[firebug]

I'm considering a flamethrower being mounted in one of my rigger's vehicles, but there's a few complexities about it I'm not sure how to handle.  First, it normally takes a complex action to light the flamethrower.  This is still totally doable in my opinion, it's probably just an internal switch or something.  But then the question comes about reloading them...

Since a weapon mount automatically comes capable of holding 250 units of ammo, would this mean that any mounted weapon (and thus, the flamethrower) would have a 250 clip that only needs to be refilled?  Or would you still have to "reload" after the normal amount of shots, and can only take from the ammo inside the mount?  If it's the former, than reloading the Flamethrower's normal 4 or 10 shot tank suddenly becomes something you never really have to worry about doing.  If it's the latter, then would you need to take the normal time every however-many blasts as usual?  And your mount would just be holding a bunch of other tanks for you to put on?  Even for guns that seems unreasonable for internal weapon mounts, but I haven't seen it said either way in the books, so I'm hoping you guys will be able to give me advice.

[Reaver]

Wow.... A flamethrower.... On a vehicle.....

I like it.

Ok, as a GM I would handle this issue this way:

We know that the mount 'usually' holds 250 rounds of ammo. But that is generally for an LMG/MMG/HMG... So I would look up some average machine gun ammo capacities and see what the factor increase is.
IE: a LMG usually holds 100 rounds (x2.5)
     A MMG usually holds 50 rounds (x5)
     A HMG usually holds 30 rounds (x8.15)

Then I would take the middle number (in this case the x5) and apply it to the flamethrower's ammo.  As for reloading the flamethrower... This would be more tricky... You are talking about a voilitile compound liquid, and not just an ammo case.... So I would say it would take MINUTES and thus not something you want to do in the middle of a fight. (course, you could have several ready canisters to swap to... If your vehicle was big enough...

[Mantis]

Here is the rule from Arsenal pg 147.

Each weapon mount can also hold up to 250 rounds of ammunition, if the weapon has a beltfeed loading mechanism. Weapons with other loading mechanisms or larger ammunition (rocket launchers, for example) are restricted to their standard amount of ammunition.

Emphasis mine.

So your flamethrower holds the usual 4-10 shots.

[Reaver]

Here is the rule from Arsenal pg 147.

Each weapon mount can also hold up to 250 rounds of ammunition, if the weapon has a beltfeed loading mechanism. Weapons with other loading mechanisms or larger ammunition (rocket launchers, for example) are restricted to their standard amount of ammunition.

Emphasis mine.

So your flamethrower holds the usual 4-10 shots.

Oh poohy!

I like my solution better :p

But those are the rules..,

[firebug]

Thanks Mantis.  Then does that also mean reloading it is exactly the same?  Reloading flamethrowers is so much more difficult than other weapons.  I'm also curious because, if your weapon is internal, how do you take out a clip and replace it?  It seems like you'd have to open up the entire vehicle or drone to do it.

Either way, I doubt it could be reloaded while the rigger is jumped into it...  Hmm, as cool as this idea is, it seems that flamethrowers just aren't meant for extended use.

[CanRay]

Here's one way to get a bigger flamethrower fuel tank from history's dustbin.

[firebug]

That's prettymuch how I saw the "holds 250 rounds" thing being, but mantis did specify that it didn't apply.  There's always the Ammo Bins modification, but...  It's not worth much if I still have to take a really long time to reload.

[Michael Chandra]

Ammo Bins is also vague but given the Ammo info on a Weapon Mount, chances are those Ammo Bins won't help with weapons that don't use belts. By the way, a weapon mount's insides are likely accessable from the inside of the vehicle through hatches, even if you can't use the weapon yourself.

