Shadowrun
Shadowrun Play => Character creation and critique => Topic started by: John Q. Mind on <11-15-11/1620:49>
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So I'm trying to figure out the best way to make Mind Quad using the sr4 rules. For those who haven't seen it, John Q. Mind was a soldier till an accident/experiment blew his arms and legs into HIS MIND! This makes him a parapalegic with telekenesis at such power that he can throw people and do things that would require limbs like moving curtains and driving a motorcycle.
I realize he'll probably need use of the levitate spell, but he's not really a mage, so excessive use of magic is out.
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So I'm trying to figure out the best way to make Mind Quad using the sr4 rules. For those who haven't seen it, John Q. Mind was a soldier till an accident/experiment blew his arms and legs into HIS MIND! This makes him a parapalegic with telekenesis at such power that he can throw people and do things that would require limbs like moving curtains and driving a motorcycle.
I realize he'll probably need use of the levitate spell, but he's not really a mage, so excessive use of magic is out.
Actually, there's a quality called something like Magical Knack. I'm AFMB, but IIRC it basically allows you to have access to one spell or summon one spirit.
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There is such a quality, I'm just trying to decide what else I would give him to make him a viable character.
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Magic Fingers is more appropriate than Levitate in this case. You can't use levitate to drive a motorcycle or type or bring a glass of water to your mouth. (It can do the last one, but then it wouldn't tip so you could drink out of it but just float upright.)
Problem then is that Magical Knack only gives a maximum magical attribute of 1, meaning your magical hand will have a STR and AGI of 1, 2 if overcasting. That's not really spectacular.
So I think that to make it work, you'll need a mage. You can give him Incompetence to some magic skills and make him an Aspected Sorcerer (and?/) or Aspected to Manipulation to make sure he doesn't become a full magician, but if you want to be throwing people with your mind, a good Levitate dicepool will be required. Same if you want to be somewhat decent with the Magical Fingers, you take a -2 to everything you do with it and even picking up small things might require a test.
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Like Xzylvador I think you're going to need a larger magic score. A subtle but potentially interesting variation to the mage would be an aspected (manipulation) mystic adept, choosing non-combat non-physical powers like commanding voice and analytics.
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You can always just grab the psionic tradition if you're going mage. It's essentially the magical tradition that doesn't really believe they use magic, but that they control the world through sheer force of will with the mind so... it seems like it would fit.
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Where is the psionic tradition listed?
So a mage with a few sustaining talismans for levitate and magic fingers..
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It's in the Digital Grimoire e-book. That's pretty much the extent of it. They think magic is really psychic activity and spirits are "thought forms." In SR3 the tradition demanded severe restrictions, but in SR4 they do not. It's just suggested that they take the Aspected (Sorceror) Quality.
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There are some adept powers you could use. Distance strike, and see if your dm will let you do ordinary actions at a distance too, combine that with critical strike and/or missile mastery. You should probaly have some sort of geass making your powers cheaper and make the gease mot moving your arms and legs (or something)
Then you get way of the adept, and buy your physical stats at half price using adept powers. Thus, you can only move when you have your powers and if you physicaly move you lose your adept powers. Something like magic 6, Str improvement 4 1.5pp agi improvement 4 1.5 pp, distance strike 1.5pp, of something else.
Then you would buy your other stats body 4 reactions 5, logic 5 intuition 5 willpower 5, Charisma 2
Then you'd probably want some sort of rigger something to help you move about, then later on in the game you'd work towards getting to deltaware cyberlegs, or a cybertorso + jetpack :p
That's the way i'd do it, get my gm to house rule distance strike, and you'd just use your 5 str and agi for everything. It's hardly munchkiny because well, you're not str 9 or agi 9 and you are completely parapalegic in a dead zone
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It's in the Digital Grimoire e-book. That's pretty much the extent of it. They think magic is really psychic activity and spirits are "thought forms." In SR3 the tradition demanded severe restrictions, but in SR4 they do not. It's just suggested that they take the Aspected (Sorceror) Quality.
