Shadowrun
Shadowrun Play => Character creation and critique => Topic started by: Digital_Viking on <11-16-11/1120:18>
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For the role of Fire Support (Physical) what are some of the must haves?
I'm think skillwise I'd prioritize Heavy Weapons over Automatics (IE put more BP into the Heavy Weapons skill - like Heavy Weapons 6, Automatics 4) , get Athletics or Dodge (obviously depending on melee skill),
Pick up the Ready Weapon as Free Action and Aim as Free Action Martial Arts advantages, and Biocompatibility (Bioware)
'warewise - Wired Reflexes, Eyes and Ears ( I know I can replicate with earbuds and glasses/contacts but I like the flavor of eyes), Reflex recorder for Heavy Weapons or Automatics, Orthoskin and Bone Density for soaking up the damage Muscle toner and Synthcardium.
Not looking for the most efficient use of points as much as obvious "OMG That's fuggin stupid" and "How can you NOT have this?" - So folks, any thoughts? Anything I might have missed or forgot about?
Thanks in advance.
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Prioritize, but still have Automatics. Sometimes you need to smuggle in a SMG that's been modified to accept drum magazines (... No, not going to say it this time) for some (very) light suppressive fire. Or a break-down assault rifle with same.
I'd suggest the Armorer skill as well.
Some kind of high-loyalty contact with a Crooked Quartermaster as well, for cheap bulk ammo, launched grenades, assault cannon rounds, and for the rare occasions you need a mortar. (Willie Peter has so many fun uses! But even a High-Intensity Parachute Flare at the right time can make all the difference, and won't get the Guard/Military on you afterwards!).
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Firearms as a group, and Heavy Weapons. If your role is 'shooter', then if there's a gun at hand, you need to be able to shoot it, and well, whether it is a hold-out or an HMG. Armorer is essential.
Weapons, I'd go with an Ares Predator IV, the HK assault rifle that reconfigures into half a dozen modes, and a Panther XXL. Gives you a lot of diversity, with only three weapons to maintain.
Other gear, you gotta have armor. If you can swing some milspec, all the better, but have another outfit for situations where overkill might be inappropriate. Between the PPP system and the mods in Attitude, you can get a good bit of armor, even before turning to 'ware.
Get a vehicle. You do NOT want to try and take the heavy weapons on public transport. I like the Bulldog, simply because of the room, but any truck or van will do.
Ammo. I like EX Exploding ammo for what I can get at chargen, but APDS and AV ammo are good too. Grenades are always your friend, natch.
Take a melee skill. There WILL be times when 'unleash hell' is the wrong choice, and being able to use your fists, or your blade, or your club will make all the difference. If you can swing it, Close Combat as a group is nice, especially if you can get your hands on that Smart-weapon from War!
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The HK that is multiconfigurable is too high an availability for most people at chargen.
fwiw, I've gradually been growing fond of the M22A3. Yes, it's 1600¥. On the other hand it's the only AR with an underbarrel GL that's still available. 9R, even.
a lot of grenades may be traps, but not all.
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Restricted gear quality, my friend. Helps you get that extra oomph you need. And street sammies have a lot of BP to spread around, since your gear is capped at 50 BP, and there's only so much ware you can stick in yourself due to Essence concerns.
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The HK XM30 is 15F.
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Yes, and Restricted Gear allows you to get an item up to 20F. Which also means that Red Samurai armor is within reach.
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Which also means that Red Samurai armor is within reach.
Also highly forbidden and even more noticeable.
The XM30's not really worth 5BP + money imo. If you can't smuggle in two or three guns, you're also not going to be able to smuggle in the swappable parts of the XM30. Statwise there's always better options in its class too.
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I'm not that big on military armor. It's pricey and obvious a mile away. Stacked armor is almost as good (especially with softweave) and legal nine times out of ten. With a body of 7 (easy if you're an ork or troll), you can easily have 17/15 armor and that's nearly heavy military + helmet and you can walk down the street just fine. Heck with some care, you might be able to walk into a fancy party in that getup (or with a small hit to armor).
As for fire support, I've become a big fan of going pistols + heavy weapons. You use pistols when you can't use the heavy stuff and then heavy weapons when it's time to go all out. You also can go automatics only and live with machine pistols and assault/battle rifles. Sadly you're likely going to have to outsource your armoring to either a high logic PC or contact.
