[Shadowjack]

I've only wielded one katana and I don't think it would be ideal for one handing. Keep in mind that only one side of the blade has a sharp edge. It would be very impractical. That's one of the big advantages to European style, double edged swords. Not only can you swing back and forth one handed but you can also use a shield effectively.

[Redmercury]

Speaking from experience on one handing katana, if you're familiar with the blade and you have supple wrists it doesn't matter. At the end of one stroke with the katana (or whatever curved blade) you adjust your grip slightly and nudge the blade in the direction of the new swing. This uses the balance of the blade to turn it in the direction you want. It does help to have the right footwork down as well. It's about as fast as a double edged sword like this, a little less free, but can strike very hard.

[Shadowjack]

I must have had an extra heavy katana then. Because I'm decently strong and I can't imagine not 2 handing that thing

[All4BigGuns]

I'm curious to see how much other than swing a sword it can do.
I've tossed together an adept which has 22 dice doing 8P with a Weapon Focus Katana but it's taken 250 out of 400 bp and 5.25 power points and the only stats that are above starting are str & ag, the only skill is blades and the only gear is the katana power focus.

That leaves the character struggling to do much else

(Mind you it's the first physical adept I've made in 4th ed)

making an augmented physical adept with 22 dice for katana took 231 karma with 3.5 power points left  (again It could almost certainly be done cheaper)

Fine, here it is. (Note: It uses 'Sword' instead of 'Katana')


 == Info ==
Street Name: Steelshine
Name: Blake Storm
Movement: 10/25, Swim: 6
Karma: 0
Street Cred: 0
Notoriety: 1
Public Awareness: 0
Elf Male Age 35
Height 6'3"
Composure: 6
Judge Intentions: 7
Lift/Carry: 10 (75 kg/50 kg)
Memory: 5
Nuyen: 0

== Attributes ==
BOD: 5
AGI: 6
REA: 3 (5)
STR: 5
CHA: 3
INT: 4
LOG: 2
WIL: 3
EDG: 1
MAG: 6

== Derived Attributes ==
Essence:                   6
Initiative:                7 (9)
IP:                        1 (3)
Astral Initiative:         8
Astral IP:                 3
Matrix Initiative:         7
Matrix IP:                 1
Physical Damage Track:     11
Stun Damage Track:         10

== Active Skills ==
Blades                     : 6 [Swords]             Pool: 15 (17)
Climbing                   : 3                      Pool: 8
Disguise                   : 4                      Pool: 8
Etiquette                  : 3 [Street]             Pool: 6 (
Flight                     : 3                      Pool: 8
Gymnastics                 : 3                      Pool: 9
Hardware                   : 4 [Maglocks]           Pool: 6 (
Infiltration               : 4                      Pool: 12
Palming                    : 4                      Pool: 10
Perception                 : 3                      Pool: 10
Pilot Ground Craft         : 1 [Wheeled]            Pool: 6 (
Pilot Watercraft           : 0                      Pool: 4
Pistols                    : 2 [Semi-Automatics]    Pool: 8 (10)
Running                    : 3                      Pool: 8
Shadowing                  : 4                      Pool: 8
Swimming                   : 3                      Pool: 8

== Knowledge Skills ==
Area Knowledge: Seattle    : 3                      Pool: 7
Bars and Clubs             : 3                      Pool: 7
English                    : N                      Pool: 0
Security Systems           : 4                      Pool: 6
Sperethiel                 : 4                      Pool: 8

== Contacts ==
Fixer (6, 3)

== Qualities ==
Adept
Bad Luck
Low Pain Tolerance
Low-Light Vision
Restricted Gear (Rating 1)
SINner (Standard) (Blake Storm)
The Warrior's Way

== Powers ==
Combat Sense Rating: 4
Enhanced Perception Rating: 3
Improved Ability (Combat) (Blades) Rating: 3
Improved Ability (Non-Combat) (Infiltration) Rating: 2
Improved Reflexes 2
Sustenance

== Lifestyles ==
Middle  4 months

== Armor ==
Bike Racing Armor         5/8
   +Chemical Protection 6
   +Gel Packs
   +Ruthenium Polymer Coating
   +YNT SoftWeave
Form-Fitting Full-Body Suit6/2
   +Nonconductivity 6
SecureTech PPP Armor (Ensemble)2/4

== Weapons ==
Browning Ultra-Power
   +Chameleon Coating
   +Laser Sight
   Pool: 9 (11)   DV: 5P   AP: -1   RC: 0
Sword
   +Chameleon Coating
   +Personalized Grip, Melee Rating 4
   +Weapon Focus
   Pool: 20 (22)   DV: 8P   AP: -   RC: 0
Unarmed Attack
   Pool: 5   DV: 3S   AP: -   RC: 0

== Martial Arts ==
Arnis De Mano
   ++1 DV on Blades attacks
   ++1 DV on Blades attacks