Actually, the Psionic tradition does still have some restrictions: no Mentor spirits, no preparing vessels. I really hate the Psionic tradition, by the way. "Yes, we are all rational and scientific. Yeah, what that guy standing right there just did, in front of me? It's impossible. I don't believe it works."
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He says to the person who wrote for a book titled Conspiracy Theories.
People are astonishing in their capacity for self-delusion.
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He won't ever have cyberlimbs. Him being a quad-amputee is the point...
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So if I give him two sustaining talismans, he should be able to function normally in any place that isn't a magic dead zone.
Perhaps a katana for bad-assness...
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Perhaps a katana for bad-assness...
:o Oh god... you're one of THOSE people!
*WARNING! WARNING! WARNING! RANT MODE TRIGGERED!*
A katana is not some ultra-super-special mega-sword. It's a good weapon for draw-cutting (aka "slicing") through lightly armored opponents, but so is a standard saber, a scimitar, a falchion, or any of a dozen other curved blades. And, just like any of those, it can be stopped cold with a simple wooden shield, something the Japanese never developed, let alone anything approaching proper metal armor, which they never had either.
The simple fact of the matter is that Japan just didn't have the quality or quantity of iron to come up with effective defenses to swords, so their swords got to the level of "able to cut barely protected flesh really well" and stopped there.
A one handed European "arming sword", by comparison, is also able to lop off limbs with ease, and its more robust blade geometry and straight edge provides superior piercing and percussive-cutting (aka "chopping") capabilities, meaning it can compromise chain and plate armors, respectively. Plus, being one handed, it allows you to use one of those aforementioned shields, allowing for a greater level of defense.
*Deep Breath*
Sorry, I've just had to deal with way too many weaboos who talk about the katana like western culture didn't spend a couple dozen centuries developing its own highly sophisticated ways of separating people from their lives, starting before Rome was more than a collection of huts.
But anway, back on topic, I suggest you go with either a Combat Axe or Mono-Whip instead of a katana. One or the other is the best bang for your buck, depending on if your effective Strength.
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Jesus, dude. Chill.
It's a style thing, especially in Shadowrun, where there are katanas in fiction made out of smart materials that hold a monomolecular edge and can be used to block minigun fire.
That said, it seems more apt for his Robert Patrick-voiced pursuer, who already has that Highlander vibe going on.
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Jesus, dude. Chill.
It's a style thing, especially in Shadowrun, where there are katanas in fiction made out of smart materials that hold a monomolecular edge and can be used to block minigun fire.
That said, it seems more apt for his Robert Patrick-voiced pursuer, who already has that Highlander vibe going on.
Hey, I did put in a rant warning. As I also mentioned, I've had to deal with more than a touch of Katanas Are Just Better (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/KatanasAreJustBetter) bull-crap over the years and, as someone who actually knows his way around sharp bits of metal, it irks me. I do get that there's a big Nippophile trend in the Shadowrun universe, so the odds of any given Mono-Sword looking like a katana are probably around 50/50, but that just makes them generic, diluting the "badassness" of carrying one.
Tacking the most common "lets give this guy a cool sword" sword in modern history on a character whose basic concept is quadriplegic-with-psychic-limbs... which is so out-of-context for the game it already screams "Look at me, I'm a special little snowflake!"... for the specific purpose of adding more "badassness" feels more than a bit like jumping the shark. Its not my character, though, and not my place to judge on that front. Hell, I almost played a Naga with Shiva Arms statted out as a Phys.Adept Archer.
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Come to think of it, isn't Mind Quad awfully similar to a paraplegic character from The X-Files?
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Perhaps a katana for bad-assness...
:o Oh god... you're one of THOSE people!
*WARNING! WARNING! WARNING! RANT MODE TRIGGERED!*
A katana is not some ultra-super-special mega-sword. It's a good weapon for draw-cutting (aka "slicing") through lightly armored opponents, but so is a standard saber, a scimitar, a falchion, or any of a dozen other curved blades. And, just like any of those, it can be stopped cold with a simple wooden shield, something the Japanese never developed, let alone anything approaching proper metal armor, which they never had either.
