Shadowrun

Shadowrun Play => Character creation and critique => Topic started by: Rockopolis on <05-07-11/1642:40>

Title: Mentat
Post by: Rockopolis on <05-07-11/1642:40>

Apparently I find character creation to be relaxing, so I've been working on a Mentat in my head.  It's actually an extension of a different, fairly Mary Sue-ish concept, "Sho-Chan", but I've stripped out and upgraded the Logic out the wazoo.

I've got the crazy logic after boosting, but that's about it.  I need a character to go with, and a motivation.  Or an idea of what the heck I'm going to do with 12 logic.  I guess some kind of hacker is the obvious choice.

Uh, I'll post this now and be right back, but I should drop the Dynomatin and Qualia if this is focusing on Logic alone.  And look into Nanotech.

---

161BP
120BP and 201500¥ (41BP) 200¥ for a shot of Psyche (25 hits/BP)...I think I did the math right.
11 Logic, +1 Logic from Psyche.  +1 to Logic linked Active Skills.  +1 to Cracking and Electronics.  +2 to MATH! and Electronic Warfare coding/decoding.  +1 to Logic linked skill tests.

35 BP of Qualities
Exceptional Logic
Genetic Heritage
Restricted Gear I

'ware: 201500¥, 2.775 Essence (might be able to toss in the Attention Coprocessor and Orientation System, might drop the Encephalon if BP are tight)
Genetic Optimization (Logic)
Cerebral Booster III
PuSHeD   12000
Qualia   20000
Dynomatin
Sleep Regulator
Encephalon II
Math SPU

85 points for 8 Logic

200 ¥ for a hit of Psyche (eight hours of +1 Logic and +1 Intuition)

---

Using the German Karma Creation System

Name: Ælfreda the Green, Ælfreda Haraldsdotter
Alias: Mint (irritating, familiar), Sho-Chan (irritating, familiar)
Race: Elf
Sex: Female
Lifestyle: Middle, Custom
Karma Spent: 750
Physical Description: Tall, skinny, green elf.  Green quiff, whenever it's not matted down under a helmet or hat.  Always wears a bandanna, of varying style.  Alternates between wearing a suit, camouflage fatigues, or chainmail as the mood takes her.
Her avatar is often something incredibly generic or off the rack, but when it's not, it's often a abstracted female face with glowing, pulsing veins running through it.
Personality/background She's somewhat arrogant, rather more ambitious, and although she's quite intelligent, she's actually kind of naive.  She's young, especially for an elf.  It's hard to tell if she's entirely sane, living in a fantasy, or just happens to dig the feudal lord chic.
For her Shadowrunning is an adventure, a means to self-improvement, and most importantly, lucrative.
Given how augmented she is, she must have been the daughter of someone important, but she left Tir under inadequately explained circumstances, and now runs, or at least manages, a commune out in the wilds/barrens; a very strange, very feudal commune.  Humoring her beats living in the rest of the barrens, though, and it seems to be surviving, if not exactly thriving.  Yet.
Her hobbies include weaving, world domination, and collecting information; datasofts, knowsofts, mapsofts, whatever.  She does have a very protective streak, amplified by the effects of her symbiosis.  Currently, her strongest desire is probably to fix the damn roof.

Attributes

Body	Agility	Reaction	Strength
2	29!	3	3
Charisma	Intuition	Logic	Willpower
3	4	9!	4
Edge	Magic	Essence	Initiative
2	4	4.6	7, 1 Pass

Positive Qualities
Low Light Vision (Elf)
Exceptional Logic
Adept
SURGE II

• Improved Logic
  Symbiosis

Negative Qualities
Third Eye
Day Job II (herding peasants, pushing the Wheel of Pain, guarding the truck, bossing people around)
Dependent I
Mild Psyche Addiction
In Debt I (always something else that needs to be paid for)

Active Skills

Electronics Skill Group	1
Cracking Skill Group	2
Influence Skill Group	1
Athletics Skill Group	1
Outdoors Skill Group	1
Mechanic Skill Group	1
Biotech Skill Group	1
Automatics	2
Blades	2
Pilot Groundcraft	1
Arcana	1
Enchanting	1
Artisan	1

Knowledge Skills

Genetic Engineering	1
Math	2
Ecopolitics	1
Area Knowledge Seattle	3
Headware	2
Local Gangs	2
The Ancients	1	Because every elf knows all about the Ancients :P
Elven Conspiracy Theories	1
Performance Enhancing Pharmaceuticals	1
Heraldry	1
Political Theory	1
Early Middle Ages European History	1
Tactics	1
Botany	1
Weaving	1
Apiculture	1

Language Skills

Sperethiel	N
English	5
Latin	1

Adept Powers

Power	Cost	Notes
Astral Sight	1	Need to pick up Assensing
Multitasking	.5	Supernaturally good at multitasking
Sustenance	.25	Need three hours of sleep and one meal a day.  No discounted Lifestyle
Linguisitcs	.25	Learns languages quickly and cheaply
Eidetic Sense Memory	.5	Remembers everything, with perfect recall
Mind Over Matter	1.5	Analytical Motion

Cyber/Bioware

Cyberware/Nanoware	Essence	Cost	Notes
Math SPU	0.15	4500¥	+2 to MATH!
Attention CoProcessor III	0.3	9000¥	+3 Perception
Orientation System	0.2	1250¥	Never get lost.  +2 to Navigation
Bioware/Geneware	Essence	Cost	Notes
Genetic Optimization (Logic)	0.2	45000¥	XXXXX
Genewipe	0.2	45000¥	XXXXX
PuSheD	0.1	15000¥	XXXXX
Qualia	0.4	25000¥	XXXXX
Dynomatin	0.2	25000¥	XXXXX
Vegsin	0.1	15000¥	XXXXX
Digester Symbiont	0.2	2000¥	XXXXX
Chloroplast Skin	-	2000¥	XXXXX
Silky Skin	-	1500¥	XXXXX

Custom Lifestyle; Ælfreda's Fief (4500¥, though with lots of roomates serfs)

C2E2N3N1S3

Easy Going Landlord, Feng Shui, Friendly Neighbors, Homegrown Farming, Rad Pad, Workplace, Living By Committee, Network Bottleneck, Black Hole I, Poor Condition, Worse Neighbors, Security Conscious, Green Plan

It has a kicking rad mead hall.  The rest of it looks like a farm, or a ranch.  Reasonably self sufficient, they seem to make slightly more than they expend, and are thus solvent.  Always seems to be in need of repairs or additional backbreaking labor.

