Shadowrun
Shadowrun General => General Discussion => Topic started by: Monkoflords on <02-26-16/2353:05>
-
So, in a month or two, I'm planning on offering to run Shadowrun for my local group when our current game finishes up. I was either planning on running it in Seattle, because of the material out for it, or bring it closer to home to Phoenix (and surrounding areas).
I have the Almanac, so I have the information in there, but that's about it. Is there any place I can read more?
Also, I'm looking to brainstorm ideas for Phoenix itself. Given it appears to be right on the border with Atzlan, I'm sure there's got to be something going on there.
-
Native American Nation Vol 1 3rdESR
Has some background info that's still relevant.
-
Shadows of North America has about a paragraph on Phoenix. It's rather vague. Phoenix was the largest PCC city until it took over Los Angeles. It's the largest manufacturing center in the country, which is to say that it has a lot of Matrix hardware fabrication facilities and the like.
Oh, it's also the headquarters of Phoenix Biotechnologies. PBT is a AA-rated megacorporation and was for a long time PCC's largest non-Matrix corporation. It took some serious blows in recent years, in large part because Hestaby was a major shareholder—probably the largest shareholder after the PCC itself—and it became fair game. It's unclear what happened to her shares, but the damage seems to be done and the PCC doesn't seem inclined to bail PBT out. Spinrad Industries is a possible white knight that may possibly acquire PBT.
-
The PCC should be ripe with options.
Besides absorbing the Ute Nation, remember also they were ceded pretty much all of Aztlan's lands inside what was once Texas, effectively creating a buffer between the CAS and Aztlan.(See Storm Front for this).
The latter of which might become something the CAS would like taking back sometime, whether diplomatically or otherwise.
-
Ghost Cartels has a section on the PCC and Los Angeles as does Corporate Enclaves.
-
Besides absorbing the Ute Nation, remember also they were ceded pretty much all of Aztlan's lands inside what was once Texas, effectively creating a buffer between the CAS and Aztlan.(See Storm Front for this).
The latter of which might become something the CAS would like taking back sometime, whether diplomatically or otherwise.
And do only see Storm Front for this version. If you go back to Dirty Tricks in which the plot was originally introduced, it was nowhere near "pretty much all of Aztlan's lands inside what was once Texas".
Storm Front, pages 18-19
While the PCC was willing to cut Aztlan some slack and didn’t hold them completely accountable for Sirrurg’s attacks, the CAS wasn’t nearly so forgiving. They placed responsibility for the attacks directly on Aztlan’s shoulders, though most suspected it was merely a ploy to send troops in and reclaim parts of Texas. In an utterly surprising move, Aztlan then sold large portions of Texas to the PCC.
> I would’ve laid good cred that Silva would have been the morning’s next sacrifice after he sold Texas off. Apparently, he didn’t bother to consult his partners on the Aztechnology board. But dammit, he lived! AND was still president! I guess there still are surprises left in this world.
> Sunshine
In a strategic sense, it was a bold move. By giving away parts of Texas, Aztlan managed to accomplish several objectives in one swoop. First, they avoided expanding the war and also created a buffer between them and a hostile foreign nation. [...]
Dirty Tricks, page 87
The Rio Gambit
On August 7th, Aztlan president Enrico Silva sold a chunk of Aztlan territory that was once a part of New Mexico and Texas to the Pueblo Corporate Council (or, more specifically, to a consortium of Ute investors). It runs from the PCC down to El Paso, follows the Rio Grande, then heads straight north as it gobbles up Kermit. Aztlan keeps Odessa, but giving up Roswell is interesting due to Sirrurg. As everyone knows, President McMulkin had pushed getting Texas back as a huge part of his campaign and had been in negotiations with Aztlan President Silva about the issue for over a year. The Treaty of Denver talks threw things into a pot, of course, but something about Ghostwalker and Perianwyr going eye to eye must have spooked him into action, and I don’t think that he cleared everything with Aztechnology. He got called up for an emergency meeting with the powers that be, but whatever he said, it must have worked, as he’s still breathing. Texas politicians were thrilled at first, since they assumed that the PCC would sell the land to them, but when that didn’t happen, it got ugly. All of a sudden, “Puebs” has become a filthy word for dishonorable actions and betrayal, and the Texans have been howling for blood and war. Thus far, cooler heads have prevailed, but I don’t know for how long. [...]