The simple fact of the matter is that Japan just didn't have the quality or quantity of iron to come up with effective defenses to swords, so their swords got to the level of "able to cut barely protected flesh really well" and stopped there.
A one handed European "arming sword", by comparison, is also able to lop off limbs with ease, and its more robust blade geometry and straight edge provides superior piercing and percussive-cutting (aka "chopping") capabilities, meaning it can compromise chain and plate armors, respectively. Plus, being one handed, it allows you to use one of those aforementioned shields, allowing for a greater level of defense.
*Deep Breath*
Sorry, I've just had to deal with way too many weaboos who talk about the katana like western culture didn't spend a couple dozen centuries developing its own highly sophisticated ways of separating people from their lives, starting before Rome was more than a collection of huts.
But anway, back on topic, I suggest you go with either a Combat Axe or Mono-Whip instead of a katana. One or the other is the best bang for your buck, depending on if your effective Strength.
First - chill, it's a shadowrun meta-meme, not the player.
Second, agreed. Along the same principles is the joy of listening to someone talk of the folding process and not know about tamahagane, nor of wurtz or patternwelding. It's all damascus to them.
But that way lies the madness of clips and magazines, and I'm not sure I can pass the SAN check if we go there. So.. rule one: it's the game, it works, let it be fun.
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Maybe it would be better for his enemy, although I only though of the katana because it looks cool. I know my history more than most and have no delusions about what a real katana can and can't do thank you very much
On another note, I am trying to make him at least semi-respectable as a character...
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Maybe it would be better for his enemy, although I only though of the katana because it looks cool. I know my history more than most and have no delusions about what a real katana can and can't do thank you very much
On another note, I am trying to make him at least semi-respectable as a character...
The problem isn't that they don't look cool, it's that they do. Everyone uses a katana to make their characters look cooler. If he's an ex-Soldier, perhaps go with a Marine-style saber or a Machete, or something really vicious looking, like a Kopis or Kukri. The last one, especially, is a vicious little bastard developed by the Nepalese Gurkha*. They've got blades just over a foot long but are capable of stabbing, slicing, chopping... and even bludgeoning... like a sword three times its size.
*Gurkhas, for those that don't know, are a warrior culture from high up in the Himalayas who are pretty much best described as 300 pounds of badass in a 150 pound body. Best exemplified by a 35-year-old Gurkha driving off 30+ train robbers on his way home after retiring from the Indian army. He killed 3, severely injured 8 more, and the rest ran off in terror.
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A katana is not some ultra-super-special mega-sword. It's a good weapon for draw-cutting (aka "slicing") through lightly armored opponents, but so is a standard saber, a scimitar, a falchion, or any of a dozen other curved blades. And, just like any of those, it can be stopped cold with a simple wooden shield, something the Japanese never developed, let alone anything approaching proper metal armor, which they never had either.
You know a modern katana can cut though steel quite easily like if you catch the top of a breastplate, that said your skill has to be perfect and good luck getting your oponent to stay perfectly still haha.
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*Gurkhas, for those that don't know, are a warrior culture from high up in the Himalayas who are pretty much best described as 300 pounds of badass in a 150 pound body. Best exemplified by a 35-year-old Gurkha driving off 30+ train robbers on his way home after retiring from the Indian army. He killed 3, severely injured 8 more, and the rest ran off in terror.
Gurkhas, for those that don't know, have probably already killed you without you even knowing it... ;D
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You know a modern katana can cut though steel quite easily like if you catch the top of a breastplate, that said your skill has to be perfect and good luck getting your opponent to stay perfectly still haha.
Here's a Viking Longsword (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=reec-2QBGw4) doing the same thing with one hand. If you think that flimsy... yeah, it is. It's also roughly the same gauge they use in most "zantetsuken" demos. Real, historical armor was much thicker, 18ga or 16ga by modern standards.
Also, please remember that heat-treatment is at least as important as thickness. Mild, untreated steel off a roll of sheet stock won't be nearly as tough as something that's been worked and hardened.
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Also a type of armored vehicle!