Gear (255000¥)
Psyche
Slab
G3
Oxygenated Fluorocarbons
Biomonitor
Medkit VI
Medkit Suppiles
Middle Lifestyle
Fake SIN IV
DocWagon Basic 1 Year

Contact Lenses III
Image Link
Flare Compensation
Glasses IV
Image Link
Smartlink
Vision Enhancement III
Vision Magnification
Earbuds II
Audio Enhancement III
Select Sound Filter III
Microphone I
Spatial Recognizer

Synergist Longcoat
Form Fitting Armor Half Body
Form Fitting Armor Shirt
Chain Shirt
Globetrotter Heavy Armor Clothing
Globetrotter Fatigues
Industrious Jumpsuit

Automotive Kit
Suzuki Mirage

Operations Cleanup Kit

Hermes Ikon
Novatech Navi
Customized Interface
Sim Module
Mapsoft VI
Skinlink
Nanopaste Trodes
Simrig
Tactical Software 2
FTL Matrixware Power Suite
Stealth IV

Monofilament Sword
Personalized Grip
Gecko Grip
Ingram Smartgun X
Personalized Grip
Gecko Grip

Vehicles
Suzuki Mirage

Handling	Accel	Speed	Pilot	Body	Armor	Sensor	Availability	Cost
+2	20/50	200	1	6	4	1	-	6500¥

Contacts Contact C/L Thanes and Churls! Group(S1/L1/M1/M1) 4+1/6 At this point, they range from being moderately useful, and freeloaders. ShadowSEA(S2/L2/M1/M1) 6+4/1 She has an account, and has posted a few times, but that's about it. Karma Totals:  750 = 30 + 70 -70 + 434 + 105 + 56 + 100 + 15

Title: Re: Mentat
Post by: Glyph on <05-07-11/1741:18>

I'm not sure how you feel about SURGE - it could either be cheesy, or it could help the concept, if you want to give him a bit of an alien/different/freakish feel.  But getting SURGE II and taking metagenetic improvement to Logic would save you 20 build points - 10 because SURGE II is 10 points cheaper than exceptional attribute, and 10 because the SURGE quality actually gives you a bonus point, so getting Logic: 8 would only cost 75 points, not 85 points.

If you want playability advice, I would say that absolutely hard-maxing Logic is great for a dice pool exercise, but not so great for creating a character that is actually fun to play.  Especially if you plan on playing a hacker - a good commlink and utilities are a hefty chunk of your resources at char-gen.  Hackers are good, though.  Keep in mind, your Logic will only really come into play for things like programming or tinkering with electronics.  Hacking is skill plus program (unless your GM house rules otherwise).  The other main roles that I can think of are tinkerer (armorer, chemistry, etc.), or street doc - or maybe even both, if you really concentrate on Logic skills.

Another thing to contemplate would be making him an adept.  That's what I do for most mentat-type builds.  There are so many good powers - analytics, eidetic sense memory, enhanced perception, linguistics, and multi-tasking are all good for making a character with a superhuman intellect.  And the best part is that these powers are comparatively cheap, so you can still get an optimal assortment of 'ware to go with it.

Title: Re: Mentat
Post by: Rockopolis on <05-07-11/1916:57>

Hmm...didn't really think about SURGE.  It does have that cheesy taint to it, but it could be helpful.  Might be a (weak) way to explain why they're Shadowrunning instead of sitting in a palace making megabucks (or gigabucks).
A cephalopoidal skull would kick ass, though.  Hopefully the kind with the big clear tank for the brain sticking out of their head.  Maybe a third eye, too, for extra symbolism.  I suppose Astral Hazing would be a reason to keep moving, if rather disruptive to a game.  Can you imagine trying to get past a check point?  "Person, magician, person, person, ARGH!"

Adept+Augmentation always seemed kinda cheesy to me...made me feel like a Munchkin.  I'll look into Adept though, maybe put together an Adept or Mystic Adept (Logic drain attribute, totally)...I guess it just feels like picking up some nifty (though not really related) tricks on the cheap, you know, for a magician who's ~46% manufacutred.  Latent Awakening, is a possibility, I suppose, though I'm not sure anything would surprise this character "Interesting, I appear to have acquired magical abilities.  Unusual, but within parameters.".
I'd have a max Magic of three, though, plus Initiation...it just seems, if you're going to do this, why have you Awakened?
Multitasking and Analytics are obvious little bonii.  Eidetic Sense Memory is cool, if not as necessary with a Sim Module and Knowsofts.  I love Sustenance, and Nerve Strike sounds cool.
...Now I've segued into the idea for a Way of the Tree SURGE adept, with Photometabolism and Rooting.

I could see leaving the potential but not spending the last fifteen or twenty-five points on Logic, maybe picking it up later...leave out the Exceptional Attribute and pick it up later if I want to hardmax her later.  That seems like a bit of a stubborn waste, I guess.

The only reason I could think of for adventuring is to dig out the cliche Amnesia.  That gets used to explain everything.  Only I'm not sure it'd work on someone like this.

EDIT:  Hmm...testing out an Adept build, don't really have enough points (BP or maximum Magic) for a Mystic Adept, I think.

Title: Re: Mentat
Post by: Makki on <05-07-11/1934:37>

in case of Adept, you NEED Mind over Matter from War! Let's you replace all Agi tests with your Logic attribute.

Title: Re: Mentat
Post by: Ten-Hex on <05-07-11/1947:00>

Seconding Makki, if you're looking to get the most out of Logic and aren't losing too much essence from augmentations, pick the Mind Over Matter (Logic) power. It costs 1.5 power points but you can dumpstat Agility to 1 and link all agility skills to logic.

