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warhawk. underrated?

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Michael Chandra

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« Reply #60 on: <05-03-13/1617:51> »
You need a Tiffani Needler then.
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UmaroVI

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« Reply #61 on: <05-03-13/1702:00> »
The Fubuki is what you replace the Thunderbolt with if circumstances call for a light pistol.  Though, comparing an unmodified Fubuki to a modified Warhawk isn't a fair comparison.

Exactly. The Fubuki is not uniformly better than the Warhawk.

The Thunderbolt is an overall better weapon than the Warhawk outside of the niche of vehicles/drones.

The Fubuki is a tradeoff compared to the Thunderbolt and it really depends mostly on how much Stick-n-shock is used and how much you care about concealability.

Anarkitty

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« Reply #62 on: <05-03-13/1817:54> »
The Fubuki is what you replace the Thunderbolt with if circumstances call for a light pistol.  Though, comparing an unmodified Fubuki to a modified Warhawk isn't a fair comparison.

I would call it fair if the modified Warhawk is still just over 1/4 the price of the Fubuki.  In a sense, I am treating the SA Warhawk as a complete weapon that just has one less mod slot that a "stock" model.

I will freely admit that an unmodified Warhawk has far fewer advantages over the Fubuki.  It is a more specialized weapon than the SA version, and absolutely less effective, having half the rate of fire.


RHat

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« Reply #63 on: <05-03-13/2039:37> »
The Fubuki is what you replace the Thunderbolt with if circumstances call for a light pistol.  Though, comparing an unmodified Fubuki to a modified Warhawk isn't a fair comparison.

I would call it fair if the modified Warhawk is still just over 1/4 the price of the Fubuki.  In a sense, I am treating the SA Warhawk as a complete weapon that just has one less mod slot that a "stock" model.

I will freely admit that an unmodified Warhawk has far fewer advantages over the Fubuki.  It is a more specialized weapon than the SA version, and absolutely less effective, having half the rate of fire.



At that price, I don't really consider the difference in cost all that relevant, though - it's just too minor.
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Ninja137

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« Reply #64 on: <05-04-13/0911:29> »
Wouldn't the Ares Viper Slivergun heavy pistol be the best non-High Power pistol if used with AP Flechettes? 8P(f) with -3 AP mod? Plus it has BF.

JoeNapalm

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« Reply #65 on: <05-04-13/0942:31> »
Wouldn't the Ares Viper Slivergun heavy pistol be the best non-High Power pistol if used with AP Flechettes? 8P(f) with -3 AP mod? Plus it has BF.

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Michael Chandra

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« Reply #66 on: <05-04-13/0946:47> »
I actually like the idea of the Cavalier Sheriff. 8P/-4 with 5 rounds. With a called shot you'll injure even a Force-8 spirit with just a single nethit.
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SpatulaODoom

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« Reply #67 on: <05-04-13/1203:00> »
If you want to talk about unmodified weapons then just buy two warhawks and use one in each hand. You get to fire twice an IP, double the ammo, and you're still spending 500 cred on the two guns while only taking a -2 on the second shot without  (the unmodified fubuki takes a -1 if you haven't already spent an action unfolding the stock or knew ahead enough to unfold it before the shooting starts). Heck buy four of them and spend the extra 1000 on hiring a couple of thug bullet stoppers to wield the other two for you.
You can say a 2000 cred price tag is nothing but it is it's more expensive than most weapons short of sniper/heavy. In the core book there's nothing more expensive right up until you hit the Aug(ish) multi-weapons platform that starts out as an assault rifle. It's an entire month worth of food/rent/entertainment/utilities/etc for your average person in setting. I've got characters that have finished entire runs with 2000 or less credits worth of profit.

I like how everyone's poh pohing the warhawks ammo capacity without saying anything about the Thunderbolt having 12 shots for a gun that only fires short bursts. As I mentioned in my little analysis (hopefully some people read it) that's four trigger pulls. Extended Mag gets you 15 while with an Additional Clip modification that's only 18 rounds (75% for pistol sized weapons).

To keep the discussion going: If you want to talk about a fully modded out weapon what would you pick for the Fubuki?