[Mirikon]

Reminds me of this: http://dsc.discovery.com/tv-shows/sons-of-guns/videos/flame-cannon-unleashed.htm

[Mantis]

Do your characters regularly engage in combats that last long enough to drain a flamethrower fuel tank? I would assume on a vehicle you would mount the Aztechnology F3a rather than the mini-flamer from Shiawase. This would get you 10 shots. I would also say the flamethrower is pretty much the definition of unusual loading mechanisms and/or exotic ammo so wouldn't qualify for a Firing Selection change mod. That means you have an SS weapon with 10 shots. Even with maxed out IPs, that should still last 2 full combat rounds (and as a rigger you need to squeeze some drive actions in there) so more likely 3 rounds unless you are using it for suppression fire.
Unless you are using an external weapon mount, you should still be able to access the weapon from inside the vehicle, so you could reload from inside the vehicle. Just bring along a friend to reload for you or else get one of those Renraku Manservants and load it up with an Autosoft to handle reloading a flamer. Or add another ammo bin to hold an additional 10 shots. If you use up 20 shots in a single combat you are doing something wrong.

[Mirikon]

Never, ever plan for just a single combat. Plan for at least three combats before getting to someplace where you can resupply.

[farothel]

Depending on the vehicle, you should be able to mount a larger fuel tank than what you walk around with, so more than 10 shots should be an option.  Not 250, but something around 30 should not be a problem on a vehicle.  that's something to discuss with your GM.

Do realise that anything on a gun mount (and especially things with high collateral damage like flame throwers) will give a quick and massive police response if you use them anywhere except in feral cities or places like the Barrens.

[firebug]

I'm with Mirikon on the reloading thing.  It's mainly that reloading it is such a liability, I want to make sure I could really last a long time before I would have to take a while to reload it.

Also, farothel, yeah, I know.  That's like rule one of every rigger "try to keep your guns quiet".  But it fits my character's personality and job tendencies.  As a courier, she it tends to go between extremes of "don't shoot the popo are everywhere" to "these gangers are the only things here besides some tumbleweeds".  Not to mention, she has always been slightly "pink mohawk" because she used to be a ganger where she got a name as an arsonist, and killed other gangers with molotovs before.  She wants to keep up the inhuman fear factor if she needs to rely on it again.

When the weapon isn't an option, just ramming into people with her Blitzen is actually a surprisingly effective fallback.  At this point though, I'm considering just using a normal LMG in the thing and just using capsule rounds full of kerosene.  She'll have to light it herself, but that's part of the fun.

EDIT:  Here's the mods on her bike, by the way.  She has a fake license for the Normal Armor and the Ram Plate, which should be the only visible oddities about it when the chameleon coating isn't active.  Since play hasn't started, her bike is nebulous.  I keep changing it around.  If she can rely on the ram plate enough, then I suppose she won't need the flamethrower much beyond those times when it's time to fuck with somebody real bad.

== Vehicles ==
BMW Blitzen 2050 (Combat Bike)
   +Amenities, Squatter
   +Armor, Normal Rating 18
   +Chameleon Coating
   +GridLink
   +GridLink Override
   +Obsolescent
   +Off-Road Tires Rating 2
   +Ram Plate
   +Rigger Cocoon, Basic
   +Spoof Chip
   +Weapon Mount (Normal, Internal, Fixed, Remote)
   +Vehicle Sensor
      +Atmosphere Sensor Rating 3
      +Thermometric
      +Motion Sensor
      +Directional Microphone
      +Radio Signal Scanner Rating 6
      +Laser Range Finder

[Mantis]

You wanted to put a flamethrower on a bike? Rear facing I hope, otherwise you'd be eating a face full of flame every time you used the thing.
Also, add a motorcycle gyroscope so the bike can stay upright on its own. Is there some reason you have Gridlink? You don't really need it and if it is for fuel/endurance, just get an extra fuel tank for half the number of slots.

[firebug]

I've prettymuch given up on the flamethrower...  I'm just trying to make it a good courier bike.  It won't be the main, cargo-carrying vehicle.  Just one that will ride alongside it and offer protection.  I made a bunch of changes to it...  But I think I'll post this up as a new thread (since it's off-topic) and link to it here just in case.

http://forums.shadowrun4.com/index.php?topic=10867.0  My new topic.