[kyoto kid]

Adept Way does not count towards positive qualities.

It's like Martial Arts .. it's a quality but doesn't count toward positive limit.

...where's that in the rules?  I've avoided it because of the fact it took 20 of the 25 karma limit.

http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=17166.msg431661#msg431661

...thanks.  Still a big Karma expenditure though.

[Pap Renvela]

Yes, a big karma expenditure.

If you're in a short campaign- probably not worth it.

If you are going to be in it for the long haul you could be gaining up .5pp for every 2 magic levels in addition to whatever other effects it gives you. Mysads in particular benefit as they normally do not gain PP after chargen unless they make the sacrifice to take a PP instead of any of the other options available to them at initiation. It also opens up some metamagics/enhancements that are interesting.

And if you are doing a cyber-adept, Burnout's Way at 15 points does wonders.

[kyoto kid]

...yeah for a pure boxer adept, the only suitable ones to take are Athlete or Warrior.  Warrior gives you more bonuses for offensive/defensive  powers but the bonus for the Improved Attribute power is hard to pass up if the character is looking to use adept powers instead of augmentations to boost themselves.


Back in 4E I actually has a Boxer Adept who I played a bit.  She ended up fiarly tough at Chargen as that edition used build points instead of priority levels. and one could have up to 35 points in qualities. The downside was (until Street Magic) Adept improvement was brutal as to get a power point you had to pay karma to both initiate and increase your magic attribute.  Even then, the PP rule in Street Magic was "optional". That was one of the things which soured me on 4 and I caused me to go back to 3E.

I took a stab at trying to build her in 5E but it's tricky, especially without using one of the ways as I tried to keep her as close to the original concept as I could. The only major change was I swapped out Pilot Ground Vehicle for Longarms skill as she does not have enough starting resources for a vehicle (and a cajun with her trusty huntin' rifle just made sense).  Alas, she doesn't have the high strength the sample builds in the thread have (7 instead of 10).

The major drawback of a non augmented human unarmed adept is there is little to increase the dice pool until one begins to earn karma, and then it is really expensive either improving skills past 6, and/or increasing Agility through Initiation and PPs.  Having a high DV is nice and all, but if your opponent can dodge a good number of of your attacks, it doesn't matter very much.

[Pap Renvela]

The sample character that the OP posted has DP 13 plus whatever attribute boost adds, most likely 15DP.

My sample charter with attribute boost probably has 17DP (19 if counterstriking/finishing move)
Since the next 2 PP will increase Combat Sense to 8 and add Increased attribute (STR)[1] my DP wouldn't improve and we're talking 104 Karma... on the other hand improving unarmed if you wanted from 6 to 12 would only be 114- just ten more karma.

[kyoto kid]

....the character I rebuilt has a DP of 12 that was as far as I could get it, as the "Ways" in 3E/4E were more fluff and didn't give bonuses to purchasing powers.  She also did not take a Mentor Spirit so no "free" powers or extra bonuses. The only one that fits with her background would be Gator and the benefits (+1 to intimidation and Inertia Strike) really don't work well (the first one particularly useless because of her low CHA).  As she was a "disciplined pugilist", any mentor that involved a berserk reaction (like Shark) wouldn't be a good fit.

I would have also expected the "Classic Boxing" martial art to be centred more around the types of punches and moves one would actually use in the ring (jab, cross, uppercut, clinch, "rope a dope") The only technique that makes sense is the Feint (Haymaker would be more appropriate to an undisciplined style of fighting like brawling). Any attack that involves a called shot would be worthless with her low pool.

The average hits she would get off a pool of 12 could easily be countered by someone defending against the attack.  As she was more into the power of her punch, she has Penetrating Strike 2 and Critical Strike giving her a punch of 8 DV and -2 AP.

In a lower powered/street level campaign she'd probably do pretty well. In most standard campaigns and in Missions where characters/NPCs have higher defence pools, not so much.

[Pap Renvela]

In missions play about 13-14DP is needed against average opponents  using full defense so 12 is a bit low. the OP's and my sample character's would have an easier time with 15 and 17DPs. Of course, not every NPC should be in full defense every time you attack.

Take the mage in Chasin the Wind..his initiative is 6 +1d6: half the time he doesn't have the 10 initiative needed to do the interrupt. Even if he has the ten, if he don't roll 5 or 6, it's the only action he does for that combat turn. And without full defense that mage goes from 13DP to 6DP, huge difference.

[Tarislar]

Meta   B   Human(7)      
Magic   D   Adept 2      

ADEPT POWERS            
Attribute Boost (AGI) [1]            0.25
Improved Physical Attribute (AGI) [1]            Discounted-.5

Does Boost & Improved stack? 

