[Xenon]

Maybe they intend to give TMs an echo that give them direct connection if they physically touch the device.
Such echo would be the best solution to the whole TM and direct connection issue imo.


As for OP;

You can let your drone or B&E expert bring a 50 meter cable into the building and attach it to the UDC of the device (and throw the other end of the cable out of the window to the waiting Decker).

Or let your drone or B&E expert bring the cyberdeck into the building and attach the cyberdeck's retractable cable to the UDC of the device.
- Now your decker can be outside in the van. wireless connecting to the cyberdeck that is physically attached to the device and use that to establish a direct connection. 100% legal according to RAW.


(and the above is little or not different at all from letting your drone or B&E expert bring a data tap into the building and attach it to the UDC of the device - but whatever....)


edit. there is one distinct difference. a data tap cost almost nothing. you don't have to break in to retrieve it once you are done.
...and RAI is to bring the decker physically close to the device. go with the team inside.



As RAI is that you physical need to access the device and to physically bring the decker close to the device, then the best (only) solution for TMs is to house rule a "Skin contact"-Echo that let them establish a direct connection by physically touching the device. This should have been in SR5 core. Without it you pretty much cripple TMs in this department.

Datatap's intention isn't to allow direct connection.  It's to allow connection at all to non wireless systems.  You find a wire, place the tap, and suddenly you have access to the basement servers without having to kill 4 levels worth of guards.

Data tap have two uses.

1) Give you wireless access to a wired or throwback device
- by attaching it to a wire (or the UDC of the device) and turn it's wireless ON

2) Give you direct connection to two devices connected by a wire
- by attaching the data tap on the wire and then physically attach your cyberdeck to the data tap
- you get direct connection to both devices attached to the cable you use your data tap on

[Agonar]

Until (and if) they bring back the Skinlink Echo, I am allowing the TM in my group to do this.  Usually, he passes off a small bug drone to one of the other members, and then when they get to the thing that needs hacked because it's not wireless, the PC plugs the drone in, the TM jumps into the drone, and viola.

At first, this seemed like a rather cheesy way of getting around it, but then I started thinking about just how vulnerable drones are, specially the microdrones.  And a TM being jumped into them...  If someone hacks and Data Spike's the drone, that's matrix damage to the TM.  If someone blows it up, that's Biofeedback, and then Dumpshock.

Personally, I would have liked if Skinlink was included in Core with the echoes, as another incentive to keep the group pretty much together and participating.  But, so far this is working.

[firebug]

Right now, the lack of options for a TM to have a direct connection are why I'm curious about this.  It certainly isn't stated that it works, but I'm surprised it isn't stated at all anywhere.  I mean, with the new way the grid works, is it no longer possible to route a connection through another device?  It may be that way.  But then, isn't that entirely how accessing hardwired systems works?

It's definitely a layer of complexity that isn't mentioned in the current rules...  Man I wish Data Trails was released.  But unless I decide to start purchasing multiple copies of every SR5 pdf, I can't exactly do much to speed up the process.

[martinchaen]

firebug
Houserule it until proven otherwise.

To my mind, the whole "you can no longer route a wireless signal through a wired device" makes absolutely no sense anyway.

Short of "because game balance", there is just no theoretical way to explain how a) a wave-based radio signal (which is what all wireless is, ultimately) is somehow faster than electrons (or even light, as optical computing is in more than research stages at this point in time) moving through a wire, and b) how the new and improves wireless matrix suddenly can't interact with wired devices.

Even if both of the above somehow were true, it clearly is possible to bridge the gap, so to speak, between a wired, non-wireless device, by using a data tap on a wire and/or plugging a wireless device into a universal data connector.

The idea that somehow, some way, the device plugged into the universal data connector loses it's wireless capability is simply ludicrous. Sure, a device may have been constructed that way from the manufacturer (today, many laptop brands come with a driver-level feature that disables the wireless NIC if the wired NIC is active), it would take a proficient computer expert (aka hacker) all of 1 minute to disable or hack said feature.

I get that the designers wanted to restructure the Matrix to make it more interesting for deckers, and to a degree I think they succeeded. As I see it, in the process they applied some glaringly faulty logic to how computer systems work at their very basic level; no degree of development of new protocols are going to stop wired signals being faster than wireless ones quite simply because of physics, and nor is new wireless technology going to somehow invalidate pretty basic device-to-device protocols. The ability to interconnect devices, and route through said devices, is an intrinsic feature of the Matrix even after the redesign. If this wasn't possible, a whole host of trouble would arise as a consequence, considering the amount of hardwired systems still prevalent in the setting.