> As for why the PCC won’t sell, it has to be voted on by the nation, most likely added to the Vote of No Confidence in October. In addition, the owners are former Ute nationals who are blocking moves to sell it unless Aztechnology is allowed back into the nation. Both sides are locked in negotiations, but are also hiring deniable assets to get information. Chief on everyone’s mind is how this group got the money to make the purchase when the Ute were some of the poorest people in North America.
> Dr Spin
> I have it on good authority that they purchased it for one nuyen. Turning the CAS and the PCC against one another secures their northern border while they push against Amazonia in the South, which is worth more than the land the Azzies sold.
> Plan 9
So the Pueblo were supposed to take over only the part of Texas that is directly south of New Mexico. That is, about one quarter of Texas lands occupied by Aztlan: El Paso and 400 kilometers of desert around former Interstate 10.
The deal also includes Roswell and the surrounding area, which never belonged to Texas. As far as previous sourcebooks went, south of New Mexico and Arizona, around Roswell and Tucson, went to Aztlan with the Treaty of Denver (possibly a decision from southern Apache tribes to join Aztlan instead of the Pueblo council, but the topic has never been addressed). Since Dirty Tricks mentions Roswell but focus on Texas holdings, I guess only the easternmost part of New Mexico may have changed hands as a "corridor" to connect Pueblo territory to El Paso area.
It does shorten the frontline by some 140 kilometers, west of Lubbok and Midland, which would have actually been the only internationally recognized border between Aztlan and Texas. That's far from establishing a significant buffer zone. Everything else, from Odessa/Midland to Corpus Christi, is still on a frontline, with Corpus Christi, Austin South, San Antonio and the Spurs home arena occupied by Aztlan.
As a side note, Dirty Tricks makes it a point that "Ute investors" bought the land and refuse to sell it was if it was supposed to matter. In real life, private property is mostly irrelevant as to whether the Aztlan, Pueblo or Texas states recognize it as a territorial holding. Aztlan can sell lands it own to some Pueblo citizens and removes its troops and administration from the area, the Pueblo government has to accept control, and could also give it back to Texas on a whim. Not to mention the fact that buying all of El Paso 660km² estate for one nuyen ought to throw them among the richest individuals on Earth.
-
The Apache ended up in the Sioux Nation. Their opinion on the matters of PCC are almost certainly irrelevant as far as anyone with power in the PCC and Sioux are concerned.
-
There are apache in the Sioux according to NAN SB volume I and SiF: Sioux Nation. But none of them state all apache ended up in the Sioux (actually, none of them even remotely touch the issue beside name dropping). There are no apache presence listed for any of the other NAN, but such information is lacking, one way or another, for Aztlan, besides the fact Aztlan got all the southern portion of their lands.
So, major tribes partly or fully resettle one thousand kilometers north from where their territories were prior to the war and those territories happens to be the only part of US territory that gets annexed into a neighboring country instead of one of the new Native American Nations? That sure hints at serious effort to be sure their opinion would be irrelevant in the Pueblo. Whether it was the Hopi and Zuni tribe who didn't want the Apache inside their nation borders, or the Apache themselves who didn't want to be inside those borders.
-
Note that the "Sold for one Nuyen" allegation is just a rumor, not a proven fact. There's a lot of murk in that. INtentionally. :)
Have I uploaded the map that shows the territory? I don't know if it's ever been shown off. Hrm.
-
Then drop it here. I for one would like to see it as I'm not a US native.
-
Man, I forget sometimes how bad Photobucket's gotten. Teh ads... my system's old and crotchety (kinda like me) ... it can't handle it. Still, one upload later, and Rio Gambit is Go!
(http://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a140/Wakshaani/Wakshaani009/Rio_Gambit%20001_zpsbgstfqvv.jpg)
The darker red lines show the old border between the PCC and Aztlan and teh PCC and CAS. The outlined area is the land from teh Gambit. As you can see, Aztlan and the CAS still verymuch share a border; the Gambit drove a wedge into the PCC-CAS alliance, however, when the PCC didn't give it back when asked. Teh CAS, or more accurately Texas, sees the area as righfully theirs. The PCC disagreed. Tempers ... got hot.
