Shadowrun
Shadowrun Play => Gamemasters' Lounge => Topic started by: Wickidsurfer on <05-21-11/1137:29>
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Hey Guys and Gals, I am new here. Been away from shadowrun pretty much all of 3rd edition and 4th until now. Starting a new campaign.... Thought I'd set down some ideas for all of you to mull over and hopefully get some of your stories whether from a campaign you played in or GMed.
I've always wanted to GM a street level campaign, players are underdogs, not really shadowrunners(in the sense of AAA corp espionage). The players are in the barrens; stuck in warred over turf trying to eek out a living doing pick up work for the syndicates and gangs operating in the area.
My normal style of play is sandbox; I like to create a list of NPCs, locations and set all the pieces in motion with the players stirring the pot. I have rough ideas of what direction I want to take the campaign and try and let it unfold for maximum fun!
And to that end and without further rambling let me put forth some questions.
Has anyone ever incorporated illegal street fighting or critter fighting matches into a game? and if so how did you handle it? I was thinking of letting a couple of the PCs control the fighters so they aren't just watching me roll dice.
And for the next question, I am leaning toward a seedier more underworld feel, so I am looking for suggestions on types of runs or even stories of runs you've been on. So far I've got organ-legging, pandering(regular and bunraku parlors), extortion, gambling, human trafficking, gambling, smuggling(gun running, people smuggling, anything), drug dealing, etc...
So i know thats more of a list of criminal activities, but I know they will generate ideas for runs, like protection, shake downs, smuggling, etc...
So yeah I am looking forward to hearing everyones ideas.
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Rip off Gone In 60 Seconds. Either version. "Go steal me this list of vehicles.", essentially.
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thats a good one! I didnt even think about chop shops and car theft! thats exactly why I started this thread, thanks a ton! I having been watching tons of movies looking for inspiration....Mean Streets, Bad Boys(sean penn), A fistful of dollars, Sons of Anarchy, Heat...
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Arson. Definitely arson—and make sure to include orphanages.
If it is a street campaign, try starting with 250-300 BP (no more than half for Attributes). This makes the PCs feel more like underdogs.
If someone has a 400 BP character starting out, why not become a corp runner?
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There's always Yojimbo for a classic inspiration.
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I was already thinking of dropping the starting BP for that reason right there. and Yojimbo is on the netflix instant queue... Mainly because I want to compare it to A fistful of Dollars and to a lesser extent.... last man standing.
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Last Man Standing...wasn't bad, I guess, but I don't think it was as good as Yojimbo, even though it had guns. And Christopher Walken.
Well, your characters might be the mooks for Toshiro Mifune's Sanjuro to slice up. A Street Samurai might make an interesting Prime Runner.
I keep meaning to watch more Kurosawa movies, but they're pretty long.
Stray Dog was pretty good, and might give you more ideas for this sort of game; (really young) Toshiro Mifune is a rookie cop who gets his gun stolen and has to hunt it down...I should rent it again, I think it'd be pretty good for legwork.
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Are your players intended to be low-life's as well or more "hooker with a heart of gold" types?
You could just set things in haiti.
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I've got a combination of players. I know one guy intends to make a criminal. Doing what is necessary without getting himself killed(by way bigger fish) to get ahead and I've gamed with the other guy enough to know he will make a brooding anti-hero, and the third player never ceases to amaze me with his character selections; ultimately he will go along with the other two in whatever direction they go. Which should make interesting situations if I give him a solid reason to side with one or the other....
Do any of you guys or gals have players in your groups who wholeheartedly embrace the insane criminal mind? Playing lunatic type characters who might not go around killing innocent people but never hesitate to get their sadistic kicks off on security guards, double crossing mr. johnsons etc...(I know thats most 'runners), but I mean that guy just itching to smoke someone? How does the group dynamic usually work with someone so er... ::)"bold"?
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As a GM, I let it happen. If that's what they want to do. Usually the rest of the team will "fix" nit after the cops come breaking down the door.
