Shadowrun
Shadowrun Play => Gamemasters' Lounge => Topic started by: Crash_00 on <02-07-12/1244:46>
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I'm working on a concept for a long term campaign that starts out with them working street level jobs and slowly builds them up to a single high risk long term run. In the beginning they'll mostly be doing small time jobs like snatch and grabs on local drug dealers and general surveillance.
The following are the general guidelines I'm considering, but I'm wondering if I missed anything that will overpower the other options. I'm trying to keep runners at a level that street gang members will still be able to challenge them. I didn't cut the amount of points available, just restricted where they could be spent in hopes that more points would funnel into contacts and knowledge skills than normal.
Campaign Creation Rules
-750 German Karma Gen Characters
-Special Attributes do not count toward the max karma on attributes limit (but are affected by the one attribute at max rule)
-Only 60 karma spent on nuyen (150,000¥)
-Lifestyles do not count toward nuyen limit. Only 3 months may be paid on lifestyles.
-Metatypes and Metavariants allowed (no cyborgs, AI, Non-Meta Sapients. Surge possible on approval)
-Max. Availability 8 (12 with Restricted Gear quality.) (R and F does not matter)
-Contacts cost LoyaltsxConnectionx1.5 Karma //Encourages lots of small contacts instead of a couple high level ones.
-No contacts worth more than 30 karma
-Knowledge Skills = Int+Log x3 (free just like normal BP creation)
-18 karma points worth of contacts for free
-Free Fixer Contact: Ready Eddy (C:4/L:1)
-Skills: 1 at 5 and 2 at 4. Rest must be 3 or lower. (Yes and)
-Bonus Karma available for detailed backgrounds, 20 questions worksheet, and/or 3x3x3. This bonus karma may be spent on attributes, qualities, or money despite how many points have been spent in these areas.
-Only five karma may be saved after character generation.
-No initiation at character creation.
General House Rules
-No Softweave armor
-Fake SINs/Licenses: Scanners must make a Rating*2(SIN Rating) test to bust the ID/License.
-Custom Armor, Clothing, and Weapons may be requested but will be stated by me.
-Essence Holes may always be filled with Bioware or Cyberware despite what left them.
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That looks pretty good to me, other than a couple questions that crop up:
-Max. Availability 8 (12 with Restricted Gear)
Including "R" and "F" gear?
-18 points worth of contacts for free
18 actual Loy/Con points, or 18 Karma?
-Skills: 1 at 5 and 2 at 4. Rest must be 3 or lower.
That is supposed to be "and", right? I ask because the usual rule is 1-at-6 or 2-at-5.
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Well, I certainly would run like hell from a campaign like that, but if that is what you want, and you can actually get some masochists to abide by it, then I'd say other than JustADude's questions, it looks solid.
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Sounds very good.
The availability, character type and skill limitations are fitting. Especially so the new contact cost rule.
Hopefully they only get 18 Karma for free contacts. With 18 points they could get 2 5/4 contacts worth 60 karma, that's too much.
(Int+Log)x3 Knowledge skills: Are they for free or is that a minimum you have to buy with karma.
If its for free, and taking it all together, you won't spend much karma on metatype, nor on nuyen, nor on knowledge skill. Whats left?
750 karma is after all a lot. Spending 210 karma on skills alone seems plausible and will get you 6 skill groups on level 3, with above average attributes. Even if you reduce it to 700 karma, i would still like it as a player. You could give extra karma awards in the first sessions to make up for it.
Fake SIN and licenses limited to 2 might be a problem though, depending on how you insist of them being needed. Having a real SIN might actually be an advantage then...
Edit: I would also disallow Initiation at character generation, but maybe you had that in mind anyway.
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Deleted previous comment because it seemed to be drawing the "smiters" out of the woodwork, but the gist is basically that I don't see how someone can enjoy playing in a campaign like that.
If that's what you really want, I suppose it could work, but I know I'd never touch a campaign like that. I wish you luck finding people willing to go for something like this, but as Mirikon pointed out, they'd be kinda masochistic to do so in my opinion.
Base char gen rules using BP produce characters with capability I feel are enjoyable, though some ideas I've had would definitely require higher points to pull off (such as former special forces).
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I think you mostly have the right idea, but you are going to have issues with Magicians being better than everyone else. Magicians are hurt less than everyone else by the availability limitations, hurt less by the cash limitations, and hurt less by the skill limitations (they can do just as well dumping the points into stats) than other archetypes.
You have similar problems with technomancers versus hackers although not quite as bad because of the loopiness of CFs with karma). However, technomancers still care more about Resonance than about anything else, and hackers get boned very hard by the limitations.
My suggestion is to:
Just lower the point total a bit
Cap stats to one stat at 5 and everything else 4 or lower
Just straight up cap Magic/Resonance at 4 at chargen.
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My gut reaction is that non or light resource users (mages and technos) get off pretty well under those rules whereas mudanes get hammered. The reduced money pool is part of it, but the other part is the availability caps. Mages and technos don't really need 9-12 availability stuff. Mages can get miliage out of foci but that's not needed especially in karmagen. Whereas a street samurai really wants Wired Reflexes 2 and muscle toner 2 or 4. Hackers get sent to the moon due to caps on their programs.
