Shadowrun
Shadowrun Play => Character creation and critique => Topic started by: Shane Granger on <03-12-12/0317:33>
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This is my re-worked character sheet, This character is shaping up to be like a female James bond lots of gadgets, more geared towards fast resolution of combat or complete avoidance all together, but she can still kick her fair share of as if she has to. I plan on putting all my effort it to appearing like an innocent little girl until I get close enough to do some damage and get out fast.
Some gear is over the rating cap but my GM approved it anyway, so I get to have my pimped out Makeup Kit.
As the character progresses I want to focus more on disguise, buying facial sculpt and melanin control adept powers. and of course increasing my social skills further.
Personal Data
Name: Lindariel
Metatype: Dryad
Ethnicity: Caucasian
Age: 25
Sex: Female
Height: 6'0
Weight: 140
Attributes
Body: 3
Agility: 5
Reaction: (3) 5
Strength: 2
Charisma: 5
Intuition: 4
Logic: 2
Willpower: 3
Edge:1
Essence: 6
Magic: 5
Initiative: 9
Skills
Influence: 4
Acrobatics: 4
Pistols: 5 (Semi-Automatics)
Artisan: 5
Unarmed: 5 (Shock Gloves)
Perception: 4
Infiltration: 4
Disguise: 2 (Nano-paste Disguise)
Qualities
Adept
First Impression
Guts
Ambidextrous
Hung out to dry
Lost loved one
Bad Luck
Adept Powers
Kinesics 3
Improved ability (Artisan)
Enthralling Performance
Commanding Voice
Improved Reflexes 2
Voice Control
Gear
Dual Morrissey Altas
Arm Slide
Silencer
Smart Link
Stick-n-shock (2 mags)
Shock Gloves
Form fitting body armor (full suit)
Contact lenses 3 (Vision magnification, Thermographic, Smart link)
Earbuds 2 (Audio enhancement, Select sound filter)
Makeup Compact of Chemicals
Cyanide 10 doses
Gamma-Scopolamine 10 doses
LSD 10 doses
Perfume bottle of Nero-stun 100 doses
Laies Cigarette 25
2 cans of nano-paste disguises
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Aptitude is not worth the cost. Drop it and the 7th skill level.
Get First Impression instead. Very good Social Bonus. You also need at least one level in Infiltration and Perception.
The Select Sound Filter and Vision Magnification you can get from contact lenses. I'd switch them for Kinesics 2 or Enhanced Perception 2. Improved Ability (Artisan) is also a very cheap power, if you plan on using EP a lot.
for a small tweak, you could also switch Dodge for Gymnastics. In melee combat, you can use your Unarmed skill for blocking, and in ranged combat, you can use Gymnastic Dodge in lieu of normal Full Dodge. And Gymnastics has several other uses that Dodge doesn't.
Otherwise, despite the Edge 1, which you you could improve with the first karma, it's a solid build.
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Aptitude is not worth the cost. Drop it and the 7th skill level.
Get First Impression instead. Very good Social Bonus. You also need at least one level in Infiltration and Perception.
The Select Sound Filter and Vision Magnification you can get from contact lenses. I'd switch them for Kinesics 2 or Enhanced Perception 2. Improved Ability (Artisan) is also a very cheap power, if you plan on using EP a lot.
for a small tweak, you could also switch Dodge for Gymnastics. In melee combat, you can use your Unarmed skill for blocking, and in ranged combat, you can use Gymnastic Dodge in lieu of normal Full Dodge. And Gymnastics has several other uses that Dodge doesn't.
Otherwise, despite the Edge 1, which you you could improve with the first karma, it's a solid build.
I'll agree with Makki on the visual and hearing modification adept powers, but the rest smacks of "optimization over character depth" to me. That said, being a more social character, you might consider lowering the combative skills and taking the social skills separately, having two at 5 so that you're better at what your focus is--that is of course unless the concept requires being a world-class pistol shooter. On the note of the Edge, honestly, I feel that Edge is far too expensive to buy up for what you get out of it, so feel free--in my opinion--to leave it at the base for your metatype.
