[incrdbil]

I'm looking at creating an alternate resolution system to speed up at least combat mechanics.

The current method of bucketload of dice to hit, bucketload in opposition, then bucketload to soak is just dragging down combat. Having a high end game, rolling 16 to 40 dice multiple times is just painful.

Ideally, I'd love to reduce combat to one dice roll at most, though two would be at least an improvement.


At first I thought of a pure pool-pool approach. You add up all of your modifiers. Do the same for the opposition.`Roll the difference (Called the Resolution rolll). If the total dice score is in favor of the attacker, count 5 and 6's as successes for the attacker, and ones as success for the defender. if the defenders pool as larger, score 5 and 6 as a defender success, and ones as  success for the attacker.

I tossed glitches and critical glitches from this system, not being worth he difficulty of retaining.

If the totals as equal, roll 1 dice. 5=6 is one net success for attacker, 1-2 is one net success for defender, 3-4 is no successes tie result.

Pre roll edge adds to dice totals. Post roll edge means in the resolution's, the edge user gets to roll additional dice equal to the number of dice that did not score a success for him.  For ties, you simply roll and additional dice.

If the atatcker hits, the net successes are added to the damage value. Defender applies AP as normal. Damage is reduced by Body+AV/3, rounded down. Edge used on defenses means you either add your edge value to your Body+ Armor, or you reduce damage by Body+AV/2, round down.

thoughts/ alternate suggestions?  (and please dont say "just play Shadowrun Anarchy. not interested in that at all)

I'd really be happy if the next edition moved away from the buckets of dice rolled multiple times approach.

[Sterling]

I'd really be happy if the next edition moved away from the buckets of dice rolled multiple times approach.

Heresy!!!

[Moonshine Fox]

Bucket of Dice resolution is so satisfying though!

In fairness, Shadowrun's combat is already down to two or three rolls. Roll combat check (check for glitch), possible dodge test if they can dodge, then damage resistance test. Hardest part can be all the little modifiers that one can add and subtract to the roll.

[Slipperychicken]

If you made defense and soak into flat numbers (1/3rd the relevant diepool, round up), then it would just be one roll per attack. People can "push the limit" on dodge and soak to make them 40% of the diepool instead of 1/3rd.

[Sipowitz]

I'm looking at creating an alternate resolution system to speed up at least combat mechanics.

The current method of bucketload of dice to hit, bucketload in opposition, then bucketload to soak is just dragging down combat. Having a high end game, rolling 16 to 40 dice multiple times is just painful.

Ideally, I'd love to reduce combat to one dice roll at most, though two would be at least an improvement.


At first I thought of a pure pool-pool approach. You add up all of your modifiers. Do the same for the opposition.`Roll the difference (Called the Resolution rolll). If the total dice score is in favor of the attacker, count 5 and 6's as successes for the attacker, and ones as success for the defender. if the defenders pool as larger, score 5 and 6 as a defender success, and ones as  success for the attacker.

I tossed glitches and critical glitches from this system, not being worth he difficulty of retaining.

If the totals as equal, roll 1 dice. 5=6 is one net success for attacker, 1-2 is one net success for defender, 3-4 is no successes tie result.

Pre roll edge adds to dice totals. Post roll edge means in the resolution's, the edge user gets to roll additional dice equal to the number of dice that did not score a success for him.  For ties, you simply roll and additional dice.

If the atatcker hits, the net successes are added to the damage value. Defender applies AP as normal. Damage is reduced by Body+AV/3, rounded down. Edge used on defenses means you either add your edge value to your Body+ Armor, or you reduce damage by Body+AV/2, round down.

thoughts/ alternate suggestions?  (and please dont say "just play Shadowrun Anarchy. not interested in that at all)

I'd really be happy if the next edition moved away from the buckets of dice rolled multiple times approach.

That's real swingy and Shadowrun is not set up for that much of a swing.

