Shadowrun
Shadowrun General => Gear => Topic started by: Redmercury on <10-19-12/0701:45>
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Unless this stuff uses methods unknown to me for gaining lots of mass really quickly, won't it be ridiculously light? Maybe as heavy as Styrofoam? Unless it's anchored solidly a little gust of wind could blow it away. I'm also wondering if they have a few different kinds of foam like this. I would imagine that they could design a similar foam that becomes like a marshmallow instead of hardening. That would have a few cool uses such as breaking a fall, or making a beanbag chair for your makeshift encampment.
It would also be cool to reprogram an MTC Gun Pit to project different shapes, such as a raft. Even more fun, equip your P4 drone with a specialized cutting tool and a healthy dose of this stuff, that is if your rigger has that sense of humor.
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If its anything like high expansion insulating foam you can buy right now it will be pretty adhesive. Still light, but well stuck to whatever is underneath/beside/above it.
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Well, it's description in Arsenal does involve the word "porous", so people wouldn't suffocate to death while they were stuck in it...
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Porous does not mean you can breathe through it, you can describe Lava Rock or an Aero chocolate bar as porous, it doesn't mean you can breathe through either
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Porous does not mean you can breathe through it, you can describe Lava Rock or an Aero chocolate bar as porous, it doesn't mean you can breathe through either
However, this does specifically say you can breath through it.
So one would assume it ends up being a very open-celled foam that provides plenty of air-flow, while at the same time being sturdy enough to resist breaking free.
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Makes sense, considering it's ability to expand.
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Well, it's description in Arsenal does involve the word "porous", so people wouldn't suffocate to death while they were stuck in it...
Regardless I would love to watch a docwagon team try and get some goons out of a car full of barrier foam.
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Well, it's description in Arsenal does involve the word "porous", so people wouldn't suffocate to death while they were stuck in it...
Regardless I would love to watch a docwagon team try and get some goons out of a car full of barrier foam.
Actually, there's a quick-dissolve solvent readily available, IIRC.
I imagine that, being medics, Docwagon would probably load their guys up with Barrier Foam, SnS ammo, etc... stuff that's decidedly non-lethal, but great for neutralizing the enemy long enough to grab and dash. That means they'd have the solvent handy, just in case of "accidents".
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Well, it's description in Arsenal does involve the word "porous", so people wouldn't suffocate to death while they were stuck in it...
Regardless I would love to watch a docwagon team try and get some goons out of a car full of barrier foam.
Actually, there's a quick-dissolve solvent readily available, IIRC.
I imagine that, being medics, Docwagon would probably load their guys up with Barrier Foam, SnS ammo, etc... stuff that's decidedly non-lethal, but great for neutralizing the enemy long enough to grab and dash. That means they'd have the solvent handy, just in case of "accidents".
That makes sense. Better yet, watch as the Docwagon team laughs at the victims before removing them from the vehicle.
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Well, it's description in Arsenal does involve the word "porous", so people wouldn't suffocate to death while they were stuck in it...
Regardless I would love to watch a docwagon team try and get some goons out of a car full of barrier foam.
Actually, there's a quick-dissolve solvent readily available, IIRC.
I imagine that, being medics, Docwagon would probably load their guys up with Barrier Foam, SnS ammo, etc... stuff that's decidedly non-lethal, but great for neutralizing the enemy long enough to grab and dash. That means they'd have the solvent handy, just in case of "accidents".
I can see where DocWagon would make use of barrier foam, not sure about how much they would invest in being non-lethal except in a limited number of circumstances
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Well, they never know if the people they're shooting at are ALSO DocWagon Clients as well.
Be really bad if they go in after a Regular Member and end up shooting a Gold Member and having to switch over to him for extraction after they shot him themselves.
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Well, they never know if the people they're shooting at are ALSO DocWagon Clients as well.
Be really bad if they go in after a Regular Member and end up shooting a Gold Member and having to switch over to him for extraction after they shot him themselves.