TL;DR
If I were you, I'd house rule it so that a) Technomancers begin the game with the skinlink echo, or b) Technomancers, and "ordinary" deckers, can attach a commlink or cyberdeck to a universal data connector (or to the universal data connector of a datatap in turn attached to a wire) in order to hack a non-wireless system.

[firebug]

Well the question isn't that the tapped device loses it's wireless, it's whether or not it counts as a "direct connection" if I'm using the data tap to access it while wirelessly accessing the datatap.

An example being...  Say there's a Rating 10 security host that all the cameras are slaved to.  It's too strong to just hack directly into it.  A mundane decker would just try and find a way to directly connect to a peripheral device like the mentioned cameras, since then he can mark one of them going against their (significantly lower) defenses instead of their master's.  So for a TM, if you put a data tap on to one of the cameras, the datatap is now directly connected to it.  It states that if I were to plug into the datatap, I'd also have a direct connection to the camera.

But RAW, it doesn't say either way about whether or not a TM (or anyone) can wirelessly access that datatap to now have a direct connection to the camera as well.  That's where my comment about "routing through other devices" comes in.  It has to be possible since otherwise a datatap wouldn't allow access to a wired system.  The speed of the connection doesn't matter, since the wireless camera would still be accessable regardless.  Just that without a direct connection, it will use the vastly stronger Host's defenses.

Without a way to direct-connect and create flaws in a system, TMs have it way harder since that means the only option is to go against the host's defenses, either repeatedly from on the grid, or enter the host and risk fighting with IC every turn.

[martinchaen]

I don't see how it would not count as a direct connection.

Looking at the rules for direct connections, page 232:

Devices have a universal data connector, which is the global standard for connecting devices together for power and data exchange. If you have a cable, you can connect to the device directly. Cyberdecks and datajacks come with a meter of built-in retractable microfilament data cable, or you can always buy a cable for about five nuyen per meter (some devices, especially those installed in buildings, are connected by cables to mitigate noise). When you use a direct connection, you ignore all noise modifiers and modifiers due to being on different grids or the public grid. It’s just you and the device.

OK, so cyberdecks and datajacks come with built-in data cables, and all devices (including throwbacks) have universal data connectors.

Looking at the rules for personas, first on the description of it on page 218:

A persona is more or less what it sounds like: a person in the Matrix. A persona is the combination of a user and a device that gets the user onto the Matrix. The fact that the device has a user overrides the device’s normal icon status, turning it into a persona. A persona is usually based on a commlink, cyberdeck, or rigged vehicle or drone, although technomancers are a sort of device-less persona.

All right, we know that once a hacker (decker or technomancer) interfaces with the Matrix he becomes a persona, and that said persona is either based on a device (decker) or not (technomancer).

Further on, actual rules for devices and personas, page 234:

A device in the Matrix is any wireless device in the real world.

When a person uses a device to connect to the Matrix, the device’s icon is subsumed by the persona’s icon, so it’s basically gone from the Matrix until the persona jacks out. You can only run one persona at a time; switching requires you to reboot both the device you’re currently on and the device to which you want to shift your persona.

Finally, about icons, from page 216:

icon:The virtual representation of a device, persona, file, or host in the Matrix

Bear with me, all of the above lays the foundation for the next part.

From the Brute Force and Hack On The Fly descriptions, page 238 and 240, respectively:

You can use this action to mark a target without obtaining the normal permissions you need. <znip> If you succeed in this action, you place one mark on it.

You can use this action to mark a target without getting the normal permissions. <znip> When targeting an icon, you put one mark on it, up to a maximum of three marks per icon.

Note that Brute Force doesn't actually spell out that the target is an Icon, which could be problematic if you want to rules lawyer this debate all the way to hell.

Ok, so we know that every device connected to the matrix shows up as icons in the matrix (leaving aside display filters for now), and we know that when a hacker interfaces with the matrix their device icon is supplanted by their persona. The persona of a hacker can take actions against icons, such as another device, for example a commlink or cyberdeck. We also know that a device can be directly connected to another device through universal data connectors.

This is where the gray area appears. Nothing in the rules state how the direct connection works; the relevant section only states "It’s just you and the device." In my opinion, it is safe to assume that if a decker can connect his deck to a universal data connector on another device and interface with said device when his persona is on his deck, he can also wirelessly connect to his deck from a second deck and perform the same action.

