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Pixie face/infiltrator

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rasmusnicolaj

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« Reply #15 on: <04-12-12/0210:00> »
Magic + Summoning + Power Foci >> Spirit Force. That mean you can summon a useful spirit with a low dicepool. The limiting factor in summoning are typical your resist drain. Binding is Spirit Force x2 so that is a lot harder to do.

In Street Magic there is a quality that let your specialize in one aspect of magecraft and you could chose conjurer. I think the drawbacks are to great for what it is worth though. Being able to sling spells are great and not worth limiting in my opinion.

Illusion and manipulation spells would probably work fine for this character. Maybe a single combatspell like power bolt and probably an elemental type spell to.

Astral Combat sucks. Powerbolts is way superior for that (the same argument as to why Banishing is bad).
As for skills it is good to specialize. Be good at you key abilities instead of having a lot of average things because you will just end up being bad at almost anything. The BP system favors specialists.

Personally I think a druid would fit the concept better. Possession mages can be powerful but are maybe also a little more complex to pull off.

As a combined mage and face a Charisma tradition is a must. Allows you to focus on the important part.

You could surge the little girl for glamour.

Rasmus
Deplore killings made in the name of religion. Can't it just be for fun?

Krys

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« Reply #16 on: <04-12-12/0222:36> »
Hand to heart - I would simply tell a player 'no' if they turned up to my table with 5 attributes softcapped and the others at 1. Every table is different, but it does look very 'twinky' and gives a GM who so wishes plenty of room to abuse the character.

I never intended to show up at a table with the char like this. :D That's why I develop it here, to end up with a sensible char.

What I basically did for the first draft was candy shop system: look around what you consider "fitting" to the story. Fill your bags with it (ull but not overflowing). Add in small doses what you consider nice but not central. And then let your mom search through the bags, to throw out the overflow, and add in some fruits. :D

That's what I'm asking you here. :D

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Speaking of 'twinky', be warned that some GMs might take exception to Sensitive System on someone with no tech in her body and nothing to say she ever will.

*nod* on the other hand it's a limitation of options. Is there a lesser priced variant, that is basically a "discount" for declaring "I'll not pimp that char with modern tech"? One more acceptable to GMs?
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That aside

I echo Umaro's comment about Body. As things stand, if something sees you and wants to kill you, that then's it. It would be absurdly easy to take her out with one shot. Any semi-competent Street Sam should be able to do it.

*nod* Is there a way to simulate a Body and strength that is below average pixie body/strength (2) without ending at 1? Basically what's important for me is that she isn't a "windling hulk" just because body 3 is necessary to survive. She is intended to be a "pixie light" not a "pixie tank". ^^

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I would suggest taking some of the skill that would allow her to get through a locked door - Hardware with a Maglocks speciality springs to mind, as does an Autopicker in equipment at least.

*nod* That WOULD definitely make sense ... but doesn't fit her story. She will become competent at tech (once artificer has taken apart her life and reconstructed her) but for now she is ... very limited in this aspect.

Does that make (a very crazy) sense?

Krys

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« Reply #17 on: <04-12-12/0229:33> »
Magic + Summoning + Power Foci >> Spirit Force. That mean you can summon a useful spirit with a low dicepool.

As above would a focus be avaible in "smurf town"?

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The limiting factor in summoning are typical your resist drain. Binding is Spirit Force x2 so that is a lot harder to do.

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In Street Magic there is a quality that let your specialize in one aspect of magecraft and you could chose conjurer. I think the drawbacks are to great for what it is worth though. Being able to sling spells are great and not worth limiting in my opinion.

*nod* I wasn't planing to limit her THAT much.

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Illusion and manipulation spells would probably work fine for this character. Maybe a single combatspell like power bolt and probably an elemental type spell to.

*nod* Is it possible to depend on spirits for this stuff for now, and learn them later (maybe even from th spirits)?