I just imagned a pair of runner teams, both with DocWagon contracts, shooting each other to smitherines and both EMT teams just off to the side...
"Hey, should we, you know, go in there and save em?"
"...Kid, in a situation like this, you should just sit back and relax, cause someone up there clearly got one sick sense of humor." ;D
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Well, they never know if the people they're shooting at are ALSO DocWagon Clients as well.
Be really bad if they go in after a Regular Member and end up shooting a Gold Member and having to switch over to him for extraction after they shot him themselves.
Safe Target System keyed to DocWagon client RFIDs/monitors would handle that, DocWagon AR systems might even pick up subscriber status. You certainly would want non lethal rounds if you're diving into a situation where there's a high probability of stray bullets finding homes though.
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I just imagned a pair of runner teams, both with DocWagon contracts, shooting each other to smitherines and both EMT teams just off to the side...
"Hey, should we, you know, go in there and save em?"
"...Kid, in a situation like this, you should just sit back and relax, cause someone up there clearly got one sick sense of humor." ;D
That could get bad if one team had DocWagon and the other had CrashCart or something... EMTs start shooting at each other as well....
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Well, they never know if the people they're shooting at are ALSO DocWagon Clients as well.
Be really bad if they go in after a Regular Member and end up shooting a Gold Member and having to switch over to him for extraction after they shot him themselves.
Safe Target System keyed to DocWagon client RFIDs/monitors would handle that, DocWagon AR systems might even pick up subscriber status. You certainly would want non lethal rounds if you're diving into a situation where there's a high probability of stray bullets finding homes though.
That all depends on the country, and it's laws. Want a scary read? Pick up the old Aztlan book... Under the Laws section, if an authority geeks a civilian while trying to detain you, YOU are responsible for that civilian death! Suddenly your little B&E and resisting arrest charge could turn into multiple homicide charges as well!
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I just imagned a pair of runner teams, both with DocWagon contracts, shooting each other to smitherines and both EMT teams just off to the side...
"Hey, should we, you know, go in there and save em?"
"...Kid, in a situation like this, you should just sit back and relax, cause someone up there clearly got one sick sense of humor." ;D
That could get bad if one team had DocWagon and the other had CrashCart or something... EMTs start shooting at each other as well....
Yeah, that would be a problem.
Be even worse if one team was sponsered by DocWagon, complete with logos on their armor and stuff, so they could get a discount, and the other team vice-versa (could be common in LA during a run for Horizon). Then both comapnies would HAVE to get them and prove which service was the better service, and thus would try to bog the other service down by any means possible, including heavy weaponry...
...could even make a mission out of it...
...
...(smiles evily)...
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I just imagned a pair of runner teams, both with DocWagon contracts, shooting each other to smitherines and both EMT teams just off to the side...
"Hey, should we, you know, go in there and save em?"
"...Kid, in a situation like this, you should just sit back and relax, cause someone up there clearly got one sick sense of humor." ;D
That could get bad if one team had DocWagon and the other had CrashCart or something... EMTs start shooting at each other as well....
Yeah, that would be a problem.
Be even worse if one team was sponsered by DocWagon, complete with logos on their armor and stuff, so they could get a discount, and the other team vice-versa (could be common in LA during a run for Horizon). Then both comapnies would HAVE to get them and prove which service was the better service, and thus would try to bog the other service down by any means possible, including heavy weaponry...
...could even make a mission out of it...
...
...(smiles evily)...
Best and Worst game of Urban Brawl ever...
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Best and Worst game of Urban Brawl ever...
Their Desert Wars matches, however, are EPIC!
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Well, they never know if the people they're shooting at are ALSO DocWagon Clients as well.
Be really bad if they go in after a Regular Member and end up shooting a Gold Member and having to switch over to him for extraction after they shot him themselves.