Another way to do fire support is though drones. They can pack quite a wallop either in autonomous or command mode. If you can get one with an reinforced mount, things can get quite deadly. An example of this sort of guy is Umaro's Mercenary Rigger (https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Nyw7oC8F_W6sNoHrWo2HbU2XFj4747O1xh-apxQBbYM/edit?hl=en_US).
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AK-98 (Arsenal Page 26, and goes back to older main rulebooks) has an underbelly GL. Cheaper and easier available than the M22A3, and the AK-97 clips (UGH!!!) are interchangeable.
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I'm not that big on military armor. It's pricey and obvious a mile away. Stacked armor is almost as good (especially with softweave) and legal nine times out of ten.
Plus, you can replace that outer Mortimer of London Greatcoat Line suit with a Heavy Military Armor suit when the going gets tough and really soak up the hits.
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For the role of Fire Support (Physical) what are some of the must haves?
I'm think skillwise I'd prioritize Heavy Weapons over Automatics (IE put more BP into the Heavy Weapons skill - like Heavy Weapons 6, Automatics 4) , get Athletics or Dodge (obviously depending on melee skill),
Pick up the Ready Weapon as Free Action and Aim as Free Action Martial Arts advantages, and Biocompatibility (Bioware)
'warewise - Wired Reflexes, Eyes and Ears ( I know I can replicate with earbuds and glasses/contacts but I like the flavor of eyes), Reflex recorder for Heavy Weapons or Automatics, Orthoskin and Bone Density for soaking up the damage Muscle toner and Synthcardium.
Not looking for the most efficient use of points as much as obvious "OMG That's fuggin stupid" and "How can you NOT have this?" - So folks, any thoughts? Anything I might have missed or forgot about?
Thanks in advance.
I don't think you need Biocompatability (bioware), given that your taking Wired Reflexes and bioware has generally low essence cost anyway.
When you can, I tend to prefer the Athletics skill group to picking up ranks in doge, as the mobility powers that come with Athletics SG, especially when enhanced with a syncardium, can let you get into places where other people can't.
HW 6, Automatics 4 is enough to handle most situations. You have machine pistols for concealed and every day carry, assault rifles with underbarrel grenade launchers for many situations, and machine guns for heavy combat.
I'd personally pick up trauma damper and platelet factories before I went for Orthoskin and Bone Density augs, but there is no one way to go when it comes to survivbility upgrades.
I'm with you on eyes and ears.. they are the only way to get the upgrades you want in a single package at creation, can't be stolen, can record everything you see and hear and ears offer the Damper mod, something unavailable to other audio devices.
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HW 6, Automatics 4 is enough to handle most situations. You have machine pistols for concealed and every day carry, assault rifles with underbarrel grenade launchers for many situations, and machine guns for heavy combat.
Ares HVBR w/ Full Auto mod + 100 Rnd Drum mod + Gas Vent 3 + Barrel Extension + Improved Rangefinder + Tripod + Sling
Better range and damage stats than anything except a full-blown HMG and able to eat 100% of the High Velocity full-auto when you extend the tripod. Cost is a whopping 10,210¥, but that's actually not much more than a stock HMG and a stock AR or BR... plus you save the BP you'd be spending on Heavy Weapons.
EDIT: Can also go Ares HVBR w/ Full Auto mod + Internal Sound Suppressor + Electronic Firing + Tripod + Sling. That config leaves you with the stock 48 round clip and a much more discrete activity profile for only 5,510¥.
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Plus, you can replace that outer Mortimer of London Greatcoat Line suit with a Heavy Military Armor suit when the going gets tough and really soak up the hits.
Sadly the great flaw of military armor is that you can't wear other armor with them. That's why I'm so meh on it.
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Plus, you can replace that outer Mortimer of London Greatcoat Line suit with a Heavy Military Armor suit when the going gets tough and really soak up the hits.
Sadly the great flaw of military armor is that you can't wear other armor with them. That's why I'm so meh on it.
:o Then why would anyone use it over stacked armor?
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It allows Body x 3 armor for encumberance, while normal armor is body x 2, save for FF that works out to effectively body x 4. Generaly, stacked armor is more effiecent, but in some cases military armor works better.
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The mods they have available are very very nice. Also, for lower Body characters, military armor allows 3xBod in armor before being encumbered. Between the mobility mod (Military armor only), Strength mod (again military armor only), gelpacks and softweave a Body 3 and Str 2 character can manage to get 17/15 (Medium Mil Armor) with no penalty. Stacking armor he could get up to 11 without suffering penalties.