I didn't notice anyone mention it yet, but neocortical neural amps give you +3 dice pool to Logic-linked skills unless you're in a stressful situation or distracted. That cost 15,000 of hard nanites, and can be maintained with a rating 1 nanohive for 0.75 ssence and 10,000 additional nuyen.

Title: Re: Mentat
Post by: Rockopolis on <05-07-11/2011:15>

Don't have War, unfortunately.  Mind-Over-Matter does sound hilarious, though.  And totally useful for a "There is nothing that my cold, hard logic cannot achieve." kinda person.

The original concept was an elf.  Guess I should switch, if I want optimal efficiency if I get Mind-Over-Matter.

Might get a Personal Mobility Vehicle, or a Segway, if my physical stats or going to be dumped that far.  Though if I'm going that far, it'd probably make more sense to buy a full immersion lifestyle and hand the infiltrator a tin of nanomachines.

Good point about the Neuroamps.  Need a Nanohive too, though.
Hmm...if I had Restricted Gear, I could get a Focus Reality Amplifier, so all situations are nonstressful.  And with no downside whatsoever. ;D_{Results not typical or guaranteed.}

Need to recalculate costs.  I can drop the Cerebral Boosters (if I'm going to Augment, I want the best damn ones there are), and switch Restricted Gear for Adept.  No direct Mental Attribute powers, available, it seems.  I suppose I could see a Mental Adept positively driven to force more boosters into their brain, no matter the cost.  Augmentation Addict?  What do they do when there's nothing left to add?
"What do you mean, you figured out how to emulate Magic?"

...I don't think I'm going to be able to play this, but is it bad that I want to keep working on this character?  Seems like it might be off-topic? :-[

EDIT: Hmm...with any crazy smart character, almost seems like you should just be asking the entire forum what to do when any major decision comes up.  Might be smarter than one of us, but all of us?  (probably)

Title: Re: Mentat
Post by: Canticle on <05-09-11/2143:31>

I like the mundane+ware Mentat build, but mind over matter does offer hilarity.

Title: Re: Mentat
Post by: Ten-Hex on <05-09-11/2152:24>

Just remember, if you do make a mentat adept tying all his combat skills to logic you have to hire Guy Ritchie to work out the fight scenes a la Sherlock Holmes. :P

Title: Re: Mentat
Post by: Rockopolis on <05-10-11/0839:21>

You know, I wasn't really interested in War (when am I ever going to be using full military gear?), but I may have to get it, just for that ability.

Also, though a counterproductive net loss, I have the horrible, horrible temptation to give them an allergy to Psyche. :P

EDIT: Whoa, SURGE stacks with Genetic Optimization and Exceptional Attribute.  Looks like I could push it to 13.

EDITEDIT: Would taking Nocturnal SURGE and the Adept power of Sustenance be too cheesy?

Title: Re: Mentat
Post by: Ten-Hex on <05-10-11/0954:29>

Sustenance would mean you require less sleep, but it would have zero effects on the negative modifiers you gain from the SURGE negative quality.

Title: Re: Mentat
Post by: Rockopolis on <05-10-11/1705:39>

If I Awaken and SURGE up, I've got to juggle points between SURGE (Minimum 10BP), Genetic Heritage (which is mostly a way to save money and maybe be a backstory, but is not vital; roughly, it pays for itself in  ¥ savings), Exceptional Attribute (20BP), and the Awakened quality (5 to 15 BP, and I think the low essence, around three or four, will hurt a Mage worse than an Adept).

And more importantly, I've got to come up with some kind of story that makes some kind of sense for this character, and the more I throw in, the more I get stumped.  Augmentation seems to indicate a pretty affluent background, just the kind of person who doesn't go on Shadowruns.

I'm also considering giving them strong potential, with SURGE and Exceptional Attribute, but not maxing out Logic, and building it up higher with karma later.
So, I guess the Shadowruns are painful and dangerous mental exercises?

Heh, my only combat skill so far is unarmed, but I picked out Commanding Voice (not a very good choice, I think; don't have enough social skills), so I'm wondering if this should be titled "Mentat" or "Bene Gesserit" ;D

Title: Re: Mentat
Post by: Xzylvador on <05-10-11/1758:02>

Easy way to start looking for "why is this character running the shadows" is to start choosing its Negative Qualities; that's what sometimes helps me when stuck.
There's a lot of stuff that once you take a look at them and see how they might fit in your character, can start writing a background by itself, always leading to the next piece of the puzzle.

Like others said in other threads you started about this char; it's very likely that a person with that high an IQ has pretty lousy social skills. Maybe Uncouth? Plenty of ways an uncouth person who thinks he's much smarter and better than everyone else (and actually is) can get spit out by society.
Or maybe he's that smart because of some neurological "dysfunction" (compared to average people that is) and he's paraplegic/quadriplegic? Turning to crime to prove that just because he's a cripple, he's far from useless.
Or he's a thrill seeker, braggart, prejudiced(everyone who's dumber... so everyone!). A person so smart must find everyday wageslave life so incredibly boring, shadowrunning's the only way to get some sort of a challenge. Besides, he's confident he's smart enough to always come up with a plan that turns any job into a cakewalk.

Title: Re: Mentat
Post by: Glyph on <05-10-11/2202:40>

Ten-Hex brought up Sherlock Holmes.  In the books and short stories, Holmes was a super-genius who took on exotic, mysterious cases because he was incredibly bored.  This was also a big factor in his developing a heroin addiction.  His hyper-active intellect craved stimulation.

You could play a mentat the same way, someone who commits crimes and risks his life because it gives his overactive mind some exercise.  Good flaws to take would be Bi-Polar and some of the Poor Self Control ones, such as Thrillseeker or some kind of Compulsion.  If you see him as a bit arrogant about his mental capabilities, negative qualities such as Distinctive Style or Signature could also fit.