Safe Target System keyed to DocWagon client RFIDs/monitors would handle that, DocWagon AR systems might even pick up subscriber status. You certainly would want non lethal rounds if you're diving into a situation where there's a high probability of stray bullets finding homes though.
My thinking was "Collateral damage is bad for DocWagon's reputation. Hurting the reputation is bad for Business."
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My thinking was "Collateral damage is bad for DocWagon's reputation. Hurting the reputation is bad for Business."
And things that are bad for business DIE IN ANY AA+ LEVEL CORPORATION!!! ;D
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My thinking was "Collateral damage is bad for DocWagon's reputation. Hurting the reputation is bad for Business."
And things that are bad for business DIE IN ANY AA+ LEVEL CORPORATION!!! ;D
Or, in this case, don't die but in a very pointed manner!
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I don't know... if DocWagon is selling a premium service, say extraction of my dying behind from a threatening situation, knowing that they are going to come in guns blazing to pull my butt out of the fire seems more like a good sales pitch...
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I don't know... if DocWagon is selling a premium service, say extraction of my dying behind from a threatening situation, knowing that they are going to come in guns blazing to pull my butt out of the fire seems more like a good sales pitch...
Just make sure you read the fine print of your contract...
Suffering from lead poisoning by red samurai fire on renraku property? "So sorry, Renraku has not given us permission to enter their property... Please exit the property for pick-up. If you are unable to exit the property... Thank you for paying for this service in advance and good luck in your (short) endeavors."
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I don't know... if DocWagon is selling a premium service, say extraction of my dying behind from a threatening situation, knowing that they are going to come in guns blazing to pull my butt out of the fire seems more like a good sales pitch...
Oh, it'll be guns blazing; but the guns will be firing Gel or Stick'n'Shock, and that massive barrage of grenades is going to contain Flashbangs, Barrier Foam, or a non-lethal chemical.
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Neuro-Stun for fun and profit. ;D
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Neuro-Stun for fun and profit. ;D
Neuro-Stun has a 1 turn delay. Breathtaker will leave you breathless at the end of the combat turn. ;)
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Cyber, check.
Elves, check.
Matrix check.
Magic and Dragons, check and check.
Barrier foam?!??!? OK I draw the line!!!!
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I don't know... if DocWagon is selling a premium service, say extraction of my dying behind from a threatening situation, knowing that they are going to come in guns blazing to pull my butt out of the fire seems more like a good sales pitch...
Just make sure you read the fine print of your contract...
Suffering from lead poisoning by red samurai fire on renraku property? "So sorry, Renraku has not given us permission to enter their property... Please exit the property for pick-up. If you are unable to exit the property... Thank you for paying for this service in advance and good luck in your (short) endeavors."
Which is the Exact reason why no character I've ever had has ever bought a docwagon contract. In fact I don't think I've ever run with people that wasted money on one.
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I don't know... if DocWagon is selling a premium service, say extraction of my dying behind from a threatening situation, knowing that they are going to come in guns blazing to pull my butt out of the fire seems more like a good sales pitch...
Oh, it'll be guns blazing; but the guns will be firing Gel or Stick'n'Shock, and that massive barrage of grenades is going to contain Flashbangs, Barrier Foam, or a non-lethal chemical.
a mark 19 grenade launcher with preset 50 round chains of 10-20 flashbangs followed by 30-40 barrier foam, so much chaos followed by so much silence. (tech problem: stopping the autofire after the last flashbang, before firing the first foam)
(http://www.fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/land/mk-19-dvic561.jpg)
and one Doc wagon scout wearing a suit that sprays foam dissolving agent ahead of him as he heads to the customer in the foam wall.
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Not like SnS isn't so overpowered that using it wouldn't actually increase their effectiveness, anyway...
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Not like SnS isn't so overpowered that using it wouldn't actually increase their effectiveness, anyway...