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Astral Combat sucks. Powerbolts is way superior for that (the same argument as to why Banishing is bad).

*nod*

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As for skills it is good to specialize. Be good at you key abilities instead of having a lot of average things because you will just end up being bad at almost anything. The BP system favors specialists.

*nod* For the first draft I just placed the points in groups, but yeah, that isn't specialized enough.

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Personally I think a druid would fit the concept better. Possession mages can be powerful but are maybe also a little more complex to pull off.

As a combined mage and face a Charisma tradition is a must. Allows you to focus on the important part.

Druid was the first I was thinking about, but IIRC their spirit types wheren't as fitting as the witch ones. Btw, is druid a charisma tradition?

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You could surge the little girl for glamour.

Already did :D Just added the whole dryad powers package, which fits nicely with SURGE II.

rasmusnicolaj

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« Reply #18 on: <04-12-12/0231:03> »
Body 2 isn't much even though it is average pixie.
I would go for 2 due to the fact that you plan on being a runner and you need to have at least a mediocre body to get by. Attribute it to a high constitution build on long nights of dancing and her being raised in a forrest.
If you wan't the third point get it for karma og use Increase Attribute [Body] in a sustaining foci to get Body 2(4).
With Body 1 you can't wear almost no armor and that is a sure way to acidentally die.

Regards
Rasmus
Deplore killings made in the name of religion. Can't it just be for fun?

rasmusnicolaj

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« Reply #19 on: <04-12-12/0233:18> »
Pixies are by nature a magical race.
Why shouldn't they have enchanters that make foci?
A rating 4 Power Focus is a really strong advantage to start with and you should go for it if you can.

Rasmus
Deplore killings made in the name of religion. Can't it just be for fun?

Krys

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« Reply #20 on: <04-12-12/0305:36> »
Body 2 isn't much even though it is average pixie.
I would go for 2 due to the fact that you plan on being a runner and you need to have at least a mediocre body to get by. Attribute it to a high constitution build on long nights of dancing and her being raised in a forrest.
If you wan't the third point get it for karma og use Increase Attribute [Body] in a sustaining foci to get Body 2(4).
With Body 1 you can't wear almost no armor and that is a sure way to acidentally die.

Regards
Rasmus

Hmmm, she isn't wearing armor yet (intentionally). But yeah, I buy it, Body 2 is definitely high on the list. :D Would you consider Body 2 important enough for a char that is only slowly sliding into the shadows to sacrifice an hard capped other attribute though? Or do you suggest to buy it from karma early on? As you might have guessed, I get advice from a RL friend ... who happens to be an arvid powergamer. Though I do not want to take his advice without some other voices chirping in.
« Last Edit: <04-12-12/0310:05> by Krys »

Krys

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« Reply #21 on: <04-12-12/0308:07> »
Pixies are by nature a magical race.
Why shouldn't they have enchanters that make foci?
A rating 4 Power Focus is a really strong advantage to start with and you should go for it if you can.

Rasmus

Sounds sane. One more q on that: will concealment (self only) cover the focus, or will she light up light a flak spot for someone sensing astrally?

JustADude

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« Reply #22 on: <04-12-12/0311:44> »
Pixies are by nature a magical race.
Why shouldn't they have enchanters that make foci?
A rating 4 Power Focus is a really strong advantage to start with and you should go for it if you can.

Also, according to their writeup in Running Wild (p149) they have a "much higher percentage" of people who can Conjure and use Sorcery than Metahuman species do. Since Foci are created via magic, not advanced technology, that means it makes more sense for her to have a powerful Focus at the start of the game than it would for a "normal" Magician with an equivalent background.

Sounds sane. One more q on that: will concealment (self only) cover the focus, or will she light up light a flak spot for someone sensing astrally?