Title: Re: Mentat
Post by: Rockopolis on <05-13-11/2100:03>

You know, what I've wanted to create has changed somewhat, but now I'm kinda going nuts trying to make a decision over what to do.
Do I drop Exceptional Attribute, as it's extremely unlikely I'll ever scrape up that much Karma?  Do I drop SURGE?  Do I want a Mystic Adept instead of a plain Adept?

I don't know, a comment I heard elsewhere reminded me I always wanted to create a modern feudal lord...I could make a very intelligent one, I suppose.  But I don't really have a unifying archetype any more, and that's making me think I should try to force it back to being a hacker or something.

Title: Re: Mentat
Post by: Rockopolis on <05-14-11/1721:46>

Okay, so, it's strayed somewhat from my original concept, to half of my next concept, but it's still got the core; soft-maxed Logic!
I haven't really done any optimization or anything yet.  I think my big issue is that I'd like to be at least a Mystic Adept, but then I'd drop either SURGE or Exceptional Attribute.  I'd also like to take Bushido Code, but again, not enough points.
I know I need to juggle some points around to get Assensing.
Artisan would be nice.  I think the biggest thing I might want to spend extra karma on is more knowledge skills.
And I need to optimize for hacking, I think.

I'm saving the Encephalon and Nanomachines for later; theoretically I can save up get them at Alphaware, as they would knock me under 3 magic.  Similar for the Cerebral Boosters, though there I'd prefer to take them at III rather than II.

Hmm...I need some info on the rough areas, around Seattle or around the world.  Maybe I should look into getting Running Wild, or is there a different book that's better?

Also, does the Adept Power of Melanin control cancel out the notability of Chloroplast Skin (yet another one of those 'coolest largely gameplay useless augmentations')

Man, it's fun to just cut loose and do something absurd every once in a while.  What can I say, I've always dug the 'modern feudal'.  I await a torrent of smiting.
...perhaps I should have a great fiery eye as her avatar.

---

Using the German Karma Creation System

Name: Ælfreda the Green, Ælfreda Haraldsdotter
Alias: Mint (irritating, familiar), Sho-Chan (irritating, familiar)
Race: Elf
Sex: Female
Lifestyle: Middle, Custom
Karma Spent: 750
Physical Description: Tall, skinny, green elf.  Green quiff, whenever it's not matted down under a helmet or hat.  Always wears a bandanna, of varying style.  Alternates between wearing a suit, camouflage fatigues, or chainmail as the mood takes her.
Her avatar is often something incredibly generic or off the rack, but when it's not, it's often a abstracted female face with glowing, pulsing veins running through it.
Personality/background She's somewhat arrogant, rather more ambitious, and although she's quite intelligent, she's actually kind of naive.  She's young, especially for an elf.  It's hard to tell if she's entirely sane, living in a fantasy, or just happens to dig the feudal lord chic.
For her Shadowrunning is an adventure, a means to self-improvement, and most importantly, lucrative.
Given how augmented she is, she must have been the daughter of someone important, but she left Tir under inadequately explained circumstances, and now runs, or at least manages, a commune out in the wilds/barrens; a very strange, very feudal commune.  Humoring her beats living in the rest of the barrens, though, and it seems to be surviving, if not exactly thriving.  Yet.
Her hobbies include weaving, world domination, and collecting information; datasofts, knowsofts, mapsofts, whatever.  She does have a very protective streak, amplified by the effects of her symbiosis.  Currently, her strongest desire is probably to fix the damn roof.

Attributes

Body	Agility	Reaction	Strength
2	3	3	3
Charisma	Intuition	Logic	Willpower
3	4	9	4
Edge	Magic	Essence	Initiative
2	3	4.6	7, 1 Pass

Positive Qualities
Low Light Vision (Elf)
Exceptional Logic
Adept
SURGE II

• Improved Logic
  Symbiosis

Negative Qualities
Third Eye
Day Job II (herding peasants, pushing the Wheel of Pain, guarding the truck, bossing people around)
Dependent I
Mild Psyche Addiction
In Debt I (always something else that needs to be paid for)

Active Skills

Electronics Skill Group	1
Cracking Skill Group	2
Influence Skill Group	1
Athletics Skill Group	1
Outdoors Skill Group	1
Mechanic Skill Group	1
Automatics	2
Blades	2
First Aid	1
Medicine	1
Cybertechnology	1
Pilot Groundcraft	1
Arcana	1
Enchanting	1
Artisan	1

Knowledge Skills

Genetic Engineering	1
Math	1
Ecopolitics	1
Area Knowledge Seattle	3
Headware	2
Local Gangs	2
The Ancients	1	Because every elf knows all about the Ancients :P
Performance Enhancing Pharmaceuticals	1
Heraldry	1
Political Theory	1
Early Middle Ages European History	1
Tactics	1
Botany	1
Weaving	1
Apiculture	1

Language Skills

Sperethiel	N
English	5
Latin	1

Adept Powers

Power	Cost	Notes
Astral Sight	1	Need to pick up Assensing
Multitasking	.5	Supernaturally good at multitasking
Sustenance	.25	Need three hours of sleep and one meal a day.  No discounted Lifestyle
Linguisitcs	.25	Learns languages quickly and cheaply
Eidetic Sense Memory	.5	Remembers everything, with perfect recall
Nimble Fingers	.25	Weapon of choice
Analytics I	.25	Mentat abilities

Cyber/Bioware

Cyberware/Nanoware	Essence	Cost	Notes
Math SPU	0.15	4500¥	+2 to MATH!
Attention CoProcessor III	0.3	9000¥	+3 Perception
Orientation System	0.2	1250¥	Never get lost.  +2 to Navigation
Bioware/Geneware	Essence	Cost	Notes
Genetic Optimization (Logic)	0.2	45000¥	XXXXX
Genewipe	0.2	45000¥	XXXXX
PuSheD	0.1	15000¥	XXXXX
Qualia	0.4	25000¥	XXXXX
Dynomatin	0.2	25000¥	XXXXX
Vegsin	0.1	15000¥	XXXXX
Digester Symbiont	0.2	2000¥	XXXXX
Chloroplast Skin	-	2000¥	XXXXX
Silky Skin	-	1500¥	XXXXX

Custom Lifestyle; Ælfreda's Fief (4500¥, though with lots of roomates serfs)

C2E2N3N1S3

Easy Going Landlord, Feng Shui, Friendly Neighbors, Homegrown Farming, Rad Pad, Workplace, Living By Committee, Network Bottleneck, Black Hole I, Poor Condition, Worse Neighbors, Security Conscious, Green Plan

It has a kicking rad mead hall.  The rest of it looks like a farm, or a ranch.  Reasonably self sufficient, they seem to make slightly more than they expend, and are thus solvent.  Always seems to be in need of repairs or additional backbreaking labor.