Yeah, pretty much. ;D
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The other great use for barrier foam is going to be instant casts. If you need to immobilize someone with a high spinal injury, rather than collar them, you can spray their neck and upper chest with a thin layer of foam. You can field splint broken limbs with something that the ER crew can clean up quickly and easily. I can easily see small cans of freeze foam being the second most common thing in every paramedic and EMT's pocket behind a good pair of shears. It's only second because modern light amplification technology would make handheld flashlights obsolete.
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Good point, and a very nice world-building detail there DWC.
From now on, I'm considering "micro-sized" cans of the stuff as part of the supplies in higher-end medkits when I GM. Probably call it 4+... not that anyone ever buys less than Rating 6 anyway.
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Good point, and a very nice world-building detail there DWC.
From now on, I'm considering "micro-sized" cans of the stuff as part of the supplies in higher-end medkits when I GM. Probably call it 4+... not that anyone ever buys less than Rating 6 anyway.
Since our GM rules that medkits increase in size exponentially with each rating, we do. Rating 6 medkits would have to occupy a room, rating 4's can be fit into a car's trunk, barely.
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Except that you can't fill a room with medical equipment for 300 nuyen. Even if you bought the cheapest, bulkiest equipment on the market, you'd still spend thousands on gear to fill that kind of space. What he's describing would be more in line with a "medical shop" than a Rating 6 medical kit.
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What ^^^^^ said.......
That interpretation is just awful and non-nonsensical.
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I increase size by rating, but nowhere near that scale. I see a rating 6 medkit as fitting in a good sized rucksack (similar to a paramedic kit), while a rating 1 or 2 would probably fit in a standard combat pouch or even squeeze in the side pocket of BDU pants.
Having them take up an entire room is completely ignoring the kit, shop, facility rules. I recommend pointing out page 124 of Augmentation to him:
MEDICAL EQUIPMENT
Medical tools, like other tools, are available in kits, shops, and facilities. The medkit described on p. 337, SR4A, can be used on one patient at a time and is quite portable. Portable and nonportable versions of all kinds of medical equipment exist, though shops and facilities are more “mobile” than “portable” in the traditional sense. A non-portable medkit is called a medical station, and
is a staple of hospitals and clinics the world over. Mobile medical facilities are pretty much only found in militaries and places where
the land itself moves around, such as the Trans Polar Aleut nation.
A medical shop or facility has substantially more diagnostic gear than does a simple medkit. In poorer parts of the world, a “hospital” is simply a building with one or more medkits in it. A true medical shop has enough gear that it counts as a Rating
8 medkit. A true facility has enough gear that it counts as a Rating 10 medkit. Such quality comes at a price greater than the
extra space and nuyen: medical equipment beyond the medkit is substantially less “idiot proof ” and provides no bonus to untrained
individuals.
While a shady black clinic might contain only a single facility or even a shop, major hospitals usually incorporate many
shops, facilities, and stations. For example: Tacoma General Hospital has 117 medical stations (Rating 3–6), 29 medical
shops, and 6 medical facilities. On the other end of the spectrum, Dr. Glenn Swayne operates a single medical facility in the San
Fernando Valley.
If it takes up an entire room for a rating 6, there is no point to not just toss the extra cash in for Medical Shop and treat it as a Rating 8.
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What ^^^^^ said.......
That interpretation is just awful and non-nonsensical.
again
is it just me or did a couple folks miss the topic shift from filling a room with foam to actual reasonable uses of foam (in a medkit)??
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Foam cast/band-aid - see the movie Serenity, on Zoe's back cut near the end. ;)
a mark 19 grenade launcher with preset 50 round chains of 10-20 flashbangs followed by 30-40 barrier foam, so much chaos followed by so much silence. (tech problem: stopping the autofire after the last flashbang, before firing the first foam)
Tech Solution: Smartgun link. Problem solved. ;)
For a truly intelligent set of runners: autofire barrier foam grenades in a pattern delineated by an Architecture Knowsoft. Not only Instant Wall, but a reinforced one - and quite possibly small quasi-planned firing ports.