Concealment covers you and all your personal gear. The problem, though, is that it only works on Perception checks. If they're Assensing you, which is what they use for Astral type stuff, it doesn't apply at all. You need to use Masking and Extended Masking (need at least 2 Initiate Grades for that, unfortunately) to hide a Focus on the Astral Plane.

And, just FYI, you can quote more than one post in your reply by going down and clicking "Insert Quote" after you start to quote the first one. Double-posting like that is a faux-pas.
« Last Edit: <04-12-12/0317:09> by JustADude »
“What is right is not always popular and what is popular is not always right.”
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rasmusnicolaj

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« Reply #23 on: <04-12-12/0355:18> »
What JustADude said.

I would start with Body 2. Hardcapping is expensive and should only be done for really important stats. 1 less die isn't that important. For your build the only thing i would consider to hardcap would be magic but not if you can't find the point for it though.

Also you really should get some armor. Everybody is using armor also for everyday and casual strolls down the street. You can get high fashion armor from example Vashon or Zoé.

Regards
Rasmus
Deplore killings made in the name of religion. Can't it just be for fun?

Krys

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« Reply #24 on: <04-12-12/0357:09> »
Pixies are by nature a magical race.
Why shouldn't they have enchanters that make foci?
A rating 4 Power Focus is a really strong advantage to start with and you should go for it if you can.

Also, according to their writeup in Running Wild (p149) they have a "much higher percentage" of people who can Conjure and use Sorcery than Metahuman species do. Since Foci are created via magic, not advanced technology, that means it makes more sense for her to have a powerful Focus at the start of the game than it would for a "normal" Magician with an equivalent background.

^^ I'll look into it once I'm home.

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Sounds sane. One more q on that: will concealment (self only) cover the focus, or will she light up light a flak spot for someone sensing astrally?

Concealment covers you and all your personal gear. The problem, though, is that it only works on Perception checks. If they're Assensing you, which is what they use for Astral type stuff, it doesn't apply at all. You need to use Masking and Extended Masking (need at least 2 Initiate Grades for that, unfortunately) to hide a Focus on the Astral Plane.

Yeah, and initiation is WAY down the road, given that I'll need tons of karma just to get rid of uneducated, buy tech skills and so on. :D

Oh, I suppose astral chameleon (the only separate quality I managed to squeeze in) doesn't help hiding the focus either, right?

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And, just FYI, you can quote more than one post in your reply by going down and clicking "Insert Quote" after you start to quote the first one. Double-posting like that is a faux-pas.

Thanks, I'll try to use that. :D

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What JustADude said.

I would start with Body 2. Hardcapping is expensive and should only be done for really important stats. 1 less die isn't that important. For your build the only thing i would consider to hardcap would be magic but not if you can't find the point for it though.

Also you really should get some armor. Everybody is using armor also for everyday and casual strolls down the street. You can get high fashion armor from example Vashon or Zoé.

Regards
Rasmus

Oh, I dont have hardcaps yet. Everything soft-capped (the friendly powergamer from my RP group made sure I did AT LEAST that ... he dislikes the whole concept, isn't powered up enough ^^). SO the +1 to body would have to come from a soft capped attribute, as would any increase in logic (which would be more important to me personaly).

Concerning armor: she will probably get some quickly (if money llows), but I plan to play here coming right outta da woods. So if she wears armor it would be "windling native", possibly with magic support.
« Last Edit: <04-12-12/0400:48> by Krys »

JustADude

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« Reply #25 on: <04-12-12/0531:06> »
Yeah, and initiation is WAY down the road, given that I'll need tons of karma just to get rid of uneducated, buy tech skills and so on. :D

Oh, I suppose astral chameleon (the only separate quality I managed to squeeze in) doesn't help hiding the focus either, right?