[Tecumseh]

Here are some ideas from SR4A, p. 75:

Alternate Combat
While the advanced Shadowrun rules will explore a variety of combat options,
you can also consider one of these methods:
• Rather than handling all combat as an Opposed Test, you can handle
ranged combat as a Success Test with a threshold based on range (1 Short,
2 Medium, 3 Long, 4 Extreme). Some situational modifiers will affect
threshold rather than dice pool, such as blind fire, cover, etc.
• To cut down on dice rolling during combat, you could drop Damage
Resistance Tests entirely, reducing combat to a single Opposed Test. In this
case, Armor would deduct directly from the attack’s DV.
• Cover as Attack Modifier: Rather than applying Cover as a Defense
Modifier, groups may opt to reduce the number of rolls by having cover provide
negative dice pool modifiers to the attacker instead (Partial Cover -2
and Good Cover -4).

I've never played with it, but I've been toying with the idea of making attacks a Threshold test instead of an Opposed test. All the various modifiers would be wrapped into the Threshold. Environmental modifiers (distance, light, wind, rain, etc.), wound modifiers (on both the attack and dodge side), cover, and so on. The GM can just eyeball the situation on the fly and say, "That's easy (1 hit), routine (2 hits), hard (4 hits), nuts (6 hits), lol (8 hits)" and so on. That makes it faster for the GM to calculate and also drops the defense roll, both of which would save time.

[Reaver]

You might want to try a partial Hit buy system to cut down on the dice. Basically, your armored up Troll with 40 soak dice could spend 32 dice to buy 8 auto successes, then roll the remaining 8 dice.




However, you may want to talk to your players first and see how they feel about the large dice pools, and why they feel they need such large dice pools. Generally when I have seen pools get above 16 dice, its because either the player actually likes rolling that many dice (because MOAR is better!), or he feels he HAS to roll that many dice to be effective (power creep). And lets face it, getting really high dice pools is a considerable investment of game resources (Karma and money), your players may not be happy if you just take that away from them, as they devoted those resources for a reason.

[GloriousRuse]

1) There are a large number of free dicebots that can be used to automate the "Bucket o Dice" , which removes the physical constraint. They even deal with exploding sixes in many cases! All the crunch, none of the rolling.

2) if you're still slow, start looking at the GM side of things - are there ways to simulate enemies better without going through Infinity + 1 rolls? Especially for combat with nearly pre-ordained outcomes or large numbers?

3) A "combat" assistant GM can be useful, especially in larger games. Deputize a veteran player to help tally up totals and nitpick exactly how many points of recoil are in play and so forth, or resolve the umpteenth chunky salsa while you move on. He can also pre-prep dicepools for mooks and the like after it becomes obvious what they are baselining. After everyone knows those gangers are throwing 7-9 dice, you can just let him know that they have a basic pool of 8 with a laser dot, and please get the modifiers worked out for shooting the mage when their initiative comes up. 

4) Player time limits. Sometimes Carl von Clausewitz and Sun Tzu don't need to have a debate between every action. A softer version is requesting that players have their actions and basic dicepools cued when their round comes up.

5) Fluid flow: the combat  system, when you think about it, is really best when describing face to face combat between near equals. While you should never take a critical roll out, you can run a lot of combat without ever rolling intiative - a lot of small SR shoot outs don't last beyond the first round anyhow, so many a "first encounter" can have its order of action set by narrative at first (which alos opens up non combat options - gasp!) You can also reliably suppress a window without rolling for every member of the HRT Drone Machinegun Squad, resolve the effects of munitions against mooks bynarrative after you know the grenade/missile went in (rent a may not be dead, but his ears are bleeding and he's not interested in fighting any more. Or maybe hes just dead because honestly, 45P is a lot).

5a) Mages and their infinitely complex spirits: Screw those kids. They get the spirit they get, and it accomplishes their tasks the best it can. Micromanagement/construction not required.

5b) Deckerizing. Its one thing if the Decker is trying to extract the pay data. Its another if he needs 90 rolls to turn off the mook's smart gun. he got in. It's off. Hooray!

[incrdbil]

Yep, I think I'm just going to fully automate things. Certain changes just have to be implemented at the ground floor of a game.