, so they have freedom, but no protection either. On the flipside, they don't have to pay the Busker Fee.
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Winnipeg has a major spiritualist part to it's culture that I've noticed. I don't even think the natives know how far it goes, so Free Spirits are fairly free to go around in Winnipeg as long as laws aren't being broken.
Also, I figure that "The Forks Market" would have a strong positive emotional environment to it, which leaks into the Astral Plane, and attracts Free Spirits. I certainly feel it around the place, it's a very calming and soothing place, yet ancient and... Hard to describe in words. Timeless is the best I can use to describe it, despite the combination of old and new buildings, I wouldn't be surprised if I walked around a corner and saw some classic (New France Colonial Era!) Voyageurs looking around for some tanned skins.
That said, Free Spirits aren't recognized legally in any way, so they have freedom, but no protection either. On the flipside, they don't have to pay the Busker Fee.
Noted and noted. I didn't know anything about Winnipeg per se, was just commenting on the nature of spirits populations in the SR4 universe.
However as you said, if it's got a good vibe, the percentages of Free Spirit visitors would certainly get skewed into a plural direction. Sounds groovy.
Note: Yes, while they'd be immune to the busker fee, they'd also have very fee options to receive/store the cash. Spirits can't see AR or digital displays (and my GM in particular is quite strict about enforcing the fact) so even seemingly trivial transactions are a lot harder for free spirits....
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Always, good, old fashioned, UCAS$.
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Always, good, old fashioned, UCAS$.
And manifested Pockets? :P
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Then again, who says they're doing it for cash? Positive emotions are their own reward at times... Or perhaps they lust after other things?
In my first piece of fan fiction, the Free Spirit (Who is from Winnipeg, BTW), has a major desire for Coffee. Real Coffee, not the fake stuff.
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Then again, who says they're doing it for cash? Positive emotions are their own reward at times... Or perhaps they lust after other things?
In my first piece of fan fiction, the Free Spirit (Who is from Winnipeg, BTW), has a major desire for Coffee. Real Coffee, not the fake stuff.
I read that one. I liked that little addiction :)
Further, there's another piece of Free Spirit fan fiction there *cough* mine *cough*. While positive emotions can indeed be they're own reward.... spirits want Karma. It's they're own default addiction :D
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Yeah, it's kind of hard to get humans to give that up. The description can kind of squick most people...
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Yeah, it's kind of hard to get humans to give that up. The description can kind of squick most people...
In game last night, the Free Spirit raised Magic so had to take on another member in the Friendship spirit pact. After scoping out fellow PC's, made the offer to the very min-maxed (and veteran player) physad who jumped at the chance.
His first comment: So, how much Karma do you need?
Free Spirit: Urm :o *twitch* You're a mate, so just whatever you can spare. I'll take as much as you'll give, but don't tease me, or I'll drain everything you have (mostly bluff, just trying to make a point).
Phys-Ad: How about 1-2 per run?
Free Spirit: *cough* :o ??? Errr, sure :o That would be fine ;D ;D ;D
Free Spirit side-thought: Must learn Power Pact to start handing out powers for more karma....
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Oh great, he's mainlining Karma. Do you know how bad an addiction that is?
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Oh great, he's mainlining Karma. Do you know how bad an addiction that is?
Yes, Yes I do :o
I actually had to re-spec the PC once before as it originally had the Life Pact power, and had negotiated a web of NPC's in dangerous occupations, who required ongoing access to healing.... in exchange for instant karma
There was terrible abuse potential there, so kind GM got me to respec without that Pact option. Although, if this PC ever goes rogue NPC, that Pact is back in play, and uber-cheese-monster power-levelling will ensue... 8)
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Heh, well I was also trying to think about just how the public perception would be these days.
I mean, if you know real magic exists, will "simple" prestidigitation still impress and draw crowds?