Gear (255000¥)
Psyche
Slab
G3
Oxygenated Fluorocarbons
Biomonitor
Medkit VI
Medkit Suppiles
Middle Lifestyle
Fake SIN IV
DocWagon Basic 1 Year

Contact Lenses III
Image Link
Flare Compensation
Glasses IV
Image Link
Smartlink
Vision Enhancement III
Vision Magnification
Earbuds II
Audio Enhancement III
Select Sound Filter III
Microphone I
Spatial Recognizer

Synergist Longcoat
Form Fitting Armor Half Body
Form Fitting Armor Shirt
Chain Shirt
Globetrotter Heavy Armor Clothing
Globetrotter Fatigues
Industrious Jumpsuit

Automotive Kit
Suzuki Mirage

Operations Cleanup Kit

Hermes Ikon
Novatech Navi
Customized Interface
Sim Module
Mapsoft VI
Skinlink
Nanopaste Trodes
Simrig
Tactical Software 2
FTL Matrixware Power Suite
Stealth IV

Monofilament Sword
Personalized Grip
Gecko Grip
Ingram Smartgun X
Personalized Grip
Gecko Grip

Vehicles
Suzuki Mirage

Handling	Accel	Speed	Pilot	Body	Armor	Sensor	Availability	Cost
+2	20/50	200	1	6	4	1	-	6500¥

Contacts Contact C/L Thanes and Churls! Group(S1/L1/M1/M1) 4+1/6 At this point, they range from being moderately useful, and freeloaders. ShadowSEA(S2/L2/M1/M1) 6+4/1 She has an account, and has posted a few times, but that's about it. Karma Totals:  750 = 30 + 70 -70 + 434 + 105 + 56 + 100 + 15

Title: Re: Mentat
Post by: Xzylvador on <05-14-11/1808:26>

I must not get the concept... The Social skill group + Commanding Voice; not enough dice to be a main weapon imo.
Why not drop astral, commanding voice and another 0.25 (why not sustenance; but again, I might be missing the concept) and get Mind over Matter instead?
Logic = Agility = profit.
Seen the Sherlock Holmes movie? Kind of like that, he's not the strongest or the quickest, he's just always thinking three moves ahead and knows where to hit to make it count.

Then again, I might be drunk... all-you-can-eat spare ribs & free wine. Just a little SR to finish such a perfect night ;)

Title: Re: Mentat
Post by: Rockopolis on <05-14-11/1820:38>

Well, it was sort of mashing my last wild fancy with my next one.  But I wasn't really sure what to spend that last 0.25 points on, and just dropped it into the Voice.
Sustenance is one of those powers I really like, even if it doesn't seem to have any dice bonuses.  Like a magic version of the Sleep Regulator, I guess.

I don't actually have War unfortunately, and I'm already kinda pushing my luxuries budget this month.

And I keep meaning to see Sherlock Holmes, but I never had time.

Title: Re: Mentat
Post by: Glyph on <05-14-11/1856:32>

The movie was entertaining, although it was a mix of good and bad (they slathered on some Holmes/Watson subtext with about as much subtlety as an episode of Xena, and Irene Adler seems to have been replaced by Fujiko Mine from Lupin III somehow).  That fight scene was very good, though, definitely how I would picture a mentat fighting (and unlike other bits, not too far from canon - Holmes in the books was pretty badass).

The low leadership ability for an elven feudal lord is explained in the backstory (they are basically humoring the crazy/eccentric person because it beats living elsewhere in the Barrens).  But for commanding voice, you really won't be very effective with a dice pool of 4.  I would recommend nimble fingers instead, which has a good synergy with multitasking (one gives extra free actions when not directly involved in combat, and the other gives you a bunch of things that you can now do as free actions).

Title: Re: Mentat
Post by: Rockopolis on <05-14-11/1911:38>

Oh, never noticed that, thanks.  I'll edit that one in.

I get the feeling that one of the problems is that they're not optimized for anything except pure Logic and perhaps crafting.  Seems like it almost makes Mind Over Matter a necessity, or at least such a big power boost that it's hard to pass up.  Maybe next month.

Any opinion on Melanin Control?  I figure the green thing would make one tend to stand out...time for a Berserker Adept?

All this talk about Sherlock Holmes is making me think of Star Trek, the episode with Data playing Sherlock Holmes; he just looks at the crime scene and solves them, mostly by picking out which Sherlock Holmes story they were plagiarized from.

Title: Re: Mentat
Post by: Rockopolis on <05-15-11/1557:20>

Hey, how exactly does Mind Over Matter work, anyway?  Is it like Cognition or Somatic Control?  Roll to transfer a couple points for a couple minutes then take huge drain?

Do you think I should try to take Mystic Adept instead of Adept?

Title: Re: Mentat
Post by: Operator on <05-15-11/1622:52>

MoM lets you use one mental attribute in place of a physical attribute for any kind of test, using the Astral attribute correspondence. It can only be taken once and is a permanent choice.

Available choices:
Charisma -> Strength
Intuition -> Reaction
Logic -> Agility
Willpower -> Body

Title: Re: Mentat
Post by: Rockopolis on <05-15-11/1630:44>

Oh, okay that's not too bad, if rather pricey.  10 Agility is an okay attribute score, right?