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Do any of you guys or gals have players in your groups who wholeheartedly embrace the insane criminal mind? Playing lunatic type characters who might not go around killing innocent people but never hesitate to get their sadistic kicks off on security guards, double crossing mr. johnsons etc...(I know thats most 'runners), but I mean that guy just itching to smoke someone? How does the group dynamic usually work with someone so er... ::)"bold"?
When that happens, I do one or more of the following things:
1. Introduce the character to the Wanted or Enemy negative quality.
2. Have one of the innocent people have a loved one who pays a team of runners to go after the character who committed the act.
3. The next run has the characters meet a Johnson who wants them to kill a psychopath who is worse than the player character.
4. Have contact loyalty ratings diminish.
If any of these things does not make the character act like a human being, then it will probably die. People are normally not outright insane and others do not tend to trust people who are twitchy and loose cannons (especially in the shadows). I've had characters have been killed at the table from being whackjobs or crazies who have no sanity—both as a GM and as a fellow PC.
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I really like the idea of lowering loyalty ratings of contacts for loose cannons, that would also work great if the player's character is ever seen as a rat.
I don't intend to go out of my way to punish players for being insane, but I definitely want repercussions.
I decided to create a list of illegal operations and then various activities the players could be involved in related to those operations.
Illegal Metahuman Fighting
-Gambling
-Training Fighters
-Recruiting
-Ruffing up guys to take a fall
Illegal Critter Fighting
-Critter Catching
-Critter Smuggling
-Gambling
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I really like the idea of lowering loyalty ratings of contacts for loose cannons, that would also work great if the player's character is ever seen as a rat.
I don't intend to go out of my way to punish players for being insane, but I definitely want repercussions.
It is not considered punishment to make the player pay for their actions. Smiting the player for how they play their character is not very nice, but getting them on the bullet end of a drive by shooting or finding out that there is a Wanted RFID on the wall of their favourite dive for the PC generates game-play and drives the narrative.
I decided to create a list of illegal operations and then various activities the players could be involved in related to those operations.
Illegal Metahuman Fighting
-Gambling
-Training Fighters
-Recruiting
-Ruffing up guys to take a fall
Illegal Critter Fighting
-Critter Catching
-Critter Smuggling
-Gambling
How about this one:
Illegal Arms Operation
-Gun smuggling
-Bribing officials
-Succouring deals
-Weeding out competition
Doing the simple day to day stuff a criminal has to do like finding contacts, getting a deal with an Everett ski-gang, planning the route, bribing a Lone Star beat cop to close off a road in Everett for easy access, smuggling the arms (while dodging the Rusted Stilettos) could last for multiple sessions that gives the run a real flow to it.
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Transport Hijacking. Steal a load of cigarettes and sell them piecemeal on the streets from the back of Gaz pick-ups. They did that in Mafia II, IIRC. :P
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The trouble with 300 BP games is that characters don't even start out average on Attributes, characters will often have a dreary sameness as everyone gets the same "essential" skills, and if you limit resources, everyone will play awakened metatypes. I would recommend, instead, using a lower-karma allocation of karmagen, with some other restrictions, if you want a lower-powered campaign where you can still have some variety. As an example, here's a set of rules that Tyro posted in a Dumpshock thread:
600 Karma with German errata, max avail. 8, no restricted gear, max natural attributes 5 + racial modifiers, max skill 3 with two 4's or one 5, max base starting cash 150k (no born rich, in debt allowed but gives no points), max magic 4, max edge 4/5 for humans, max Connection rating for contacts of 3 (the low power option).
Be sure your players are on board first, though. It sounds like they will all be okay with an amoral campaign, but be sure they will also be okay with playing gutter punks. Not just the low power aspect, but the barely scraping by aspect. A lot of people play to escape their daily grind, not to do something similar to it.
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I know one of the players already expressed concerns about lowering starting BP, so this solution might be exactly what I needed to keep him happy. Really after playing the earlier editions, the 4e character creation is pretty fair, I was mainly concerned with huge amounts of gear and cred.
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Yes Hijacking! I've been watching a ton of Sons of Anarchy to get me all pumped up for it, so the Arms dealing suggestion also has me stoked. I already was thinking of combining the two. The campaign takes place in the Loveland area of the Puyallup district, so I imagine alot of milspec gear moves into the two warring syndicates possession in that area.