Of course if you're running around with a high body and/or character, you can get Steampunk Suit (7/7) w/ DA Coating (3/1) and Full Form fit (6/2) for 16/10 and look completely casual.
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Armor mods? Coolness factor? Concepts that don't involve minmaxing the best armor rating you can get?
Some things you can put in Milspec armor that you can't do with a Lined coat, for instance:
Strength Enhancement - Does not count against your augmented max. Start with a troll, add muscle replacement, and give him a claymore. See where I'm going here?
Ruthenium Polymer Coating - Same as with a Chameleon Suit, except much heavier armor.
Chemical Seal - Perfect for when you don't want to deal with toxins spraying in the air.
Vision mods built into the helmet - Ultrasound, etc.
Implant weapons in the armor - Cyberspurs, and other fun things.
In other words, STOCK milspec armor is far too noticable for most situations, true, but when you start customizing it, you can get fun things.
Plus, I have a former Red Samurai who kept his old armor when he escaped the SCIRE.
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Military armor is great for low body dudes (low being body 4 or less). Our technomancer basically lives in a suit of heavy military armor. And there are some handy widgets you can get. However, it isn't for being OMG tough! as commonly billed as and actually costs an amount you care about. That's why I can't get that excited about it.
The Ares HVBR is a beast and worthy option for fire support. I just don't know how many people use battle rifles in their games (either due to not owning War! or house rules).
Speaking of stuff from War!, don't forget the Hussar. It's amazingly well armored (armor 18) though anything that'll break though that will almost certainly blow it up. While it can be a challenge to find, it's actually pretty cheap at 7500Y. Slap on a GE Heavy Autocannon and it'll vaporize anything it hits. If you want to save cash, I also like the Flash Flood for dealing with normal dudes.
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Yeah, MilSpec is for people who aren't primary combatants - and thus have low body. Stacked armor is better for a serious combatant; milspec is a good way to get medium-high armor with very low body scores, but it caps out.
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Thanks guys - even with some of the minmax ( <3 my efficiency experts out there!) lots of good advice I can pass on to my friend, things I didn't think of. One question about Battle Rifles - do they use Longarms or Automatics? I might have missed it in War! but I saw nothing that said specifically.
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Thanks guys - even with some of the minmax ( <3 my efficiency experts out there!) lots of good advice I can pass on to my friend, things I didn't think of. One question about Battle Rifles - do they use Longarms or Automatics? I might have missed it in War! but I saw nothing that said specifically.
It's automatics. They don't say in War! but it's mentioned as the skill for battle rifles in Gun Heaven.
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Unless you're using the old term for "Battle Rifle", in which case it's Longarms, and that's a rifle you got from WWI/WWII. :P
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Thanks guys - even with some of the minmax ( <3 my efficiency experts out there!) lots of good advice I can pass on to my friend, things I didn't think of. One question about Battle Rifles - do they use Longarms or Automatics? I might have missed it in War! but I saw nothing that said specifically.
It's automatics. They don't say in War! but it's mentioned as the skill for battle rifles in Gun Heaven.
Actually, IIRC, they say it's treated in all ways as an Assault Rifle, except it uses Sporting Rifle ranges.
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Actually, IIRC, they say it's treated in all ways as an Assault Rifle, except it uses Sporting Rifle ranges.
It just says that it can take modifications and accessories like an assault rifle. The text does compares and contrasts battle and assault rifles fluffwise, but that doesn't mean anything per se. Now it was almost certain that the skill would be Automatics. I personally think it should have been Longarms since that skills needs all the love it can get.
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Like was said before, Gun Heaven mentions they use Automatics skill.
Of course, that's an optional book and as always, GM's got the last word.
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Actually, IIRC, they say it's treated in all ways as an Assault Rifle, except it uses Sporting Rifle ranges.
It just says that it can take modifications and accessories like an assault rifle. The text does compares and contrasts battle and assault rifles fluffwise, but that doesn't mean anything per se. Now it was almost certain that the skill would be Automatics. I personally think it should have been Longarms since that skills needs all the love it can get.
If a GM house-ruled it to be so, I wouldn't bitch as long as I could shuffle my Automatics skill over to Longarms. Being able to efficiently load out for a heavily modded HVBR + Barrett on the same character = ;D ;D ;D