Nope, not according to the baseline Rules As Written. You might want to talk to your GM about making an "Astral Cloak" spell using the rules from Street Magic, though, that renders you undetectable to Assensing the same way Improved Invisibility protects you from Visual Perception. ;)

By the mechanics from the "Designing New Spells" section (p159), you get the following:

Astral Cloak
Category: Illusion
Type: Mana (+0)
Range: Touch (Area) (+0)
Target: Restricted (Self + Bonded Foci) (-1)
Duration: Sustained (+0)
Options:
Realistic (+0)
Single-Sense (Assensing) (-2)
Illusion Hides or Conceals (+2)
Final DV: (F÷2)-1
« Last Edit: <04-12-12/0535:39> by JustADude »
“What is right is not always popular and what is popular is not always right.”
― Albert Einstein

"Being average just means that half of everyone you meet is better than you."
― Me

UmaroVI

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« Reply #26 on: <04-12-12/0916:35> »
OK, let me try to answer your questions.

More summoning is more good, but not as much as more spellcasting is more good because summoning is binary - either the spirit appears, or it doesn't. Spirits roll F, you roll Magic+Summoning+Focus+Specialization, so it's easy enough to get spirits to appear. The limiting factor is drain and more summoning doesn't help.

Being a pure conjurer is a Bad Idea in very big ways. I don't recommend it. Spellcasting is very important, so are spirits, trying to rely only on one or the other is not going to work too well.

Good spells: depends what you want to do. Everyone should have Increase Reflexes. If you care even slightly about fighting, you should have Stunbolt, Stunball, and either Powerbolt or a single-target P-damage elemental spell (not having this means you can't hurt nonliving targets). There are lots of horrible Illusion spells and a handful of really good ones: Physical Mask and Trid Phantasm are very good spells. Detection and Manipulation are full of about an even mix of useful spells and crap. If you check the first link in my sig and look at the magicians, you can get some ideas of what I consider to be good spell selections.

Agility: Dodge doesn't rely on Agility, nor does movement. You add your Dodge skill to your Reaction when you are in melee, and you can blow your next action to add Dodge to both melee and ranged defense and reset your penalty for being attacked multiple times. It's very tempting to overinvest in dodge and overuse this, but it generally just makes you lose slowly. In particular, Body 2 will do a lot more for your not dying than Dodge. That said, Dodge is not useless and if you free up the points, Dodge 4 is worthwhile. Don't bother with stuff like Dodge 1, though, that will just tempt you to waste actions. The only thing your character has that's Agility-based is Infiltration and that's why I suggest cutting from it.

Re: Concealment and Assensing: it actually does work...sorta. You can use Concealment to conceal yourself from astral detection (ie, Assensing)...but only if you are dual natured. This means that your Concealment does reduce Assensing tests, but only while you are astrally perceiving. See SR4A 293.

You can also use Infiltration to hide from Astral perception - but again, only while dual natured (see the FAQ).

Astral Combat is of very marginal use.

You would probably be best off just being a Shaman. You really should have a Charisma tradition and it's the only one that sounds appropriate, and Shamanism is so incredibly broadly and vaguely defined that it can be whatever you want. You might also talk your GM into allowing a custom tradition but that may not fly.








Krys

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« Reply #27 on: <04-12-12/0939:24> »
OK I applied your suggestions as best as I could in the OP. Could you be so kind and look it over? It's just v0.12 yet, so still a lot to do. And my powergamer friend isn't avaible, so I definitely need help here. :D

UmaroVI

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« Reply #28 on: <04-12-12/1011:00> »
Agility is a good place to cut points.

How good the Illusion combat spells like Orgy are depends on how your GM intends to rule the incapacitated if you take more than Willpower penalty thing. Talk to your GM about it.

You don't need Gymnastics. You can fly, and Dodge is better for defense. There are reasons to use Gymnastics instead, but not on this character.

Krys

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« Reply #29 on: <04-12-12/1104:20> »
So you'd rather cut AGI than EDG?

The hint with Orgasm/Orgy omes directly from the GM. I asked him about a non-lethal decapacitating spell. SO I think he is ok with it.

Chopping Gymnastics now.