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The trouble with 300 BP games is that characters don't even start out average on Attributes, characters will often have a dreary sameness as everyone gets the same "essential" skills, and if you limit resources, everyone will play awakened metatypes. I would recommend, instead, using a lower-karma allocation of karmagen, with some other restrictions, if you want a lower-powered campaign where you can still have some variety. As an example, here's a set of rules that Tyro posted in a Dumpshock thread:
600 Karma with German errata, max avail. 8, no restricted gear, max natural attributes 5 + racial modifiers, max skill 3 with two 4's or one 5, max base starting cash 150k (no born rich, in debt allowed but gives no points), max magic 4, max edge 4/5 for humans, max Connection rating for contacts of 3 (the low power option).
Where can on get the German errata, and can you get it in English?
Be sure your players are on board first, though. It sounds like they will all be okay with an amoral campaign, but be sure they will also be okay with playing gutter punks. Not just the low power aspect, but the barely scraping by aspect. A lot of people play to escape their daily grind, not to do something similar to it.
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Yes Hijacking! I've been watching a ton of Sons of Anarchy to get me all pumped up for it, so the Arms dealing suggestion also has me stoked. I already was thinking of combining the two. The campaign takes place in the Loveland area of the Puyallup district, so I imagine alot of milspec gear moves into the two warring syndicates possession in that area.
Milspec gear is ridiculous. I would seriously consider limiting the use of milspec by anyone other than military and corp black ops—especially for a street campaign. The most powerful weapons in the SR4 core rule book will not even do physical to someone in full milspec. Stick to the max being full body armour with a helmet and a riot shield for a whopping 14/16 (or 18/14 with a ballistic shield instead of a riot shield). With anything less than a heavy machine gun, rocket launcher, or assault cannon there will only be stun. Milspec with a helmet and a shield rounds out to 22/18 for medium armour.
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I actually just started a campaign just like that! Centred around a ~25-man gang, mainly members of a couple of ork families who got together to protect their neighbourhood against Humanis and the such. The PCs are parts of the main family or of the gang, or closely involved (love interests and such).
Lots of the starting-level trouble will be things like other gangs making moves against the "211th Street Bleeders" (gotta love that name, one of the players made that and the families and gang up, gave me great stuff to work with), people dealing drugs on the wrong side of the street, family members getting into trouble. Not running, per se, but probably building up to it in the end.
The important thing is to centre the action around things that the characters are interested in, so that you don´t have to force them aboard the Plot Bus ("It´s meant to take you where the plot is!"). The players must be willing to write a lot of character-stuff for you to build on for this, though. And not just give you a list of stats and gear...
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I know one of the players already expressed concerns about lowering starting BP, so this solution might be exactly what I needed to keep him happy. Really after playing the earlier editions, the 4e character creation is pretty fair, I was mainly concerned with huge amounts of gear and cred.
This is where you exercise your right as a GM to say no. I always put limitations on gear and hardware at character creation. That Alphaware you want....how'd you get it? I let the players make their case, but in the end it comes down to "if you're reasonable, I'll be reasonable. Walking around Seattle with an assault cannon is not reasonable."
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@Canticle - I haven't really looked into milspec gear since hmmm.. well fields of fire came out! I was thinking more in the arms dealing aspect, like they get the gear and sell it or try and find a buyer. Stomping around puyallup in milspec armor is sure to bring the metroguard down in a hurry, well as soon as they check their inventory, but I'd let them try if they wanted to, because if you give players access to it you know that it ends up a pandora's box!
@Rascal - Yeah, I am hoping my players do most of the background setting for me and I can feel in the pieces. Its definitely nice to have the players involved in the surroundings. as a GM in any game I get pretty annoyed with lazy players, whenever I am a player I try to always write up good histories and leave plenty of potential plot hooks for the GM if he wants to use them.
