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2019: 30th Anniversary Edition, or 6th Edition?

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Marcus

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« Reply #75 on: <08-08-18/2249:35> »
I still think your getting ahead of yours on that last part Mirikon.
We both know 5th isn't perfect. But I really do think with an Anniversary edition to patch the holes we will get the moral equivalent of the 20th Anniversary edition back in 4th. Which was certainly as strong a rules set at SR ever had. Developing a reasonable point buy system for 5th is certainly possible. But even if that point buy came out tomorrow, it wouldn't solve most your issues with 5th. We need to fix TMs, rigger, patch the matrix. After that I think we would be in pretty good place.
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Mirikon

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« Reply #76 on: <08-08-18/2256:03> »
I still think your getting ahead of yours on that last part Mirikon.
We both know 5th isn't perfect. But I really do think with an Anniversary edition to patch the holes we will get the moral equivalent of the 20th Anniversary edition back in 4th. Which was certainly as strong a rules set at SR ever had. Developing a reasonable point buy system for 5th is certainly possible. But even if that point buy came out tomorrow, it wouldn't solve most your issues with 5th. We need to fix TMs, rigger, patch the matrix. After that I think we would be in pretty good place.
So... chargen and a full third of the game, plus the lesser issues people have brought up in other areas (the utter crap customization rules for weapons and vehicles/drones compared to 4th, and the total lack of spell creation guidelines, to name a couple)? That's more than the 'patch' the 20th Anniversary edition gave to 4th. That's a structural revamp on a large portion of the game, which will need to be tested for balance issues with other areas of the game... By that point, you may as well just make it a new edition.
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Marcus

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« Reply #77 on: <08-08-18/2315:49> »
Hey now, 4th is responsible for breaking riggers, 5th just has to find a way to fix it. I made my suggestion several times, oddly no one seems to take it seriously.

I couldn't care less about spell design rules. Magic is doing just fine. We lots of spells they do lots cool things, the errata team will fix those 2 lightsaber spells and ether the designers will figure out how they want to handle magic bullet and alter ballistics or the errata team will. (Though I suspect if the errata team does it, they will probably just light that section of  FA on fire and then write haiku about the Excalibur weapon system using the ashes. Or maybe just F U Marcus!!!  lol)

Eh there is always going to be some one unhappy I think customization rules are working, fixing the speed chart would be nice. But I'm sure we should ban swarms right now before the player base catches and no table is safe ever again.




« Last Edit: <08-08-18/2328:31> by Marcus »
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Reaver

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« Reply #78 on: <08-08-18/2317:26> »
And that is why I would love for them to keep Anarchy around for the people who like a 'simplified' game, and bring back the crunch and customization of 4th when 5th dies in a fire and 6th comes along. Let Anarchy be the rules-light noob version, and then take the training wheels off when they're ready to get into customization in the real system.

See, for me and some other old skool players, 4e feels like a "dumb down" version of 3e....

when 4e came about, a lot of options were also dropped, changed with the rules to become nonviable, or were simply thrown by the wayside.

I admit that the matrix rules are faster under 4e (by a factor of 1000!), but at the same time the matrix lost its charm. It was no longer a place that a specialist was needed - you could just throw money at the problem. and the matrix disappeared. (the Commlink/agent combo)

In fact, after a certain level of play, the very idea of a "specialist" died right out. Everyone could do everything with just about the same level of skill. (except magic... that stayed separate just because of the resources need.)

Transferring a character from 3e to 4e was fine.... unless you actually played a Decker/hacker, then you found that everything you had invested time in for the 6 years through 3e was utterly pointless as your attributes have 0 effect on your matrix performance.  Many players of Deckers in 3e where.... "slightly" annoyed at this.

And, I for one was happy with 5e because it meant a return to specialization again for those that really wanted to invest down an avenue, and allowed that didn't to branch out into other disciplines. Granted never as well as someone who specializes.

Am I saying the 5e rules are perfect, adn without flaws? Don't be silly, there is definite room for improvement all across the board. But it is not an "epic failure" as some want to believe.
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« Reply #79 on: <08-08-18/2329:02> »
Hey now, 4th is responsible for breaking riggers, 5th just has to find a way to fix it. I made my suggestion several times, oddly no one seems to take it seriously.

Riggers have gone from "unstoppable army of death of one" to almost useless, to semi functional through the editions....