For the Hawk there's a couple of ways to go.
The workhorse.
Firing mode Semi-auto (Natch)
Personalized Grip
Internal smartgun (cheaper than external due to low base cost)
Ammo skip system.
You can buy one of these for the exact same price as a thunderbolt with a Smartgun system and no mods, or two for slightly less than what a Fubuki with no mods and an external smartgun add on costs. You can mix in a specialty rounds if that's your thing, a couple of stickies, a couple of AV rounds, one tracker round and one capsule round filled with something nasty. Just practice your Vin Diesel growl.

The crazy horse
Firing mode: Large change- Full auto
Personalized grip
Expanded cylinder
External smartgun
If auto-fire is the be all end all then here you go. Sure you've only got one shot, but during that truncated full-auto you've got a medium machine gun in the palm of your hand. Recoil's gonna be a bit of a problem, but it's great fun for the Sam with a gyromount in his cyberarm. Since we're going crazy we might as well load those silly Armor Piercing Flechetts in the bugger too. So we're looking at one attack with 15P+ net hits versus impact armor with a -2ap mod and dealing with a modest 3 points of uncompensated recoil (barring strength/body or over-modification)... This is gonna get messy.
3500cred is a bit pricy but now that I've imagined this up my mostly insane ork street sam/doctor is probably going to throw money at people until he gets one.

Side note. Sadly the sliver gun can't fire APF ammo. If you read the entry it says it fires metal slivers that "count as" flechette ammo. Not sure exactly how the ammo works conceptually for that but my reading is that it can't use other types of ammo.

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« Last Edit: <05-04-13/1208:28> by SpatulaODoom »

JoeNapalm

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« Reply #68 on: <05-04-13/2010:35> »

The Sherriff is in GH2.

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Aryeonos

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« Reply #69 on: <05-04-13/2013:09> »
The Sheriff also benefits from the Expanded Cylinder mod the most, and is my favourite revolver along with the deputy. Give it additional clip x2 and mod it to burst fire!
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CanRay

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« Reply #70 on: <05-04-13/2113:52> »
The Sheriff also benefits from the Expanded Cylinder mod the most, and is my favourite revolver along with the deputy. Give it additional clip x2 and mod it to burst fire!
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« Reply #71 on: <05-04-13/2120:48> »
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UmaroVI

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« Reply #72 on: <05-04-13/2225:34> »
Wouldn't the Ares Viper Slivergun heavy pistol be the best non-High Power pistol if used with AP Flechettes? 8P(f) with -3 AP mod? Plus it has BF.

It got errata'd to be 8P(f)/+5, so it would be 8P(f)/+0 if your GM allows APF ammo with it (which is questionable - the Slivergun doesn't use flechettes, it uses wacky exotic ammo that has the same stats as flechettes).

It's not that great of a gun because it's difficult to get 5 RC on it. The Thunderbolt has 2 inherent RC. Also, Stick-n-shock or APDS ammo in the Ruger are generally better, depending what you are shooting at.

Aryeonos

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« Reply #73 on: <05-04-13/2231:52> »
The Sheriff also benefits from the Expanded Cylinder mod the most, and is my favourite revolver along with the deputy. Give it additional clip x2 and mod it to burst fire!
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JoeNapalm

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« Reply #74 on: <05-05-13/0400:41> »
The Sheriff also benefits from the Expanded Cylinder mod the most, and is my favourite revolver along with the deputy. Give it additional clip x2 and mod it to burst fire!

How does it benefit "the most"? Are you giving it 8 shots, even though it only starts with 5? The mod increases a revolver from 6 to 8 shots. The equivalent increase in a 5 shot revolver would be 6.667 shots...I'd call it 7, and that's being generous, as when it comes to building a mechanism you can't round up with physical tolerances, only 6 "whole" bullets would fit.

And how do you put Additional "Clips" on a revolver? It doesn't use clips. (Of course, neither do most, if any, of the weapons in Shadowrun, but it doesn't use magazines, either.) Additional cylinders are possible, and has been done, but it is unwieldy, impractical, and would carry a much more punitive Concealment penalty, considering you wouldn't even be able to put the resulting abomination in a holster.


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