@Cass100199 - Yeah I try to encourage my players to rationalize why they have something. Like why did your character get wired reflexes? What was the circumstances surrounding the surgery? There was a list of questions at the end of the 2nd edition character creation section that I was pretty fond of. and I agree on walking around seattle with an assault cannon is silly, but if a player came up with a good reason why he kept one in a satin lined box under the floorboards beside his bed.... I'd allow it, after all a piece of gear like that in a street level campaign is bound to generate some interesting conflict.
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@Canticle - I haven't really looked into milspec gear since hmmm.. well fields of fire came out! I was thinking more in the arms dealing aspect, like they get the gear and sell it or try and find a buyer. Stomping around puyallup in milspec armor is sure to bring the metroguard down in a hurry, well as soon as they check their inventory, but I'd let them try if they wanted to, because if you give players access to it you know that it ends up a pandora's box!
At least the risks are known. Never put something down that you don't want the PCs to take. We ran against a small corp after they fucked us (not even an A). We were not paid, so we took a lot of the internal wiring, 6 security cameras, and the sentry turret. The GM told us after the game, "And I thought: No, they wouldn't take that!"
Runners take everything.
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Shadowrunners are Murphy's law!
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Yes Hijacking! I've been watching a ton of Sons of Anarchy to get me all pumped up for it, so the Arms dealing suggestion also has me stoked. I already was thinking of combining the two. The campaign takes place in the Loveland area of the Puyallup district, so I imagine alot of milspec gear moves into the two warring syndicates possession in that area.
The "A Fistful of Data" (Not one of the better novels, but readable) had the Shadowrunners hijack a stepvan run by crooked cops that were selling hot guns back on the street after they had been "Destroyed".
It's an interesting thought, and one I'm surprised I hadn't thought of before. Just swap out a barrel, wipe the RFID tags, ensure the serial number is lasered off REALLY good... If it's an old firearm, change the firing pin...
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In one of the sourcebooks it's mentioned that a lot of former Lone Star employees are finding themselves working the shadows. You could have your runners end up on the wrong side of former corrupt cops making hits, stealing drugs, etc. Do something gritty a la The Departed or The Town.
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A lot of Loners worked the shadows when they were cops. Bribes, corruption, and double crossing were rampant under the Star.
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Everybody has a price. I mean what are you gonna do have a shoot out every night with the local gang or eventually just let them pay you off or extort them some other way. Like, "Look, Omae. I can get you some real guns to deal with those nutjobs over on east 145th, but I need you to keep the peace on my street....."
I am sure in certain neighborhoods even the squeakiest cop has to learn to live with some bad, or other worse cops are going to make sure they keep getting their wheels greased.
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No, the worst cops are going to be like unto Mid-Level Crime Lords themselves.
Only even more untouchable, because of the Blue Line.
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No, the worst cops are going to be like unto Mid-Level Crime Lords themselves.
Only even more untouchable, because of the Blue Line.
They are only as untouchable you think they are. Shooting a Loner or a Kat in the street is a bad move, but behind closed doors in their own apartments another suicide is not going to turn heads.
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No, the worst cops are going to be like unto Mid-Level Crime Lords themselves.
Only even more untouchable, because of the Blue Line.
They are only as untouchable you think they are. Shooting a Loner or a Kat in the street is a bad move, but behind closed doors in their own apartments another suicide is not going to turn heads.
I was referring more to the fact that they aren't going to be hassled by the cops, as they're cops themselves. Even clean cops aren't likely to rat out their brothers in blue, after all. And, if they are, well, cops deal with those guys in their own ways.
"World's Largest Gang" is sometimes used to refer to Police, and, in some jurisdictions, it's not that far off.
OK, I will say this now, I'm not saying *EVERY* cop is dirty or bent or twisted like this, but it does happen. Power Corrupts and all. So, for those folks on the board that are shield holders, I'm not singling any group out. I hope you understand that.
And then there is IA. Bloody rat squad that they are.
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I am sure the level of corruption would only increase when civil protection is being provided by a corporation. I mean if the worst district crime wise in a metroplex is still playing good with returns to the corp big wigs, why force the issue. Just step up containment on the edges.... make sure you don't get it bleeding over into districts with more clout and voting power.