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BTW, my FLGS sells Kukris from Nepal from the same firm that makes the blades for the Gurkhas.
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BTW, my FLGS sells Kukris from Nepal from the same firm that makes the blades for the Gurkhas.
Khukuri House?
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You know a modern katana can cut though steel quite easily like if you catch the top of a breastplate, that said your skill has to be perfect and good luck getting your opponent to stay perfectly still haha.
Here's a Viking Longsword (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=reec-2QBGw4) doing the same thing with one hand. If you think that flimsy... yeah, it is. It's also roughly the same gauge they use in most "zantetsuken" demos. Real, historical armor was much thicker, 18ga or 16ga by modern standards.
Also, please remember that heat-treatment is at least as important as thickness. Mild, untreated steel off a roll of sheet stock won't be nearly as tough as something that's been worked and hardened.
True though lets not forget though that modern historical theory shows that if you had to wear any sort of heavy armor in to battle if you had to walk more than half a mile in it you would be so tired that your fighting force would be rendered incompetant. Which can if used by a proper stategist negate a lot of the "awesomeness" of heavy armor. that is if you make your troops play an endurance war with their heavy infantry.
I know its not that relavant, but it does to a degree negate the heavy armor arguement., Not to mention that in shadowrun katanas have monomolecular edges AND do have arguably one of the best shapes for acomadating stress when using them to slash. (though I doubt anyone would be able to use to such thength that it put a sword to it's stress limit, (strength 10 anyone?))
Still it's a vervy good blade and i prefer it to the four pointed claymore.
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Sooo back on topic, I need to think about a spell list for this guy.
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True though lets not forget though that modern historical theory shows that if you had to wear any sort of heavy armor in to battle if you had to walk more than half a mile in it you would be so tired that your fighting force would be rendered incompetant. Which can if used by a proper stategist negate a lot of the "awesomeness" of heavy armor. that is if you make your troops play an endurance war with their heavy infantry.
Not true. Yes, they're (marginally) heavier than chain, and much heavier than padded cloth or leather armor, but anyone in fighting trim could run, jump, tumble, ride, and be combat effective in a suit of plate, no problem.
A full suit of Gothic plate, which is generally what people think of when they think "full plate", weighs about as much as a Marine's combat loadout, and is much better distributed over the body. The articulation of a properly fitted suit is also good enough that it's less cumbersome to move in than many other forms of lighter armor, further equalizing the equation.
And that's not even considering that the people that could afford full-plate generally also had a horse to ride, and a few more on standby for when the first one got killed.
Sooo back on topic, I need to think about a spell list for this guy.
Okay, back to the topic...
Magic Fingers (obviously)
Levitate (ditto)
Stunbolt
Single Elemental Attack (Recommend "Screech" or "Boom")
Increase Reflexes
Healing
Improved Invisibility
Beyond that, it's all up to what kind of mage you want to be.
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Plate armor is used to describe so many types of armor over such a wide span of time that it isn't really of any use to try and argue a point about it's design or encumbrance. Early suits could weight as much as 50kg while later renaissance era suits would weigh in closer to 20kg. In addition, while knights and nobles generally had high quality suits, they did field the armor to infantry units and that armor was usually much lower quality and more encumbering. And then of course there was Jousting plate (which many people think of since that's what they've seen the most) that wasn't even made for mobility and was designed even in later eras to weigh as much as 50kg.
Full range of motion didn't really show up until after gothic plate (more of the renaissance Maximilian era of the armor), but a good suit of earlier armor wouldn't encumber one much more than chain. The issue came when a group of infantry was issued the lower grade armor as it would slow them down and tire them significantly if they had to give chase.
As for spells:
Magic Fingers
Levitate
Demolish (Guns) //You know you want to catch the street sam in the area, accident of course
Increase Reflexes
Mass Agony
Improved Invisibility
For some reason I'm seeing him as more of a scary guy with hands of blue than a normal "mage"
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For some reason I'm seeing him as more of a scary guy with hands of blue than a normal "mage"
Except for the hands part, and the fact that he's a good guy...