What do you mean by custom armor and weapons? Do you mean PC creations? Or do you mean using the weapon/armor mods rules in Arsenal?
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Including "R" and "F" gear?
Yeppers, just like the normal avail cap includes them.
18 actual Loy/Con points, or 18 Karma?
Karma, thanks, should have made that one more clear.
That is supposed to be "and", right? I ask because the usual rule is 1-at-6 or 2-at-5.
Yeppers.
(Int+Log)x3 Knowledge skills: Are they for free or is that a minimum you have to buy with karma.
They're free just like in the BP system. Of course the players are always allowed, and encouraged, to pick up more.
If its for free, and taking it all together, you won't spend much karma on metatype, nor on nuyen, nor on knowledge skill. Whats left?
I'm hoping to see more contacts, extra knowledge skills, and possibly more lifestyles to represent emergency safe houses and such. I'm also hoping that having the extra points will get them to opt into taking more skills at decent levels to provide back up in areas other than their specialty.
Fake SIN and licenses limited to 2 might be a problem though, depending on how you insist of them being needed. Having a real SIN might actually be an advantage then...
Having a real SIN will definitely be advantageous to some degree...at first. Really most work will be done in the worst parts of the sprawl to begin with though, so the Fake SINs shouldn't really be an issue at low levels unless they're trying to piss off the law.
I would also disallow Initiation at character generation, but maybe you had that in mind anyway.
I definitely intended it, I was under the impression it was a GM's permission thing anyway, but I guess it could use being stated up front.
I think you mostly have the right idea, but you are going to have issues with Magicians being better than everyone else. Magicians are hurt less than everyone else by the availability limitations, hurt less by the cash limitations, and hurt less by the skill limitations (they can do just as well dumping the points into stats) than other archetypes.
You have similar problems with technomancers versus hackers although not quite as bad because of the loopiness of CFs with karma). However, technomancers still care more about Resonance than about anything else, and hackers get boned very hard by the limitations.
Mage's, and to a lesser degree adepts, are really what I was worried about. I'm kind of torn because I know they can come out of the box more powerful than most other characters at this level, and there won't really be as much magical resistance at a lower level as there is when busting into megacorps. To some degree I already see this issue in the normal chargen (I can almost always make a mage or mystic adept better at something than other characters if I put my mind to it) with its higher avail and money.
It's really why I left the one attribute at max rule in to start with. But like you say I'm not sure its enough. A good adept will come out stronger, but from my experience they will start to level out fairly fast as the money flows in and fall behind in the late game unless they opt to go slightly augmented. I don't really want to straight out impose a cap at four to start with, but I'll have to talk that over with my group.
I'm not really that worried about Technomancers though. I have yet to really run for a group that likes them to any degree, and I think the constant dead zones of the barrens would haunt them like no tomorrow.
My gut reaction is that non or light resource users (mages and technos) get off pretty well under those rules whereas mudanes get hammered. The reduced money pool is part of it, but the other part is the availability caps. Mages and technos don't really need 9-12 availability stuff. Mages can get miliage out of foci but that's not needed especially in karmagen. Whereas a street samurai really wants Wired Reflexes 2 and muscle toner 2 or 4. Hackers get sent to the moon due to caps on their programs.
Hackers are definitely hit the hardest in my opinion as one of the most expensive and avail requiring types, but they shouldn't really be trying to break into anything big to start with. From the starting char's I've seen come across the table in my normal games, most characters tend to start with 18-19 dice in one skill and 12-15 in a few more they're dedicated to. Even with the avail restrictions, characters can still manage 14-16 dice in a skill and 9-12 in a few others which averages out to a couple hits lost most of the time. Considering the lower threats being faced to start, I don't think that should really be too much of an issue overall. The same with Wired Reflexes. Everyone want to be very fast, but having 3 IPs compared to most mooks having 2 isn't really better than having 2 with most mooks having 1. There's always Restricted Gear for something the player just can't live without, but the point is to have fresh faces coming into the biz rather than characters that are lightly seasoned and have already outfitted themselves.
What do you mean by custom armor and weapons? Do you mean PC creations? Or do you mean using the weapon/armor mods rules in Arsenal?
PC creations was what I meant. If the character wants a gun modeled after a RL gun that isn't represented, I'll stat it out. Same with types of armor or new armored suits.
Base char gen rules using BP produce characters with capability I feel are enjoyable, though some ideas I've had would definitely require higher points to pull off (such as former special forces).
I'm not going to get into a BP vs. Karma gen debate. You can do whatever you want with either when you get right down to it. I'm not really intending to strap players down and force them to play (my wife already forbid it :( ), but I do find you attitude toward it slightly confusing. Why would concepts requiring more points be perfectly reasonable, but concepts requiring the same points (750 KG is the standard as 400 BP is) but with more restrictions be horribly unreasonable for any reason other than personal taste?
When you get down to it, does a 1 hit starting average in your main skill really make/break a campaign? I guess i just prefer to start at the low end and work my way up (both GMing and playing). Even with normal gen characters, if I don't include some flaws I find myself left going "Where do I improve" because everything starts where I want it. Sure I could raise some of my lower stats and get some pimp new betaware, but if it doesn't fit my character concept to get smarter or know anyone connected enough to give betaware access I'll just horde the resources and buy a new house/bottle of horribly overpriced wine.