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Honestly, I am the only one who thinks that this whole Dryad-Face thing is a) pretty boring min-maxing and b) not going to work ingame? Yes, I know that the rules "only" give a huge bonus, but how many people like to be manipulated by magic? People WILL notice that there's something strange and sooner or later people will stop wanting to talk to the team because of this. Johnsons will start breaking of talks, as soon as their askenning mage informs them that the girl is a dryad. Also, a face needs the ability to "blend in" and not be the center of everyone's attention all the time. If you want to be THE hit on a party and get laid every day - twice - go for a dryad. But if you want a face that is more than a min-maxed charisma stat...
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Honestly, I am the only one who thinks that this whole Dryad-Face thing is a) pretty boring min-maxing and b) not going to work ingame? Yes, I know that the rules "only" give a huge bonus, but how many people like to be manipulated by magic? People WILL notice that there's something strange and sooner or later people will stop wanting to talk to the team because of this. Johnsons will start breaking of talks, as soon as their askenning mage informs them that the girl is a dryad. Also, a face needs the ability to "blend in" and not be the center of everyone's attention all the time. If you want to be THE hit on a party and get laid every day - twice - go for a dryad. But if you want a face that is more than a min-maxed charisma stat...
Honestly, the first point is just an opinion, and someone can possibly come up with a fine backstory for such a character especially given the fact that they're naturally predisposed toward social interaction. As to your second point, my opinion on the matter is that it will only not work in game if the GM so dislikes the character combination that he intentionally contrives such things to occur just to prevent the Dryad-Face from being effective, in which case he should have simply disallowed in the first place rather than contriving circumstances to frag over the character's player, in my opinion. As to the 'manipulated by magic', the same would apply to a human, ork, dwarf or troll social adept.
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Body 2 is asking for it. It's really not a good idea to have less than 3, and more is better.
Harcapping reaction isn't worth it. Aptitude isn't worth it. (Actually, now I'm not sure - do you have 6(8) reaction or 4(6) reaction?)
Softcapping Charisma is definitely worth it.
As pointed out, Dodge+Unarmed is not quite as good as Gymnastics+Unarmed. I'm not sure you actually would ever want to use unarmed, though - I might just drop down to only Dodge and spend the 16 bp elsewhere.
Lightning Reflexes is terrible.
You have too many sketchy adept powers.
Kinesics 1 [this should be 3]
Traceless Walk [fluff]
Enthralling Performance [this is good]
Commanding Voice [this is good]
Improved Scent [fluff]
Select Sound Filter [put it in your earbuds]
Vision Magnification [put it in your glasses]
Nerve Strike [crap]
Combat Sense 1 [overpriced]
Voice Control [this is OK]
Drop the crap and some of the fluff for Improved Reflexes 1.
Can you use Way of the Adept?
Get a better gun. For that I will direct you to my sig and the Gunslinger for various useful pistols.
Wear proper armor (that means Form-Fitting Body Armor plus one piece of "normal" armor plus enough PPP to bring you up to your cap).
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As to the 'manipulated by magic', the same would apply to a human, ork, dwarf or troll social adept.
Good point, never thought about that much, but now I feel like this is a point that gets ignored too easily... Hmhm... How DO people react to being manipulated by magic? Or just the danger of it, when the person you're talking to is a known social adept?
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Honestly, I am the only one who thinks that this whole Dryad-Face thing is a) pretty boring min-maxing and b) not going to work ingame? Yes, I know that the rules "only" give a huge bonus, but how many people like to be manipulated by magic? People WILL notice that there's something strange and sooner or later people will stop wanting to talk to the team because of this. Johnsons will start breaking of talks, as soon as their askenning mage informs them that the girl is a dryad. Also, a face needs the ability to "blend in" and not be the center of everyone's attention all the time. If you want to be THE hit on a party and get laid every day - twice - go for a dryad. But if you want a face that is more than a min-maxed charisma stat...
