[welldressedgent]

Is there any reason for a player to take this? Seems useless unless you've got npc team members.

wdg

[Whiskeyjack]

The initiative boost option can be decent and handy. It's a nice option, but it'd be quite boring if that's all your character ever did in combat.

[adzling]

Leadership is great for a Face to exert soft power and support to team members.

Whiskey mentions one and there are a few other ways you can use it in support of team members when you don't have a clear shot or other combat option open to you (p.142 iirc)

When using Small Unit Tactics if you are the leader then you can use the above benefits WHILE executing a maneuver from R&G.

Not awesome but pretty helpful.

It's great for rallying your teammates if they lose a composure test from a fear mongering critter or infected.

It's what you need for Commanding Voice.

You can use it to influence NPCs.

So yeah, Face needs Leadership imho.

[welldressedgent]

Thanks adlig and whiskey I didn't think of all those. But if you could clarify one thing: commanding voice + leadership, it only works on people in your chain of command, am I right? Jedi mindtricking your teammates might not go over too well.

wdg

[adzling]

No, Commanding Voice (leadership + Charisma) works against enemies ;-)

Straight up Leadership the skill can also be used against NPCs to bring them around to your way of thinking or get them to act in a manner suitable to your goals.

[halflingmage]

Using the Direct option lets you basically do a teamwork test for skills you don't otherwise have.  That is pretty darned useful.  The trick is implementation, you really need to talk with your gm about how they interpret the rules.  The target has to accept you as a temporary leader, and its a little vague about what that means.  If a pc can do that voluntarily you basically become a Shadowrun bard and can help with just about anything.  If not you have to make a roll vs their willpower first, which in combat  means its now two actions,  it may not be worth it in terms of action economy. 

[Kincaid]

Leadership can also make it very hard to surprise you and your allies.  Not every player need Leadership, but I'm in the "every group needs Leadership" camp.

[Whiskeyjack]

So yeah, Face needs Leadership imho.

I rate its base usefulness is somewhat below Negotiation and far below Con. Commanding Voice makes it much more useful, but...eh. I wouldn't go this far.

The bonus to SUT is good though, I forgot about that.

[adzling]

A face's core toolbox is leadership, negotiation and con and small unit tactics

Ettiquette and intimidate are helpful.

[Triskavanski]

Its one of those things that is really good for faces, indeed, allowing you to -only- take things that are specifically face related, but somehow still are capable of contributing to combat, even if your job in the group is buying/selling and negotiating with the Johnson (And the casual NPC)

 

[Whiskeyjack]

A face's core toolbox is leadership, negotiation and con and small unit tactics

Ettiquette and intimidate are helpful.

You think Leadership is core toolbox? Hardly.

But as always, YMMV.

[Sipowitz]

A face's core toolbox is leadership, negotiation and con and small unit tactics

Ettiquette and intimidate are helpful.

You think Leadership is core toolbox? Hardly.

But as always, YMMV.

With the way they are having Leadership work in 5e, yeah I would say the same.  Sure depends on the character, but for a Face?  Yeah core toolbox is accurate.

[welldressedgent]

No, Commanding Voice (leadership + Charisma) works against enemies ;-)

Straight up Leadership the skill can also be used against NPCs to bring them around to your way of thinking or get them to act in a manner suitable to your goals.

Thx I did not know that. So is there a difference between using commanding voice + leadership + cha, and using commanding voice + intimidation + cha? I guess you'd roleplay it differently. And apply a different set of dicepool modifiers.

wdg

[Whiskeyjack]

Intimidation isn't usable with the Commanding Voice power. Shadow Souls specifies a dice pool of CHA + Leadership.

[welldressedgent]

Sheeit, I mean authoritative tone. Uses leadership and/or intimidation. So that leadership only works against mutineers or cowards in your chain of command; but requires intimidation to control your enemies. Commanding voice (the Stolen Souls CVoice) uses leadership for everything. Thx everyone for your patience SR's editors give me who's-on-first syndrome. Not sure logically why leadership is so much more versatile in one case but not the other. This mess is begging for a houserule.

wdg