[Mäx]

At the homepage.
shadowruntabletop.com

[Mirikon]

They have a rating 3 pilot program (same rating as the Lynx, IIRC). The targeting autosoft is the the same rating as the one the Lynx has, too.

And again, you're looking at the drones only on their own, not as part of a tactical concept. The real key here is about how the drones interact with mages. Throw one in the face of a mage, and suddenly they have to worry about that, rather than summoning spirits or casting other spells, etc., while the rest of your group geeks him. When your mage is being targeted, swords swinging all about the sammy with the assault rifle will make him have to deal with that, rather than the mage slinging manabolts at him. Again, the duelist is like the offensive lineman. You never really notice it (except when someone calls Annexation of Puerto Rico) unless something's gone wrong. But when you use it right, everything else just gets that much easier. Think in terms of a team, rather than individuals.

[Michael Chandra]

Found it, somehow. So Run Faster has been taken off the list for now, whereas Run And Gun (aka Arsenal: Guns) has been put in now instead. Somehow I strongly suspect this is related to how hard it is to properly playtest the BP- and Karma-gen systems, whereas creating new toys is easier.

So this confirms my suspicion that they're splitting Arsenal in two: A gun+armor (and martial-arts) book and a vehicle book (Rigger 5). *gives self pat on shoulder*

---------

Fun part of throwing 5 weak drones at a guy: Imagine a Summoning Spellcasting Dodge-19 Mystic Adept. Then he gets five of these around him. Now his dodge pool is down to 14. Suddenly the Street Sam's short burst is going to hit.

[Crunch]

That's actually a good thing. One of the major problems Riggers had in 4E was that they got a chapter, rather than a book.

Well the think is Run and Gun is likely to come out soonish(it's actually listed as an upcoming book), where's as Rigger 5 comes who knows when.
And drone riggers are practically unplayable until the modding rules come out(as standard drones are made out of wet tissue paper)

Actually Jumped In Drones are pretty resilient. It's only the autopilot rigger that has a problem.

They've also suggested that rigger 5 will be earlier in the edition cycle.

[Mäx]

Throw one in the face of a mage, and suddenly they have to worry about that, rather than summoning spirits or casting other spells, etc., while the rest of your group geeks him.

Even mage propaply has a dice advantage over the drone and can thus pretty much just ignore it

That's actually a good thing. One of the major problems Riggers had in 4E was that they got a chapter, rather than a book.

Well the think is Run and Gun is likely to come out soonish(it's actually listed as an upcoming book), where's as Rigger 5 comes who knows when.
And drone riggers are practically unplayable until the modding rules come out(as standard drones are made out of wet tissue paper)

Actually Jumped In Drones are pretty resilient. It's only the autopilot rigger that has a problem.

Maybe harder to hit, but their still build out of wet tissue papers.

[Michael Chandra]

Either they take the damage or they take the -1 penalty per attack, which lets others launch the heavier attacks with ease.

[Mirikon]

Either they take the damage or they take the -1 penalty per attack, which lets others launch the heavier attacks with ease.

Exactly. When playing the numbers game, you don't look at the numbers individually. You look at how they stack up together. Intelligently used, the Duelist in groups can ruin your whole day. And when the modding rules come out, there's going to be massive fun to be had.

[firebug]

Mind if I ask how you determine the DV of the sword-arms as 6?  I have a player who wants one but we have no idea how to determine its damage.

[Michael Chandra]

Huh. Good one. I'd put them at 7P/-2. (Body as Strength, basic Sword is +3P/-2.)

Edit: That is, by the way, directly based on attacking with Mechanical Arms from SR4 Arsenal.

[Psikerlord]

That's actually a good thing. One of the major problems Riggers had in 4E was that they got a chapter, rather than a book.

Well the think is Run and Gun is likely to come out soonish(it's actually listed as an upcoming book), where's as Rigger 5 comes who knows when.
And drone riggers are practically unplayable until the modding rules come out(as standard drones are made out of wet tissue paper)

Actually Jumped In Drones are pretty resilient. It's only the autopilot rigger that has a problem.

They've also suggested that rigger 5 will be earlier in the edition cycle.

I really hope Rigger 5 comes out early. You cant really be a rigger without being able to customise stuff, thats the main fun bit!

[calaen]

... I would dearly love to see Rigger 5, considering my first SR5 character is a rigger....

[Maddoux1]

Except that you can't chameleon coat one because there are no rules for it, and any random jerk with a R6 jammer  forces them to rely on their awful Pilot program.

So yes, get within 30 meters of the 1,200Y piece of equipment and suffer Noise.  All drones have this issue.  Such is the danger of being a Drone Rigger.  Or doing anything with tech at all.  Dog brains are the worst.

They're in the way, but with 6 dice, they won't hit anything so who cares?  With its 8 dice to soak damage, 6 to avoid it and an 8 box damage track, any reasonably competent combatant will dispatch groups of them fairly effortlessly.  The increase in damage done by melee attacks doesn't matter when these things won't ever actually hit anyone who wasn't already a lead candidate to get stuffed in a locker by the little old lady who empties the waste bins at night.

Unless you buy more powerful autosofts for them.  Sure, its expensive, but you can bring them up to 9 dice, which is a fair attack roll.  Its no Prime Runner, but its on par with my running group.

They're an amusing idea that completely fails in its implementation due to a combination of a terrible Pilot rating, a terrible Autosoft rating, and a lack of drone modification rules.

Humanoid Drones have always been considered a novelty in SR, and never have been terribly effective at what they do.  The description even points out that they're a novelty and are rarely used.  They're a niche product, and you really have to think outside of the box to use them effectively.

Also, remember that the drones are a jab at Renraku.  Their ineptitude is part of that charm.

If you chose not to use them, man, it is your choice.  Less sec people expecting my little tricks.

[Michael Chandra]

... I would dearly love to see Rigger 5, considering my first SR5 character is a rigger....

I personally suspect it will be one of the first two Core books after Run&Gun, but we'll have to see whether my hypothesis is right. ^_^

[firebug]

I'm torn between wanting Rigger 5 and Data Trails to come out first.  Honestly Run and Gun doesn't interest me at all.  C'est la vie.