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The other thing to keep in mind about private security is that there is more than one company - and they will put some effort into making their competitors look bad. It can actually work to the advantage of the PCs sometimes. Maybe that Knight Errant cop giving the ork shaman broken ribs from kicking him when he's already down (while calling him a dirty Trog) would get swept under the rug normally, commlink recording of the whole thing notwithstanding. But that nice Lone Star cop is so sympathetic, and he wants to make sure that the story of your plight gets out.
@baronspam: the German errata (which I have heard is in the newest English printings as well, although I can't confirm it) is relatively straightforward. Metatypes pay Karma equal to their BP cost (orks cost 20 Karma, etc.), and Attributes are bought using the SR4A costs of 5 Karma per level (rather than 3 Karma per level).
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I give an example of the multiple security companies in my writeup of Winnipeg on the other board (http://forums.dumpshock.com/index.php?s=&showtopic=34619&view=findpost&p=1054739).
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You could also go the other way and make a Lone Star or Knight Armament "Strike team"; something along the lines of The Shield.
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Speaking of strike teams. What law enforcement branches does the UCAS still operate? ATF, CIA, FBI, NSA, CSIS? I should probably just dig out Lone Star, maybe that sourcebook has notes on how they interact with knight errant or lone star when conducting overlapping or taking over investigations.
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On a side note, check out Elite Squad. The director Jose Padilha will be directing the reboot of the Robocop franchise.
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Speaking of strike teams. What law enforcement branches does the UCAS still operate? ATF, CIA, FBI, NSA, CSIS? I should probably just dig out Lone Star, maybe that sourcebook has notes on how they interact with knight errant or lone star when conducting overlapping or taking over investigations.
Well, the government of UCAS use the FBI (Target: UCAS page 13), it is really the only one left. I do like the idea of CSIS kicking around in Ontario and the other Canadian States. Does Spycraft have any info on this for those who have it? ¬¬ I'm waiting for the print copy.
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Got to thinking about Donni Brasco and how all the low level mob guys were always hustlin'. Just thinking it might be a little inspiration.
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yeah I started talking to some of the guys about what they had in mind. They instantly went big... arms dealing, illegal gambilng, etc. I said hey you guys are starting small. You got to earn the big time stuff. But I was pretty stoked that they were motivated scum bags!
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The first thing my teams usually do is steal a van. Mostly because they do not have one.
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On my first SR4E campaign, the players started as underdogs and moved to corp runner status.
They started out with 350 BP, and they were involved in go-gang wars, underground betting fight clubs (sometimes against paracritters or bound spirits), arson, grand theft auto, extortion, blackmail and murder-for-hire (of low-class citizens such as a rival arms dealer or fence).
After about 10 sessions, they were already confortable with the setting and rules and had 50+ Karma on their sheets, so I just turned things up a notch. The campaign ended after roughly 30 sessions (in total) and they always told me that going from underdogs to AAA-grade runners was a hit. Your players will enjoy it for sure.
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Sweet! thanks for the insight, 7. I hope they do! Hopefully they don't get too much enjoyment out of being street scum that they end up staying that way!
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Sweet! thanks for the insight, 7. I hope they do! Hopefully they don't get too much enjoyment out of being street scum that they end up staying that way!
Always a risk, but you can always get the "you're all grown up, now" message out. ;)
No, the worst cops are going to be like unto Mid-Level Crime Lords themselves.
Only even more untouchable, because of the Blue Line.
They are only as untouchable you think they are. Shooting a Loner or a Kat in the street is a bad move, but behind closed doors in their own apartments another suicide is not going to turn heads.
I was referring more to the fact that they aren't going to be hassled by the cops, as they're cops themselves. Even clean cops aren't likely to rat out their brothers in blue, after all. And, if they are, well, cops deal with those guys in their own ways.
"World's Largest Gang" is sometimes used to refer to Police, and, in some jurisdictions, it's not that far off.
OK, I will say this now, I'm not saying *EVERY* cop is dirty or bent or twisted like this, but it does happen. Power Corrupts and all. So, for those folks on the board that are shield holders, I'm not singling any group out. I hope you understand that.
And then there is IA. Bloody rat squad that they are.
I've always been a Vic Mackey fan. ;D