The matrix actions make no distinction between whether or not a device is directly or wirelessly connected; they simply state that the target/icon, and this is important, is marked if you succeed in your Brute Force/Hack On The Fly action. Since the target HAS to be an icon with the whole "everything on the Matrix is an icon" definition, it logically follows that if a device is directly connected to another device where one of them is wireless, then:
a) the wireless device can be accessed as normal by it's owner (example, a cyberdeck)
b) the wired device can be access by a persona on the wireless device (as described in the direct connections section)
c) the wireless device is vulnerable to hacking by a third party (or by someone inviting marks on it)

Since personas do not reside on the device they are hacking in SR5 (unlike in SR4 where the persona entered the node), the persona just needs to be able to access the wireless device in order to meet the requirement to have a direct connection to the wired device on the other end. No other explanation makes sense to me, as hackers by definition "breaks the rules of the matrix". If you can't plug a wireless device into a non-wireless device and then hack the wireless device, there's something wrong with the system. Directly connecting to a device doesn't automagically make the entire matrix disappear and leave "just you and the device", it just means that until you make that direct connection you will not see a non-wireless device as an icon and you will be affected by noise. Once the connection is made, however, noise is no longer an issue and the icon of both devices is likely to be equally bright.

As I've described, nothing in the rules specifically prevents or allows this type of connection. However, in the example above, the wired device simply wouldn't show up in the matrix for anyone not connected to the device that had a wired connection to it. Once the owner/hacker connected to the wireless device that was connected to the wired device, though, the wired device should show up as an icon in the matrix, and thus be ripe for the picking, so to speak.

Rules-lawyer all you want, to me this is the only thing that makes sense and the way I would play it.

TL;DR
To my mind, a decker/technomancer could attach a wireless device (commlink, cyberdeck, even a datatap as long as it's wireless is switched on (and preferably running silent)) to a non-wireless device's universal data connector, hack or access said wireless icon and then see the wired device as an icon on the matrix, thus making it a viable target.

[EDIT]
Lynchpin to my argument:

1. A hacker, such as the one in the example on page 224, attaches his cyberdeck to a maglock slaved to a host, establishing a direct connection between the the maglock and the deck
2. The hacker, successfully gaining a mark on the maglock, also gains a mark on the device's master; a host, which is by definition a wireless non-physical entity
3. The description of PANs and WANs state that devices in a WAN count as directly connected, implying that wirelessly connected devices can also benefit from direct conenctions, at least in some cases
4. This is also supported by the fact that devices in a PAN are vulnerable to the same direct connection hack as above, and gaining a mark on a directly connected device that is a member of a PAN also results in a mark on the Master device (though it is not stated on way or another if the benefits of a PAN can be extended to a device that is directly connected to another member)

[Dakka]

Yea that's about the size of it.  To get a Direct Connection you have to directly connect your deck to the device via a Universal Data Connector and a data cable.  I suppose in theory you could place the tap and then connect to it with a data cable, but that seems off the mark of their intended use.

[Namikaze]

I think it's important to distinguish between a Direct Connection, a Direct Neural Interface, and a direct connection.

Direct Connection: requires hard-lined connection between devices.
Direct Neural Interface (DNI): requires a hard connection to a (meta)human brain and a device.
direct connection: just means two connections that talk without interference, networking, etc.

I just thought that should be cleared up in the event that anyone is confused.  If anyone disagrees with my simplistic definitions, please let me know.

[Insaniac99]

I think it's important to distinguish between a Direct Connection, a Direct Neural Interface, and a direct connection.

Direct Connection: requires hard-lined connection between devices.
Direct Neural Interface (DNI): requires a hard connection to a (meta)human brain and a device.
direct connection: just means two connections that talk without interference, networking, etc.

I just thought that should be cleared up in the event that anyone is confused.  If anyone disagrees with my simplistic definitions, please let me know.

I believe the DNI definition is incorrect, you can achieve a DNI via wireless if you have the means to do so (implanted commlink/deck; datajack; trodes; Technomancer)

[JackVII]

I believe the DNI definition is incorrect, you can achieve a DNI via wireless if you have the means to do so (implanted commlink/deck; datajack; trodes; Technomancer)

Agreed, unless Namikaze was implying that the device-brain connection was between the datajack, implanted commlink/deck, control rig and the brain. I do think that has to exist (or through the non-invasive trode connection). But I don't think you have to run a cable from your datajack to your smartgun in order to gain the DNI benefits of a smartgun.

[Namikaze]

Correct - I was merely stating that a connection had to exist between Brain at one end and Device at the other.