In 1 to 3, Drones got hardened armor, and thanks to the combat rules and mechanics, that usually meant 90% of the time the drone took 0 damage from attacks. (Combat drones of size anyways)

Riggers were the ONLY class in play that I have actually seen get their players physically assaulted. Twice!
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Marcus

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« Reply #80 on: <08-08-18/2331:27> »
Riggers were the ONLY class in play that I have actually seen get their players physically assaulted. Twice!

LOL You guys have some pretty rough tables up there in the great white north.
« Last Edit: <08-08-18/2334:46> by Marcus »
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« Reply #81 on: <08-08-18/2351:54> »
Riggers were the ONLY class in play that I have actually seen get their players physically assaulted. Twice!

LOL You guys have some pretty rough tables up there in the great white north.

both times it wasn't up here.

The First time was in Georgia, US while working on something that is STILL under NDA until 2021....  A player got so fed up with the Rigger, he picked up the hardcover rule book and swung it baseball bat style into the Rigger player's face. Laid his right out on his back in the floor! That was 2001

The second time was in Ghana, working on the Mines. This Finnish guy was playing the Rigger, and decided to turn his drones against the team, because he knew the team couldn't stop him... A Russian steelworker player looked at him and said: "you think that funny?" then grabbed him by his hair and proceeded to slam his face into the table until we could restrain him. This would have been 2004?
« Last Edit: <08-09-18/0025:26> by Reaver »
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PMárk

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« Reply #82 on: <08-09-18/0010:12> »
I still think your getting ahead of yours on that last part Mirikon.
We both know 5th isn't perfect. But I really do think with an Anniversary edition to patch the holes we will get the moral equivalent of the 20th Anniversary edition back in 4th. Which was certainly as strong a rules set at SR ever had. Developing a reasonable point buy system for 5th is certainly possible. But even if that point buy came out tomorrow, it wouldn't solve most your issues with 5th. We need to fix TMs, rigger, patch the matrix. After that I think we would be in pretty good place.

Agree.
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PMárk

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« Reply #83 on: <08-09-18/0011:24> »
Riggers were the ONLY class in play that I have actually seen get their players physically assaulted. Twice!

LOL You guys have some pretty rough tables up there in the great white north.

both times it wasn't up here.

The First time was in Georgia, US while working on something that is STILL under NDA until 2021....  A player got so fed up with the Rigger he picked up the hardcover rule book and swung in baseball bat style into the Rigger player's face. Laid his right out on his back in the floor! That was 2001

The second time was in Ghana, working on the Mines. This Finnish guy was playing the Rigger, and decided to turn his drones against the team, because he knew the team couldn't stop him... A Russian steelworker player looked at him and "you think that funny?" then grabbed him by his hair and proceeded to slam his face into the table until we could restrain him. This would have been 2004?

LOL indeed! :D

I'd share this with our group if you don't mind! :D
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Marcus

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« Reply #84 on: <08-09-18/0015:42> »

both times it wasn't up here.

The First time was in Georgia, US while working on something that is STILL under NDA until 2021....  A player got so fed up with the Rigger he picked up the hardcover rule book and swung in baseball bat style into the Rigger player's face. Laid his right out on his back in the floor! That was 2001

The second time was in Ghana, working on the Mines. This Finnish guy was playing the Rigger, and decided to turn his drones against the team, because he knew the team couldn't stop him... A Russian steelworker player looked at him and "you think that funny?" then grabbed him by his hair and proceeded to slam his face into the table until we could restrain him. This would have been 2004?

That sounds like Georgia all right.

Crazy Russians huh? Fair enough.
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Iron Serpent Prince

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« Reply #85 on: <08-09-18/0018:07> »
Wow...

That whole reply comes across as incredibly racist.

Marcus

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« Reply #86 on: <08-09-18/0020:11> »
Wow...

That whole reply comes across as incredibly racist.

Georgia is a race to you?
 
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Iron Serpent Prince

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« Reply #87 on: <08-09-18/0023:11> »
Wow...

That whole reply comes across as incredibly racist.

Georgia is a race to you?

With what 70%+ of the people who refer to anything as "southern" / <southern state name> mean when they say it...  Yes.  Yes it is.

Combined with "crazy Russian," it pretty much seals it.

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« Reply #88 on: <08-09-18/0028:17> »
Wow...

That whole reply comes across as incredibly racist.

Georgia is a race to you?

With what 70%+ of the people who refer to anything as "southern" / <southern state name> mean when they say it...  Yes.  Yes it is.

Combined with "crazy Russian," it pretty much seals it.


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<Looks South>

Fuck, It's America.
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Michael Chandra

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« Reply #89 on: <08-09-18/0036:06> »
I'm agreeing with the Russian tbh. Good man.
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