-
Thank you kindly
-
My pleasure! As you can see, it's an area about as large as the state of Lousiana, so it's a LOT of land, and when compared to the overall size of teh PCC, it's not Lousiana Purchase big, but pretty dang big.
The reborn Rio Grande being in that chunk, and with it a lot of fresh water, is a *big* *deal* for teh Pueblo.
-
Whether it was the Hopi and Zuni tribe who didn't want the Apache inside their nation borders, or the Apache themselves who didn't want to be inside those borders.
Depends on how powerful old grudges are. It clearly influenced the formation of some states (i.e., how the Utes screwed over the Navajo Nation).
Then again, the first GGD strike blew the top off a very sacred Pueblo mountain when the Pueblo were integral to the movement. It's as weird as we need it to be.
-
Thanks for the replies all!
This is all very interesting. It looks like a nation that grew suddenly and violently, and may be feeling the aftershocks of that. A lot of competing voices that were not there before.
-
Here's an interesting point in that regard: Pueblos are now a minority in their own nation. Los Angeles had more people in it (barely!) than the PCC, and when you add in the Ute and teh Aztlan citizens who are now in the PCC, teh Pueblos are down to around 40% of their own country.
Which makes voting very, very interesting...
-
Eh. Once they recontextualized Mexicans being included in the NAN population by virtue of Aztlan being one of the NAN states during the Treaty of Denver, it made it a little easier to buy the PCC's population figures. But just in the former New Mexico territory, all of the Indians would've been outnumbered 4:1 by the Mexicans, and that Indian population is significantly Navajo. With them and more than a token amount of Apache out of the way, that would be even lower. Besides, the way Nigel wrote up the divide, it's almost like the Hopi and Zuni (Of all the Pueblos, too, why them?) became political identities rather than actual racial divides.
You know, Ghostwalker lucked out in having the country between his city and Aztlan be one filled with people that hate Aztlan and Azzies. Just me referring to us as Mexicans and not some other term would piss off some of them. And that's before you add the "I'm Mexican (or Central American), not Aztlaner" folks like Matador (RIP).
There's a lot of stuff to play with in Pueblo. I still don't have a good grip on life in Phoenix, but I imagine there's also plenty of resentment, annoyance, *something* at being governed by the governmental C-Suite and Board of Directors way the Hell off in Santa Fe. I mean, it's not like the Board is elected by geographical districts, so it's unclear how the government operates and considers the interests of that sprawl, aside from the fact that it's fairly large and near the Aztlan border, versus a country that stretches from Boise to the California Central Valley to Denver and with a southern border running from Orange County to Big Bend.
-
CAS relations
Aztlan relations
Los Angeles
Las Vegas
Mojave desert
troubles with the Ute population and Anglos
Inter tribal relations
Comanche mob
......and thats just the PCC specific Things, add in megacorps and strange magic and there's tonnes of stuff to use in a game set in the PCC
-
Don't forget the crazy Democracy levels they have, either, where the first thing you do each morning after waking up is checking to see what you're voting on that day. *everyone* votes on *everything*, with teh results handled via the Matrix, tabulated, and released by the afternoon. Setting budgets! New laws! Repealing OLD laws! Wheee! (Not that there'd be any tweaking of the results by people in power, oh no. Perish the thought.)
-
Don't forget the crazy Democracy levels they have, either, where the first thing you do each morning after waking up is checking to see what you're voting on that day. *everyone* votes on *everything*, with teh results handled via the Matrix, tabulated, and released by the afternoon. Setting budgets! New laws! Repealing OLD laws! Wheee! (Not that there'd be any tweaking of the results by people in power, oh no. Perish the thought.)
That was the Ute. In Pueblo, nuyen is the only thing that matters. You can literally buy votes since elections are based on the number of shares owned—like a corporation. Annual elections for the board of directors at the nation's annual meeting is all you get.
It works in a logarithmic scale, so 1 share = 1 vote, 1 million shares = 7 votes.
-
I wanted to point out that Ute investors could mean the Mormons of Salt Lake City. They were quite wealthy.
-
I wanted to point out that Ute investors could mean the Mormons of Salt Lake City. They were quite wealthy.