Will people find it as entertaining or consider it even better that people can pull off these tricks without resorting to magic? In the jaded and cynical SR world, would people still find the wonder and illusion in a good stage act?
Or maybe I've just been catching too much of The Cape on tv and thinking the fun effects of smoke pellets and triggered Invisibility spells would look like...
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Heh, well I was also trying to think about just how the public perception would be these days.
I mean, if you know real magic exists, will "simple" prestidigitation still impress and draw crowds?
Will people find it as entertaining or consider it even better that people can pull off these tricks without resorting to magic? In the jaded and cynical SR world, would people still find the wonder and illusion in a good stage act?
Or maybe I've just been catching too much of The Cape on tv and thinking the fun effects of smoke pellets and triggered Invisibility spells would look like...
Again, I think this stuff will be as popular, if not more.
The flashy stage magic will still be impressive, as these people are entertainers. Will audiences be more jaded and cynical? Sure. But even so, they would still pay to watch a real magician (as unlike in a shadowrunner group, awakened metahumans are really, really rare :), and a prestidigitation performer will (as suggested by others) use FAB bacteria or something else to verify no actual magic (<cue creepy voice to audience> '...as you understand it...') is being performed
It's a show, and it will evolve. People still want to be entertained, and so the show will go on :)
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*Sings "The Show Must Go On" in the key of off*
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*Sings "The Show Must Go On" in the key of off*
*plugs ears*
Singing lessons...please...we're begging you...
Edit: Or a muzzle? :P
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Good luck trying to muzzle me. :P
Yes, slight of hand is not going anywhere as a major part of it is showmanship. Distraction is the name of the game, and to do that, you have to read your audience to know how to do it best.
Journeyman Entertainer here. ;D
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Journeyman Entertainer here. ;D
I would have guessed that....
Under old ED rules though, isn't Journeyman for Circles 4-8?
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No, I mean IRL, I have my Journeyman's Papers in a form of Entertainment.
Puppeteering to be exact, with experience in Black Light, Muppets, and Full-Body Puppets.
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No, I mean IRL, I have my Journeyman's Papers in a form of Entertainment.
Puppeteering to be exact, with experience in Black Light, Muppets, and Full-Body Puppets.
At which point, if you can't at least sing 'Rainbow Connection' in the key of Kermit, you should hand those papers back in....
I'm just sayin'....
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Here's a hint: A lot of puppets lip sync. I used to be pretty good at, "It's not easy being green", however.
Used to be quite the singer as well, baritone. "Coming somewhere from the lower-levels of hell, you're so deep" as one person put it. But out of practice now.
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Here's a hint: A lot of puppets lip sync.
Noooooo! They make it look so natural! :-\
next you'll tell me the Cookie Monster doesn't actually EAT the COOKIES! :o
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Used to be quite the singer as well, baritone. "Coming somewhere from the lower-levels of hell, you're so deep" as one person put it. But out of practice now.
The tenors woo the ladies, but the basses take them home.
Which puts us baritones doing what, getting their coats?
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We're lucky if we even get to hold onto the coats. :'(
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Used to be quite the singer as well, baritone. "Coming somewhere from the lower-levels of hell, you're so deep" as one person put it. But out of practice now.
The tenors woo the ladies, but the basses take them home.
Which puts us baritones doing what, getting their coats?
We're lucky if we even get to hold onto the coats. :'(
And we poor Countertenors? Don't ask...just don't ask....
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And we poor Countertenors? Don't ask...just don't ask....
What? You're still here? :P
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And we poor Countertenors? Don't ask...just don't ask....
I always assumed Countertenors were from a "Mirror, Mirror" like universe and you slipped back to your home dimension after rehearsal.
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And we poor Countertenors? Don't ask...just don't ask....
I always assumed Countertenors were from a "Mirror, Mirror" like universe and you slipped back to your home dimension after rehearsal.
We don't like to talk about it much....
But when female sopranos are querying your range, you know there's an issue...