Title: Re: Mentat
Post by: Rockopolis on <05-15-11/1701:55>

Hmm...if I do take Mind Over Matter, I might just drop a point of Agility for a point of Magic, and drop Nimble Fingers and Analytics, or Eidetic Sense Memory.  Almost seems that you can use your comlink, maybe a simrig, instead of that power.  Not bad for the 'needs more knowledge' type of character, though.  And it could go a long way towards explaining why she's a little loopy, if she can't forget anything.
probably going to have to Initiate before cramming in much more cyberware, though.  Could shove an Encephalon II in okay, I think.

As for additional backstory, I might tack on the cliche "I was really stupid so my parents shoved extra brains in my skull" and call her Julia Bashir.

Title: Re: Mentat
Post by: Rockopolis on <05-15-11/1942:22>

I edited the first post to include a sheet.

Apparently there's a comic character called Midnighter that's somewhat like this?  Predicting everyone's moves before the fight begins.

I need to work on a BP version of this, though it'll probably be pretty tricky.  I should also probably disconnect the Anglo-Saxon warlord aspect, save it for a different character.

Perhaps I should make the monofilament sword into a Weapon Focus?

Hmm...an alternate look, for different negative qualities, is to take Flashbacks, maybe Bipolar, and others to represent someone trying to force in too much too fast.  It'd certainly add a bit of flavor to a rather bland character, perhaps give them another reason to be running?

Title: Re: Mentat
Post by: Glyph on <05-15-11/2338:43>

Predicting people's moves in Shadowrun would actually fall under Intuition more than Logic.  In SR terms, the equivalent of the Midnighter would be a very augmented individual with Synch (or a permanent infusion of Sideways).  The magical equivalent would use Combat Sense (possibly with Counterstrike).

But forget truly emulating the Midnighter - you need a deltaware vatjob or multi-initiate adept to emulate the things that supposedly completely mundane heroes (Daredevil, Electra, the Foreigner, Iron Fist, Green Arrow, etc.) can do.

Title: Re: Mentat
Post by: Rockopolis on <05-16-11/0821:29>

Oh, yeah, Intuition ties to Reaction.

I'm working on the BP version, and I've changed things around a bit; dropped Exceptional Attribute for Mystic Adept and Restricted Gear.  I've got Mild Flashbacks and a Mild Addiction to Psyche.  I've got 5 Positive and 25 Negative Qualities remaining.  Any suggestions?
Boosting base Logic to 9 will now take...40 Karma + 3*9 Karma = 67 Karma.  In the meantime, I have modified 12 Logic.

Title: Re: Mentat
Post by: Makki on <05-16-11/0827:23>

Quote from: Rockopolis on <05-16-11/0821:29>

  I've got Mild Flashbacks and a Mild Addiction to Psyche.  I've got 5 Positive and 25 Negative Qualities remaining.  Any suggestions?

What about Reality Impaired. Or something else giving giving a malus to social skills

Quote from: Rockopolis on <05-16-11/0821:29>

Boosting base Logic to 9 will now take...40 Karma + 3*9 Karma = 67 Karma.

where's the 3 coming from? cost equaled new attribute rating x5 for a long time now

Title: Re: Mentat
Post by: Rockopolis on <05-16-11/0928:24>

Media Junkie, I guess.  Information addict.  Reality Impaired is interesting, if rather embarassing.  Virtual Personality might fit better, but I've got low enough social skills as it is.

Rats, it is 5?  I was looking through Runner's Companion karmagen rules, since that PDF lags less than the SR4A one.
Okay, 85 karma; a lot harder to come across than 30 grand and 15 availability for Cerebral Booster III, but it lets me be a Mystic Adept and have a higher starting Logic.  If I start with Exceptional and SURGE I can either be an Adept (and have Mind Over Matter) OR have the rank III Boosters.  I suppose I could start with Boosters II.
Is Mystic Adept worth it?  I kinda want it because it gives me access to a bigger slice of the Awakened world.  Not really going to be good enough for serious mojo, though, just minor or nonstressful stuff.  Maybe detection magic, and Heal.  I'm only going to start with one point in the Mystic side of things.

Title: Re: Mentat
Post by: Rockopolis on <05-17-11/0005:24>

Okay, spent 400 BP and I'm shifting it around a bit.
Might try to add more Face style things; it's not just what you know, it's who you know.  All I've got so far is a ludicrously expensive ShadowSEA group contact, that's mostly a placeholder.

I've got about fifteen grand left over, and what I really, really, need to know is programs; what do I need to get?

By the way, I've got a Weapon Foci I Monofilament Sword; can it be later upgraded, or do I have to start from scratch?  More importantly, something like this needs a name, but what?  Le Bon Mot?  The Cutting Remark?  The Razor Wit?  The Masterstroke?

Title: Re: Mentat
Post by: Rockopolis on <05-17-11/1234:15>

I decided to drop the Third Eye, for now.  I think it's nifty, and thematically appropriate, but it stands out way too much and it's too hard to hide.  Same for the Chloroplast Skin.  Mood Hair might be an interesting addition to symbiosis.
I need a trigger condition for Flashbacks, or I should just drop it.
I also need to work on my contacts; ShadowSEA is more of a bloated placeholder than anything else.
Any opinion on Asthma as a Negative Quality?

For the sword, I think I'm rolling...11(Agility)+1(Personalized Grip)+2(Weapon Focus)=13 Dice+(1Reach)+1(Psyche)=15 Dice.  Only 4P base, though, with -3AP.
Wow.  The Really Sharp Sword indeed.  Still, if you need to use it, you probably screwed up somewhere along the way.

