[daniel.fairhaven]

The Defiance T-250 is a manual loading (5) semi automatic gun, because this is not a pump action weapon I was wondering if you can use either the Extended Clip or Additional Clip with it.

With the Extended clip I figured a slightly longer magazine barrel, for the Additional clip then a parallel magazine barrel with a slightly wider foregrip (of sorts) to compensate. Personally I prefer the Additional clip concept.

Thanking you in advanced for all input.

[CanRay]

The long barreled version likely have have the "extended clip", with the underbelly magazine (as Shadowrun describes it) being extended to the end of the muzzle (They have these IRL, compare this to this from Fallout:  New Vegas.).  I don't think additional clip would work.  But that would be a GM's call, as neither one of those mods are really designed to work with a magazine like that.

I prefer the look of the SPAS-22 myself anyhow. 

[KarmaInferno]

Additional Clip.



-k

[Mantis]

By the rules you can't do either of those things to a magazine (M) fed weapon as those modifications are for 'clip' (C) fed weapons. Pretty much if you have an internal magazine on weapons (like the defiance) then that is all the ammo you get to load and there are no options to increase it. Perhaps if  you added the extended barrel mod then you could also increase the magazine.
Like CanRay said, run it by your GM, perhaps with the extended barrel mod as a choice of a way to allow it.

[RHat]

Strictly speaking, the rules do not specify that - it does not say that it cannot be applied to non-clip weapons or that it can only be applied to clip-fed weapons.  You can interpret it to imply that, I suppose, but that just leaves certain weapons further out in the cold.

[Mantis]

Strictly speaking both mods apply to clips, not magazines. There is no reference to magazines in either mod's description. If it could be applied to any loading type then there would be no reason for increased cylinder for revolvers, it would all be covered under extended clip. You'd have to get pretty liberal with the rules reading to say that it can be applied to magazines.
That said, I don't disagree that there should be a mod to allow this. I suggested tying it to extended barrel for the shotgun. It would be easier perhaps for sport rifles depending on how the internal magazine is set up.

[RHat]

Strictly speaking both mods apply to clips, not magazines. There is no reference to magazines in either mod's description. If it could be applied to any loading type then there would be no reason for increased cylinder for revolvers, it would all be covered under extended clip. You'd have to get pretty liberal with the rules reading to say that it can be applied to magazines.
That said, I don't disagree that there should be a mod to allow this. I suggested tying it to extended barrel for the shotgun. It would be easier perhaps for sport rifles depending on how the internal magazine is set up.

Note that the posted example was a parallel magazine tube, which would not require extension.

[CanRay]

We're having the Clips vs. Magazines fight again, we have to stop doing that.  FastJack is getting cranky about them and often blames me!

[Mantis]

RHat, the posted example is a purpose built weapon rather than a modification of an existing one. Much like there are purpose built weapons in the game that 'break the rules' for guns. If the OP wanted a purpose built shotgun with those features he can just ask his GM. But by the RAW, you can't do it to an existing weapon with a magazine feed.
CanRay, I'm not starting that argument. The game makes a rule distinction between clips and magazines in such a way so the layman can tell what they are talking about. I have to assume that distinction applies to every reference to clips or magazines in the rules else madness ensues  . If someone wants to change it to apply to both clips and magazines in their game that is their choice. By RAW it does not.

[RHat]

RHat, the posted example is a purpose built weapon rather than a modification of an existing one. Much like there are purpose built weapons in the game that 'break the rules' for guns. If the OP wanted a purpose built shotgun with those features he can just ask his GM. But by the RAW, you can't do it to an existing weapon with a magazine feed.
CanRay, I'm not starting that argument. The game makes a rule distinction between clips and magazines in such a way so the layman can tell what they are talking about. I have to assume that distinction applies to every reference to clips or magazines in the rules else madness ensues  . If someone wants to change it to apply to both clips and magazines in their game that is their choice. By RAW it does not.

I'm just saying, as an addtion, it would be more likely to be built parallel to rather than as an extension of.  The result would probably still be bulkier, though.

[Mantis]

Ah I see. Yeah probably. It would require more than just adding a larger capacity clip/magazine though. The feed mechanism needs to be changed up to have parallel magazines for one thing which makes it more appropriate for additional clip (assuming GM lets you) rather than the extended clip (again, GM permission, cuz it ain't RAW).
Honestly, I'd rather just go to the GM and show the pic of that KAL tech gun and ask if I could have one rather than trying to mod a Defiance to act like one. Or just go with one of the clip fed shotguns in the game and mod that instead. Simple and doesn't require GM permission.

[RHat]

...  See, I was talking about Additional Clip.

[daniel.fairhaven]

Thank you all for your discussion on the topic. It does make sense, although I thought the Add' Clip and Ext' Clip incl most guns and the Revolver mod was an addendum to the rule... *shrugs*

Additional Clip.



-k

Excellent image, may help sell my concept to the GM.

[Aryeonos]

I give shotguns the extra clip mod all the time for NPC weapons, I mean, things like the NeoStead just make sense. Why empty your tube when you can just switch over to lethal ammo, or from gel rounds to freeze foam? I'd let you put the extra mag option on the shotgun, if you got it at the time of purchase, as part of the base weapon no problem.