I'd think Mr Johnson would be glad to see that the team they're hiring has a dryad for a face, I didn't really think about the blending in part though, I might swap out a power for facial sculpting. Might seem contradictory but can a dryad have the bland quality? I think it will be plenty interesting being a dryad, I think symbioses adds an interesting role play element to the character, and I'm looking forward to getting into it, being all mystical and crap, good times.
Aptitude is not worth the cost. Drop it and the 7th skill level.
Get First Impression instead. Very good Social Bonus. You also need at least one level in Infiltration and Perception.
The Select Sound Filter and Vision Magnification you can get from contact lenses. I'd switch them for Kinesics 2 or Enhanced Perception 2. Improved Ability (Artisan) is also a very cheap power, if you plan on using EP a lot.
for a small tweak, you could also switch Dodge for Gymnastics. In melee combat, you can use your Unarmed skill for blocking, and in ranged combat, you can use Gymnastic Dodge in lieu of normal Full Dodge. And Gymnastics has several other uses that Dodge doesn't.
Otherwise, despite the Edge 1, which you you could improve with the first karma, it's a solid build.
I completely forgot you could get vision enhancement in contact lenses, and wow i totally blanked on perception and infiltration. I like the gymnastics idea, kinda fits the character I was going for too.
That said, being a more social character, you might consider lowering the combative skills and taking the social skills separately, having two at 5 so that you're better at what your focus is--that is of course unless the concept requires being a world-class pistol shooter.
I guess I'm too used to going for combat efficiency over all else, doesn't really fit with the character i had in mind now that I think about it,.
You have too many sketchy adept powers.
Kinesics 1 [this should be 3]
Traceless Walk [fluff]
Enthralling Performance [this is good]
Commanding Voice [this is good]
Improved Scent [fluff]
Select Sound Filter [put it in your earbuds]
Vision Magnification [put it in your glasses]
Nerve Strike [crap]
Combat Sense 1 [overpriced]
Voice Control [this is OK]
I see your point on the crap, but I love the fluff. maybe I'll get rid of the super sniffer though.
Thanks a lot for the replies everyone I'll spend a little more time on this one then I think I'll be ready to run, it should be interesting to not solve all my problems with bullets.
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You can probably cut all the crap and just a little bit of the fluff and still come out fine.
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As to the 'manipulated by magic', the same would apply to a human, ork, dwarf or troll social adept.
Good point, never thought about that much, but now I feel like this is a point that gets ignored too easily... Hmhm... How DO people react to being manipulated by magic? Or just the danger of it, when the person you're talking to is a known social adept?
The thing is, even if they know it's an adept they're dealing with, they don't know where the magic stops and the skill begins, so to have them walk out just because it's an adept is pure metagame on the GM's part just to screw the player of that character, in my opinion, and as I've said before, the GM should be held to the same standard as his players on that issue.
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Did some re working, I think I got it.
I took 1 point from reaction and put it in body, replaced dodge with acrobatics, got rid of lightning reflexes and aptitude for first impression plus ambidextrous. I also added three negative qualities I thought looked like fun, Hung out to dry, lost loved one, and bad luck (not that fun i just rarely use edge). I reduced pistols to four and raised artisan and influence to five. with the extra BP I added perception and infiltration at rating four and disguise at two specializing with nano-paste. I actually managed to let go all of the fluff as well as the crap adept powers and bumped kinesics to 3 and added improved reflexes 2 and improved ability 1 (hand to hand). I ditched the colt for some nifty dual Alta action. got some for fitting armor and with loads of money left over I bought a bunch of toys. Like some contacts and ear buds to replace my lost sense powers plus some I didn't have. A couple cans of nano-paste disguises and last but most definitely not least a makeup compact full of assorted chemicals: truth serum (can't remember what its called) Cyanide, and some acid just for fun. as well as a perfume bottle full of Nero-stun and some memory erasing cigarettes. ( i love the super spy items in arsenal, I would pay for a whole book of these!)