---

Using 400BP

Name: Cassandra Violet
Alias: Mossy, Mint, Sho-Chan (irritating, familiar)
Race: Elf
Sex: Female
Lifestyle: Middle, Custom
Karma Spent:
Physical Description: Short, scrawny elf; basically, an ugly Dryad.  When not on the job, her hair is dyed green and kept in a quiff.  She dresses for the occassion; a technician's jumpsuit, pockets bulging with tools most of the time, hiking gear for the woods, and a snazzy Synergist suit to dress.
Her avatar is often something incredibly generic or off the rack, but when it's not, it's generally a robed female, her skin pulsing with glowing veins.
Personality/background Quiet.  Rather self-effacing, but when she makes a pronouncement, it carries authority.
As a child, the pressure to succeed was immense.  Be a glamorous politician, like your mother, or an astronaut like your father, or a cutthroat executive or cutting edge scientist or cult leader or a mightly wizard, like your siblings.  The fact that she wasn't...a naturally outstanding specimen didn't suit her parents, who ordered some corrections.  They helped, but she was still 'a spare sibling', out of dozens of children.  "Dear, it's not that we don't love you, we do.  We just love our successful children more."
SURGE just made things worse, despite not leaving visual changes.  The Sixth World is not the kindest of places to those with a symbiotic bond, though additional implants provided some small relief.
Enough was enough, and she fled.  She planned to live the hermetic life, out in the hills, with no one but her comlink and all the other hermits.  She's a farmer, a doctor, a mechanic, whatever needs to be done.
For her Shadowrunning is an adventure, way to polish her skills and prove she has some value, and last but not least, lucrative.
"The odds favor us."

Attributes 195+30

Body	Agility	Reaction	Strength
3	29!(11)	3	2
Charisma	Intuition	Logic	Willpower
3	4	9!(11)	4
Edge	Magic	Essence	Initiative
1	42/4	4.8	7, 1 Pass

Positive Qualities 35
Low Light Vision (Elf)
Exceptional Logic
Adept
SURGE II

• Improved Logic
• Symbiosis

Negative Qualities -35
Mild Psyche Addiction
Flashbacks I (processing too much information)
Media Junkie
Virtual Personality
Bipolar

Active Skills 78

Electronics Skill Group	1
Cracking Skill Group	2
Influence Skill Group	1
Athletics Skill Group	1
Outdoors Skill Group	1
Mechanic Skill Group	1
Biotech Skill Group	1
Blades	1
Pistols	1

Knowledge Skills

Genetic Engineering	2
Math	3
Medical News	1
Elven Conspiracy Theories	3
Ecopolitics	4
Area Knowledge Seattle	4
Headware	4
Local Gangs	1
The Ancients	3	Because every elf knows all about the Ancients :P
Elven Conspiracy Theories	1
Performance Enhancing Pharmaceuticals	3
Meditation	1

Language Skills

Sperethiel	N
English	6

Adept Powers

Power	Cost	Notes
Mind Over Matter	1.5	Analytically Agile
Eidetic Sense Memory	.5	Remembers everything, with perfect recall

Multitasking	.5	Supernaturally good at multitasking
Astral Sight	1	Need to pick up Assensing later
Sustenance	.25	Need three hours of sleep and one meal a day.  No discounted Lifestyle :(
Linguisitcs	.25	Learns languages quickly and cheaply

Cyber/Bioware

Cyberware/Nanoware	Essence	Cost	Notes
Attention CoProcessor III	0.3	9000¥	+3 Perception
Math SPU	0.15	4500¥	+2 to MATH!
Orientation System	0.2	1250¥	Never get lost.  +2 to Navigation
Bioware/Geneware	Essence	Cost	Notes
Genetic Optimization (Logic)	0.2	45000¥	XXXXX
Genewipe	0.2	45000¥	XXXXX
PuSheD	0.1	15000¥	XXXXX
Cerebral Booster II	0.6	20000¥	XXXXX
Silky Skin	-	1500¥	XXXXX

Custom Middle Lifestyle; Dryad Pad (4500¥, though with at least one roommates)+(500¥ Medication)

Comforts 2, Entertainment 2, Necessities 3, Neighborhood 2, Security 3

Feng Shui Friendly Neighbors Homegrown Farming Perfect Roommate Workplace Black Hole I Crash Pad Green Plan Living By Committee Network Bottleneck Poor Condition

It's a reasonably self sufficient hermitage commune.  What happens when you have a bunch of Dryads who can't stand living in the rough city, and are too poor and too powerless to move up or shape up their neighborhood?  They leave and start their own. There's not actually that many dryads, and the community has expanded, since it's more or less mandatory for the Dryads to make the area a reasonably nice place to live.  It's still not the most prosperous of areas. Mossy commutes to town, and stays at a coffin hotel for longer trips.

Gear (255000¥) 50
Small Nanopaste Disguise
Psyche
Slab
4 G3

Biomonitor
Medkit VI
Medkit Suppiles
Middle Lifestyle+Medication
Fake SIN IV
Fake SIN II

Contact Lenses III
Image Link
Flare Compensation
Glasses IV
Image Link
Smartlink
Vision Enhancement III
Vision Magnification
Earbuds II
Audio Enhancement III
Select Sound Filter III
Microphone I
Spatial Recognizer

Industrious Jumpsuit
Form Fitting Half Body Suit
Hard Hat
Massaging Liners

Monofilament Sword
Personalized Grip
Gecko Grip
Lanyard
Weapon Foci II

Hammerli 620S
Personalized Grip
Gecko Grip
Lanyard
Improved Range Finder
Silencer
Extended Clip
Barrel Extension
Skinlink
Hermes Ikon
Novatech Navi
Sim Module
Mapsoft VI
Skinlink
Nanopaste Trodes
Satellite Link
Simrig

Meta Link
Vector Xim

FTL Matrixware Powersuite
Iris Antivirus
Tacsoft II
Seattle Area Mapsoft VI
Datasoft (Literature) VI

Stealth V
Exploit V
Eastern Tiger Palladium
Eurosoft Clavicula
Spoof V
Talislegger's Kit
Chemistry Kit
Forensic Thaumaturgy Kit
Forensics Tool Kit
Operations Cleanup Kit
Hardware Tool Kit
Automotive Engineer Kit
Armorer Tool Kit
Science Tool Kit
Atmosphere Sensor III
Cyberware Scanner VI
Geiger Counter
MAD Scanner III
Motion Sensor
Olfactory Sensor VI
Radio Signal Scanner VI

Smart Pack
Pistol Ammo Pouch
Ration Pouch
Smart Canteen
Combat Load Vest
Tag Eraser