Also, Flip Meta & Magic around,  4 more skill points.

I'd find a better way.  If you can't stack STR like I originally tried, then there are much better options out there.

[Pap Renvela]

Meta   B   Human(7)      
Magic   D   Adept 2      

ADEPT POWERS            
Attribute Boost (AGI) [1]            0.25
Improved Physical Attribute (AGI) [1]            Discounted-.5

Does Boost & Improved stack? 

Also, Flip Meta & Magic around,  4 more skill points.

I'd find a better way.  If you can't stack STR like I originally tried, then there are much better options out there.

Originally Elf so Meta B Magic D better than the other way around but for humans your right Meta D Magic B

[kyoto kid]

In missions play about 13-14DP is needed against average opponents  using full defense so 12 is a bit low. the OP's and my sample character's would have an easier time with 15 and 17DPs. Of course, not every NPC should be in full defense every time you attack.

Take the mage in Chasin the Wind..his initiative is 6 +1d6: half the time he doesn't have the 10 initiative needed to do the interrupt. Even if he has the ten, if he don't roll 5 or 6, it's the only action he does for that combat turn. And without full defense that mage goes from 13DP to 6DP, huge difference.

...yeah 4E was a bit different as skills had a lower cap and you had to purchase your MA from 1 with build points.  Rarely did a character ever start with an MA higher than 5 as the cost for that last rating point was effectively doubled (for all attributes).  Hence there were a lots of 4's and 5s. 

This is where returning to the priority system improved the situation as if you selected an Adept at say priority C or B you automatically received a magic attribute rating (that could be increased to a maximum of of 6 using Special Attribute points) as well as bonus rating levels for one skill. Still, there is a limit of 1 attribute at rating 6 so for an adept focused in unarmed combat, it becomes a tradeoff, of doing more damage or having a higher pool. The Ways are a good means for getting a little more "mileage" out of purchasing powers but still a hefty Karma investment. Even though they do not count against the maximum for positive qualities, it pretty much limits which other qualities one takes especially if you want a a bit more in resources than the base 6,000¥, A rating 4 ID a couple licences and one month of low lifestyle can set you back almost 15,000¥ alone (wish they would have left Low Lifestyle priced at 1,000¥).  Doesn't leave a lot for other gear like armour,  weapons, and a halfway decent commlink even if you apply the full 10 Karma to resources.

As to the character,  here's how far I got before I gave up:

Hurricane Hannah (5E rebuild):

Priorities A: Attributes, B: Magic, C: Skills, D: Metatype, E: Resources

BOD: 5
AGIL: 5 (6)
STR  6 (7)
REA: 4 (5)
CHA: 2
INT: 4
LOG: 2
WIL: 4
EDG: 5
MAG: 6

Init: 9 + 2D6, Physical Track: 11, Stun Track: 10
Limits:  Physical: 8, Mental: 4, Social: 5

Qualities (Positive +21):

Adept (F)
High Pain Tolerance: 2 (14)
Natural Athlete (7)

(Negative -23)

Uneducated (-8)
Common/Mild allergy to Processed Soy (-10)
National SIN: CAS (-5)

Contacts:
Clancy [Fixer/Promoter] 4/3 (1 Karma)
Fast Eddie [Bookie] 3/2 (5 Karma)

Skills:

Computer 1 [DP 3] (needed to use Commlink)
Etiquette 3 (Street)  [DP 5/7]
Longarms 6 [DP 12]
Perception (visual) [DP 8/10]
Sneaking: 4 [DP 10]
Throwing Weapons (Blades) 5 [DP 11/13]
Unarmed Combat 6 [DP 12]

Skill Group: Athletics: 2
Gymnastics DP 10 (modified by Natural Athlete Quality)
Running DP 11 (modified by Natural Athlete Quality)
Swimming DP 9

Knowledge:

Arcadian/Cajun N
English: (Speak): 2 [DP 6/8]
Bars and Clubs (Low Class) 2 [DP 6/8]
Cuisine (Cajun) 1 [DP 5/7]
Sports (UFC) 1 [DP 5/7]
Underworld 2 [DP 6]

Adept Powers (6PP)

Combat Sense 2
Critical Strike (Unarmed)
Improved Physical Attribute 1 (AGI)
Improved Physical Attribute 1 (STR)
Improved Reflexes 1
Killing Hands
Penetrating Strike 2

Martial Arts : none
Augmentations: none

Resources 26,000 (10 Karma).