== Commlink ==
Novatech Airware (3, 3, 3, 3)
   +Iris Orb
   +AR Gloves
   +Subvocal Microphone
   +Analyze Rating 6 [Copy Protection 6, Optimization 3, Registration]
   +Encrypt Rating 6 [Copy Protection 6, Optimization 3, Registration]

== Gear ==
Autopicker Rating 6
Chisel
Contact Lenses Rating 3
   +Vision Enhancement Rating 3
   +Image Link
   +Flare Compensation
Earbuds Rating 2
   +Audio Enhancement Rating 3
   +Select Sound Filter Rating 3
Fake SIN (Brian Ceran) Rating 4
   +Fake License (Focus Permit) Rating 4
   +Fake License (Weapon Permit) Rating 4
   +Fake License (Bodyguard License) Rating 4
   +Fake License (Drivers License) Rating 4
   +Fake License (Vehicle Registration) Rating 4
Fake SIN (Stephen Franks) Rating 4
   +Fake License (Focus Permit) Rating 4
   +Fake License (Weapon Permit) Rating 4
   +Fake License (Bodyguard License) Rating 4
   +Fake License (Drivers License) Rating 4
   +Fake License (Vehicle Registration) Rating 4
Fake SIN (Jonathan Drake) Rating 4
   +Fake License (Focus Permit) Rating 4
   +Fake License (Weapon Permit) Rating 4
   +Fake License (Bodyguard License) Rating 4
   +Fake License (Drivers License) Rating 4
   +Fake License (Vehicle Registration) Rating 4
Maglock Passkey Rating 4
Maglock Sequencer Rating 4
Medkit Rating 6
Spare Clip (Browning Ultra-Power) x5
   +Ammo: Stick-n-Shock (Heavy Pistols)
Tool Kit (Hardware)
Weapon Focus (Bonded Foci) (Sword) Rating 4
Wire Clippers

== Vehicles ==
BMW Blitzen 2050 (Combat Bike)
   +Morphing License Plate
   +Obsolescent
   +Spoof Chip
   +Vehicle Sensor


Back to the topic, I think the problem of hatred of katana and various other Japanese culture items in games stems from a massive overuse of them. Personally, I don't understand it because I've seen things far more overused, but...

[Mirikon]

I must have had an extra heavy katana then. Because I'm decently strong and I can't imagine not 2 handing that thing

Well, the ones I've had and held were all light enough that I could easily use one in one hand, except one that had an especially heavy hilt. I can't speak about the sword you used in particular, of course, but that's held true for most any katana I've seen. Also, if you have some kind of training, it gets easier.

[Shadowjack]

Yeah, it had a very heavy hilt.

[Ghoulfodder]

I'm not sure on the credibility of this, but I've also heard that Toledo supplied Japan with some of its superior smithing material.

I would be suspicious of this given that my looking into folded steel seems to indicate that both places came up with the idea independently, but I'd always be open to a new source stating otherwise.

I would still question whether a katana or curved blade is better than a double-edged straight sword. They have different design and function - I wish I could post a couple of the PDFs I've acquired about armed martial arts forms, but most of the straightedged weapons have shorter swings which would indicate less time between attacks. It's also easier to block or parry with the flat of a straight sword than it is to turn aside a similar blow with a katana or saber (in general).

Also: you can get a claymore in Arsenal p14. But I still see what you mean, and "blades" is vague enough anyway that your point remains. The maneuvers of thrusting with a dirk and throwing out a flurry of slashes with a cavalry saber are as different as night and day in the real world, but for ease of use Shadowrun simplifies it all to one skill (though with options to specialize).

I think the benefit of a curved blade is that it allows you to slice into your opponant drawing the blade across them and come free more reliably in one motion. A straight edged blade, as I understand it, you first cut into the opponant and then draw back in a separate motion to slice deeper. Slower and possibly more likely to get stuck.

Generally, it's difficult to compare weapons like this because each one is a product of the environment it was designed for. If the Japanese had all been wearing different armour, the Katana would be quite different.

For me the Katana has appeal because of the style of use and those who used them. I've taken a brief class in wielding katanas (sadly the order of swords hadn't come through so we had to use rapiers) and it was all about stealing ground, economy of movement and gaining the advantage to win - I know that's the case with many systems but this seemed more to the nth degree.

[Mirikon]

Comparing a longsword and a katana is like arguing between strength and speed. The longsword is heavier, but doesn't hold its edge as well. The katana is quicker, but doesn't have the same kinetic energy of a heavier weapon, meaning it doesn't have the same brute force as, say, a claymore. In Europe, where battles were fought upon horseback or using a sword and shield and plate armor, a heavier blade had the best chance of doing damage, unless you were nimble enough to pierce the gaps in the joints. However, that extra weight of sword, shield, and armor made one slower. The European style would be to focus on defense through heavier armor, then.