Thanks again you guys have helped me improve this character ten fold, plus in the process I've flushed out her back story and personality...
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The thing is, even if they know it's an adept they're dealing with, they don't know where the magic stops and the skill begins, so to have them walk out just because it's an adept is pure metagame on the GM's part just to screw the player of that character, in my opinion, and as I've said before, the GM should be held to the same standard as his players on that issue.
Honestly, I somehow don't get it. It's not metagaming if an NPC doesn't like to be influenced via magic. This may include adepts or may not, depending on the NPC. Hey, the world should be full of prejudices against mages - even more, if it's true and the person DOES influence you with magic. Of course, it depends on many, many factors - what does the adept really do (trying to talk you into giving him your car or just make you feel a little bit optimistic?), what education have you got (do you know, what the adept can do or do you just think that magic could do everything to you), do you have an assensing mage on your side, do you know it's a (social) adept, etc? And yes, of course they can't really know where the magic stops, so some people may consider it an insult if the adept even starts talking. Other people may never notice, what the adept does - totally depending on the situation and person.
I don't really see a problem with bringing that into game - nobody said, that using your abilities always has to have only positive results (shooting at people may be successfull, but they don't have to like you for it - same with social interactions: You may persuade the Johnson to give you 200% - but that doesn't mean that he will hire you again next time). It simply adds another layer of thinking into game. Instead of people just using their powers to get the immediate benefit, they have to think about what results this will have - besides of "X net hits = x*5% more money". Will the Johnson like it? Does he see it as a prove of capability? Or will he become afraid, not judging his own thoughts anymore? Should you perhaps not try to get more money, but use your abilities to persuade the Johnson that you're really the people he wants? And Johnsons will think about it, too. Wouldn't you? When hiring someone like this, wouldn't you meet in VR, to minimize the adept's chances of influencing you?
Somehow I'm missing why this has to be metagame? There's magic and people will react to it. Completely InGame. And, of course, sorry, but Glamour is not a predisposition torwards social interactions, it's the magical equivalent to a sledgehammer. If the Johnson notices it, I wouldn't be suprised if he was pissed because you took advantage of him that way and took his personal Neil the Orc Barbarian sim as a bonus. Why shouldn't he?
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Yeah, I think probably a good idea would be for using Glamour to give -3 to social interactions, and using Kinesics to give -1 per level. People probably don't like Tailored Pheremones either, so that should also give -1 per level. Also, people probably don't like being manipulated, so using the Influence group skills should probably be another -1 per level (nobody said that using your skills always has to have beneficial results, am I right)? And we don't even need to get into emotitoys or empathy software.
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Yeah, I think probably a good idea would be for using Glamour to give -3 to social interactions, and using Kinesics to give -1 per level. People probably don't like Tailored Pheremones either, so that should also give -1 per level. Also, people probably don't like being manipulated, so using the Influence group skills should probably be another -1 per level (nobody said that using your skills always has to have beneficial results, am I right)? And we don't even need to get into emotitoys or empathy software.
I hope that's sarcasm, Umaro. :P
Though, either way this is a very good example of what NOT to do as a GM.
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Yeah, I think probably a good idea would be for using Glamour to give -3 to social interactions[..]
I know, it is much more easy to argue against statements only you made, but I'm afraid that's not the same as a discussion. It was never about removing these advantages, but simply accepting, that sometimes and advantage can also be negative. Normally, it's positive to be an elf, but if your Johnson is a racist - bad luck. In most cases, it's positive to be pretty - but if the squatter you need information from hates pretty people because he's ugly and knows it: Bad Luck. If you blend into any crowd - good, but only if you don't want to be picked for something from a crowd. Etc. In most cases you will not have any problems with an advantage, but if you idea, that no advantage may ever be a bad thing, the whole Emergence campaign would have been pretty boring for every PC Technomancer.