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Tech Solution: Smartgun link. Problem solved. ;)
For a truly intelligent set of runners: autofire barrier foam grenades in a pattern delineated by an Architecture Knowsoft. Not only Instant Wall, but a reinforced one - and quite possibly small quasi-planned firing ports.
You're going to mount reinforcing bars in certain areas before you start launching grenades?
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Tech Solution: Smartgun link. Problem solved. ;)
For a truly intelligent set of runners: autofire barrier foam grenades in a pattern delineated by an Architecture Knowsoft. Not only Instant Wall, but a reinforced one - and quite possibly small quasi-planned firing ports.
You're going to mount reinforcing bars in certain areas before you start launching grenades?
AquaDyne Shark-XS Harpoon Gun: Good for weekend whaling and fast barrier building. Corpsec makes for pretty good anchors.
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AquaDyne Shark-XS Harpoon Gun: Good for weekend whaling and fast barrier building. Corpsec makes for pretty good anchors.
Corpsec Goons: Cheaper than Plasteel! ;D
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I wasn't thinking about structural reinforcement the way you sink metal bars into concrete; I was thinking about reinforced structures the way they thought of them in the Middle Ages. Buttresses on the back end will definitely solve your 'troll push this down' issues.
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The other great use for barrier foam is going to be instant casts. If you need to immobilize someone with a high spinal injury, rather than collar them, you can spray their neck and upper chest with a thin layer of foam. You can field splint broken limbs with something that the ER crew can clean up quickly and easily. I can easily see small cans of freeze foam being the second most common thing in every paramedic and EMT's pocket behind a good pair of shears. It's only second because modern light amplification technology would make handheld flashlights obsolete.
Excellent point. I'll have to remember to write that down.
And to keep things more on-topic, does anybody else think that barrier foam being an auto-suffocate potentially makes it a little too strong for common use?
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what about modifying a car with a hidden biometric reader intergrated into the system that instead of locking the car down electronically when it does not pick up the correct biometrics from the driver within 30 seconds of starting the car, it blocks/ covers all gaps that could lead to important wiring and such and then fills the car with Barrier foam.
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what about modifying a car with a hidden biometric reader intergrated into the system that instead of locking the car down electronically when it does not pick up the correct biometrics from the driver within 30 seconds of starting the car, it blocks/ covers all gaps that could lead to important wiring and such and then fills the car with Barrier foam.
Wouldn't filling the car with Barrier Foam do that already?
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This might be slightly off topic, so forgive me please, but now that I think about it, wouldn't barrier foam be pretty useful for restraining shadowrunners? I just had an idea for a sort of palm-print/pressure-reader, involving sticking your arm down a foot long tube and grabbing a rod to open a secure area. The rod would act as a biometric reader for the first part, reading the palm print. Then for the second part, the user must turn the rod clockwise to the 12 and 6 position. The rod would read the pressure locations of the hand gripping it and compare it to previous readings of grip strength and highest pressure record for certain areas. This would be extremely useful for getting around issues involving palm-print glove printers, as hand pressure would be harder to fake. If the reader gets a negative confirmation, the tube would fill up with quick acting freeze-foam (from the top of the hole to the bottom, of course...) and the intruder would be stuck to a wall by his arm for at least a few combat turns, giving security a few potshots for their hubris.
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and now the market for one shot cyber arms with way too many biometric markers is wide open!!!!!!!!!!
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and now the market for one shot cyber arms with way too many biometric markers is wide open!!!!!!!!!!
(Fat Mustashioed Capatalist sitting at a massive oak desk with a cigar in his mouth swirling a glass of brandy)
FANTASTIC IDEA, REGINALD! WE'LL MAKE BILLIONS WITH THE INITIAL SELL, AND ON THE RESALES AS WELL IF IT'S REUSEABLE, DUE TO AN EASY LINKAGE SYSTEM! GENIUS, REG, GENIUS! (APPROVING HRMBLRMBLGRMBL)!