In contrast, the Japanese style focuses on speed and mobility. Even their heavy armor was quite light compared to plate armor. Because of this, they focused on a style that involved quick strikes, and an instant turn from parry to attack. A lighter blade, with an edge that was very sharp, is able to do more in such situations than a heavier blade.

[Anarkitty]

Comparing a longsword and a katana is like arguing between strength and speed. The longsword is heavier, but doesn't hold its edge as well. The katana is quicker, but doesn't have the same kinetic energy of a heavier weapon, meaning it doesn't have the same brute force as, say, a claymore. In Europe, where battles were fought upon horseback or using a sword and shield and plate armor, a heavier blade had the best chance of doing damage, unless you were nimble enough to pierce the gaps in the joints. However, that extra weight of sword, shield, and armor made one slower. The European style would be to focus on defense through heavier armor, then.

In contrast, the Japanese style focuses on speed and mobility. Even their heavy armor was quite light compared to plate armor. Because of this, they focused on a style that involved quick strikes, and an instant turn from parry to attack. A lighter blade, with an edge that was very sharp, is able to do more in such situations than a heavier blade.

Keep in mind that in Shadowrun modern alloys and monowire edges can largely eliminate the differences in weight, sharpness and edge-retention between styles of blades.  Armor is also wildly different than it was during the era i which the weapons evolved, and it is likely that fighting styles have evolved as well.

Curved blades are the best because they draw faster than straight blades, and allow for quick feints and vicious draw-cuts against lightly armored and unarmored opponents.
Straight blades are the best because they allow for a harder chopping cut that can penetrate armor, and they are more versatile with two edges and a thrusting tip.
Doesn't matter, they all do (STR/2+3)P.

[All4BigGuns]

Comparing a longsword and a katana is like arguing between strength and speed. The longsword is heavier, but doesn't hold its edge as well. The katana is quicker, but doesn't have the same kinetic energy of a heavier weapon, meaning it doesn't have the same brute force as, say, a claymore. In Europe, where battles were fought upon horseback or using a sword and shield and plate armor, a heavier blade had the best chance of doing damage, unless you were nimble enough to pierce the gaps in the joints. However, that extra weight of sword, shield, and armor made one slower. The European style would be to focus on defense through heavier armor, then.

In contrast, the Japanese style focuses on speed and mobility. Even their heavy armor was quite light compared to plate armor. Because of this, they focused on a style that involved quick strikes, and an instant turn from parry to attack. A lighter blade, with an edge that was very sharp, is able to do more in such situations than a heavier blade.

Keep in mind that in Shadowrun modern alloys and monowire edges can largely eliminate the differences in weight, sharpness and edge-retention between styles of blades.  Armor is also wildly different than it was during the era i which the weapons evolved, and it is likely that fighting styles have evolved as well.

Curved blades are the best because they draw faster than straight blades, and allow for quick feints and vicious draw-cuts against lightly armored and unarmored opponents.
Straight blades are the best because they allow for a harder chopping cut that can penetrate armor, and they are more versatile with two edges and a thrusting tip.
Doesn't matter, they all do (STR/2+3)P.

It pretty much comes down to personal style for the character. Some want a katana-wielding samurai-wannabe-badass, while others want a longsword-wielding badass. Neither is wrong, neither is right.

[Inconnu]

Melee has 3 advantages:
Stealth, Monowire, and Trolls.

Also, I say monofilament bow(like violin bow) beats EVERYTHING. i mean, like, just getting it past security. "It's my spare violin bow! What? I don't have a violin? Fuck you."

[JustADude]

Curved blades are the best because they draw faster than straight blades, and allow for quick feints and vicious draw-cuts against lightly armored and unarmored opponents.
Straight blades are the best because they allow for a harder chopping cut that can penetrate armor, and they are more versatile with two edges and a thrusting tip.
Doesn't matter, they all do (STR/2+3)P.

Except the Katana, which does (STR/2+3)P AP -1... which is, in fact, the quirk that started this whole debate since, as you just pointed out, the straight-edged blades lumped under "Sword" are better at hurting armored opponents.

Melee has 3 advantages:
Stealth, Monowire, and Trolls.

Also, I say monofilament bow(like violin bow) beats EVERYTHING. i mean, like, just getting it past security. "It's my spare violin bow! What? I don't have a violin? Fuck you."

That is pure evil. I love it.

[Inconnu]

For bonus points, put it in a case that looks EXACTLY like the real violin bow's case. Why? So if you glitch:

"You hit him with the edge of your bow. It does absolutely nothing."

[CanRay]

Well, in order to get the right balance for a melee weapon, you first have to take into consideration the biometrics of the person that's going to be using the weapon in question, then...

...

I misunderstood the question, didn't I?

[The Wyrm Ouroboros]

"Consider a spherical sword of dimension ..."