Globetrotter Heavy Armor Clothes (Urban)
Globetrotter Heavy Armor Clothes (Woodland)

Wuxing Peng You 4x4
Gecko Tape Gloves
GPS
Gas Mask

20 Regular Ammo
10 Stick and Shock Ammo
10 Subsonic Ammo
10 HiC Ammo
5 Spare Clips

Ceramic Knife
Personalized Grip

Morissey Elan
Gecko Grip
Smartgun System

Vehicles
Wuxing Peng You 4x4

Handling	Accel	Speed	Pilot	Body	Armor	Sensor	Availability	Cost
-1	15/30	90	1	14	6	1	-	12000¥

Contacts 15 Contact C/L ShadowSEA(S2/L2/M1/M1) 6+2/1 She has an account, and has posted a few times, but that's about it. Street Doc 3/3 She refers patients to her when they require more advanced care. BP Totals:  400 = 30 + 195 + 30 + 35 - 35 + 78 + 50 + 2 (weapon focus) + 15

Title: Re: Mentat
Post by: Xzylvador on <05-17-11/1436:23>

Quote

"BP Totals:  750 = 30 + 195 + 30 + 35 - 35 + 78 + 50 + 6 (weapon focus) + 11"

Should be 400.

Some GM's would have a problem with taking so many skill(groups) (and knowledges, but you fixed that in the new build) at 1; personally I'd think it's OK, provided you can come up with a reason for it. Always being on the run and needing to hide in a new role (Pretender) or something the like?
Hm, then again, Eidetic Sense Memory could be an excuse, just stuff you picked up by watching it and understanding it, but never having practiced it yourself. Yeah, makes sense.

Are you certain you got the attributes right? I see 195+30 on att's, so that's 195 on stats and 30 to make the magic 4, right? But with the essence you lost, you don't have 4 Magic but only have 2 left... Didn't redo the math though, so I might be missing something.

Title: Re: Mentat
Post by: Rockopolis on <05-17-11/1453:14>

Thank you.  And I goofed up on that, I thought Essence Loss only dropped your Maximum Magic.  So I've got Magic 2.  Eidetic Sense Memory and Mind Over Matter, probably.
Have to get the other stuff upon Initiation.  And Divining, so I'd probably get Astral Sight with it.  This character is totally a Diviner, Arcana+Logic?  If I had more points, I'd put a point into Arcana and Assensing, but oh well.  I don't want to drop Cracking.

EDIT: I need to juggle some Gear around and get a Synergist Long Coat.  And maybe get a cheaper, and less hillbilly-styled vehicle.  Maybe the Thundercloud Morgan, cheap, fast, handles well, but there's not a lot of room.
EDITEDIT: Drop the Oxygenated Fluorocarbons for a Synergist set; the Flurocarbons give +1 Agility, which I don't think would stack with the Mind Over Matter.

Title: Re: Mentat
Post by: Makki on <05-17-11/1735:26>

agree, Divining would be awesome. He could just brag about and state his intellect can reach beyond the space-time barrier for a more metaphysical approach. More down-to-earth would be "by connecting all the dots and evaluating all possible outcomes, I predict...."

Title: Re: Mentat
Post by: Rockopolis on <05-17-11/1922:23>

I think this character might just about be Ready for the Black Book.
I kinda want to get climbing gloves and a little survival equipment, oh, and bullets, but that's mostly nitpicking.  Anyone think of anything I missed?

Need to decide on the Contacts, but I might just go with "11 points of Contacts" and define them before a campaign starts.

I think this is Missions legal.
It's a shame, I'd really, really like to get in on the official campaign, but I think the nearest GM is about 160km away.

Title: Re: Mentat
Post by: Rockopolis on <05-17-11/2023:14>

You know who this character makes me think of?  Zhuge Liang.
Lived a simple life in the countryside, but his reputation as a scholar and a strategist was such that Liu Bei visited him and begged for his advice.

I could see her as a Wuxia heroine.

Also, for some reason, I really like the line "Dear, it's not that we don't love you, we really do.  We just love our successful children more." or "And we have to ration our love accordingly."
It just seems...well, you've got servants, and drones, and money, and excellent genetics...why not have dozens of children?

Title: Re: Mentat
Post by: Rockopolis on <05-18-11/0853:30>

Huh, apparently I get 4 more points to play with; binding the weapon focus is 2 BP, not 6.  Not really sure what other skills I want to take...can't really take Assensing until I initiate and get Astral Perception.

I'm kinda drawing a blank on contacts.  Maybe a talismonger, the Atlantean Foundation, a Street Doc.  A fixer, I guess.  ShadowSEA seems like a really expensive cop-out.

Title: Re: Mentat
Post by: Rockopolis on <05-18-11/1627:43>

I like multitasking better, but Eidetic Sense Memory makes for a better fit.  And it feels cheap, but I might take the Extravagant Eyes Negative; totally blue within blue. ;D

More importantly, upon further review, I'm a glass cannon in a fight; killer attack, but since all defence is tied to Reaction, I've got a much lower defence.  Full defence 1Gymnastics+3Reaction means 4 dice.  Melee parry adds two more for the foci.
Would forgetting about dodging and just stacking on extra armor work?  I can probably live with losing some dice from my attack; maybe throw on an armor jacket or something?

Title: Re: Mentat
Post by: Makki on <05-19-11/2012:14>

http://www.ropeofsilicon.com/Images/moviestills/g/greenlantern/27.jpg
that's how a SURGEd Logic 12 guy should look like :)

Title: Re: Mentat
Post by: Xzylvador on <05-20-11/0251:08>

Quote

Forbidden

You don't have permission to access /Images/moviestills/g/greenlantern/27.jpg on this server.

Someone, get me a decker!

Title: Re: Mentat
Post by: Rockopolis on <05-20-11/0811:09>

I'm going to guess it's the Watchers from Green Lantern.

Title: Re: Mentat
Post by: Makki on <05-20-11/0826:06>

interesting, I can visit the link...It's Hector Hammand...