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I reduced pistols to four and raised artisan and influence to five.
Shane, can we see an updated sheet? You mentioned upgrading Influence to 5 but skill groups have a cap of 4 at character creation (p. 68, SR4A).
It sounds like most of the changes you made were good ones but remember that whether a skill or power is fluff depends on the style of game you are playing. I've played in games where the fluff powers were very useful because the GM made them relevant and important. It all depends on what's happening at your game table.
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The OP's dryad isn't that bad as dryad faces go. She's hasn't even soft capped her charisma! She's got 13 dice base between Charisma 5, influence 4, glamour, and kinesics 1. That isn't that bad. Even a moderately optimizated face should be in the same range with tailored pheromones.
The problem with social skills typically comes in when the user's social skill roll is good enough that you can fool all the people all the time. It can rapidly devolve into situations like this (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0767.html) or sillier. Typically the GM has to pull out extreme measures to preserve any sort of structure to the game everything can be overwritten so easily. Generally those measures are to nerf social skills into uselessness.
To be fair, glamour does have comes with a downside, a "free" distinctive features. Thus, a dryad does have two levels of distinctive features. Now how bad that is varies wildly to barely or a death sentence depending on GM's whim. If the dude is prejudiced because dryads beat him up at school, that's a -2 to the roll which does help take the wind out of the glamour sails.
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You can probably cut all the crap and just a little bit of the fluff and still come out fine.
You know that can be said about most things in life.
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The game has conditional modifiers, which can range from the Johnson being bigoted against dwarves to wearing the wrong team's jersey in a sports bar. Glamour might inspire fear in some people, but that reaction would still be battling it out with the gut feeling of angelic grace that someone with glamour inspires in people. Kinesics and tailored pheromones are much more subtle in their effects, and (important for a shadowrunner) less distinctive and memorable.
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Updated my original post with my new character sheet.
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You can't have 3 skills at 5, only 2. It's actually a better idea to have one at 6, because of how the karma costs for raising them work.
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Currently your only armor is a full suit of form-fitting body armor. That leaves your Impact armor at rating 2, which leaves you very vulnerable to fists, knives, shock attacks.
(Our team's samurai made this mistake a couple weeks ago and got punched out as a result. I got to drag him to safety while being shot at.)
You'd be better off with an Armored Vest or Lined Coat (both 6/4) plus a couple pieces of SecureTech - forearm guards and shin guards, for example - to bring you up to 6/6. If you have any cash left over, consider adding Nonconductivity and/or Chemical Protection to your armor. That will give you additional dice against electrical and chemical attacks, respectively.
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Oops, I missed that. Yes, that's a bad idea, but you actually want something else on top of the FFBA because it has the unique "counts as only half for encumbrance" thing. Look at my sig and the Technoshaman for an example of good 3 body armor.
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Are the fore arm guards and shin guards concealable? and I thought I could have a third skill at 5 if it was raised by an adept power and not direct BP. I'll look into the extra armor, especially considering the half encumbrance (bad ass!).
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It's fine for Artisan to be 5 if the adept power is increasing it, but the standard notation for this on your skill sheet would be "4 (5)" to show your base skill rating first and then the augmented/modified value in parentheses after it. It's the same as what you did for Reaction.
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You can get discrete versions of PPP that go under clothing/armor, so yes.
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Added some new armor, bringing my rating up to 10/8 also got rid of artisan all together after I realized enthralling performance works with gymnastics, I got palming at rating 4 with the extra BP.
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You have Body 3, so you want 6/6 for encumbrance and 9/7 total. That means you want 3/5 of armor of some sort on top of the FFBA. 10/8 will encumber you.
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I just added it up wrong, I picked the same set up as the archetype you suggest, just switched out the leather jacket for an over coat.