Unlikely. The LDS enclave (basically the SLC-Provo corridor) is for all intents and purposes its own country, which has only some things handled by the nation that surrounds them and of which they are vaguely a member.
-
You know that they are free traders right? That is water access into the Carribean.
Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't put it past either LDS or the Pueblos to false flag Ute interests in order to get Aztlan resources and access without besmirching their name. Also, the PCC grabbed L.A. due largely to water access. When Horizon essentially locked down the port, opening a secondary port via the Rio Grand means that the PCC is no longer at Horizon's mercy.
-
It looks like I'm probably going to go with the PCC over Seattle, though it's still probably a month and a half out for that. Lots of good info here, I appreciate it.
I've been looking at the map that comes with the Alpha-Kit, and I have a few more questions.
- Who are the dragons in Roswell and Albuquerque?
- So what exactly happens at these Mana Hotspots? There's a few in this area
- Any fun critters in the desert I can throw at my players for the fun of it?
-
Roswell was where Sirrurg relocated to. Aztechnology, assisting Aztlan, cleaned that nest out around the time he was 'killed'
Alberquerque is Celadyr, but he's a tad ... busy ... at the moment. You might note how close this lair of Celadyr, the current Loremaster of the Great Dragons, is to Ghostwalker's Denver. This could prove ... problematic... at some point in time.
-
You know that they are free traders right? That is water access into the Carribean.
Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't put it past either LDS or the Pueblos to false flag Ute interests in order to get Aztlan resources and access without besmirching their name. Also, the PCC grabbed L.A. due largely to water access. When Horizon essentially locked down the port, opening a secondary port via the Rio Grand means that the PCC is no longer at Horizon's mercy.
Who said PCC was ever at Horizon's mercy?
-
And considering the Rio Grande is essentially unnavigable over its entire length by anything but small boats ... so, nice try.
Also, investing in a country-corporation - especially to 'buy votes' - is not a wise investment strategy, especially as they have no need to influence PCC politics. The members of the Church would put investment capital in more reliable companies. I would also bet that there's essentially a gentlemen's agreement between them and whatever country they happen to be in the middle of, Ute or PCC - 'don't muck around in our business, and we won't muck around in yours.'
-
Who said PCC was ever at Horizon's mercy?
Corporate Enclave, Los Angeles section.
-
And considering the Rio Grande is essentially unnavigable over its entire length by anything but small boats ... so, nice try.
The army core of engineers stated that minor modifications could make it navigable to El Paso.
Aztechnology is heavy into agriculture and has canonical history with dam project up in the SSC. They know what they are doing with rivers. It is ridiculous to think Aztechnology did not maximize the usefulness of the Rio Grande.
-
The army core of engineers stated that minor modifications could make it navigable to El Paso.
...during the 1846-1847 Mexican-American War, with steamboats of the time.
Besides, if it's about the Pueblo getting sea access through Aztlan infrastructure in case Los Angeles-Long Beach would be unavailable, San Diego seems to be a much easier pick.
-
Would a reasonable plot point be the PCC actually invading San Diego to absorb it then? Or is that totally ridiculous?
-
Would a reasonable plot point be the PCC actually invading San Diego to absorb it then? Or is that totally ridiculous?
That'd be declaring war on Aztlan (And, by extension, Aztechnology), in order to conquer the largest military naval base on the west coast. The questions are: A) is it worth it and B) could you win?
In official records, the Ute had about 12 million population, the PCC had about 12 million, and LA had about 3 million, before "The gobbling". Pre-Rio Gambit, the PCC had an official population of 38.5 million. These numbers are likely inflated (The NAN were terrible about that), and a more likely number is circa 6 million, but, officially, the census figure is now at about 40 million.
Aztlan, officialliy, is at about 168 million.
So, The PCC is outnumbered by about 4:1, but does have higher tech. Magical assets are probably stronger on the Azzie side, depending on how much the Ute still have in the Great Ghost Dance tank.
It would be a very painful war, and without CAS support, the PCC isn't likely to win. And right now, teh CAS aren't friendly to either nation.
-
A better plot would be a shadow war between the PCC and Horizon, for the PCC to re-negotiate some of those contracts that have made Horizon such a powerhouse in Los Angeles. While there are in actuality far too many other corporations in LA to really be a problem for shipping - let's face it, what a national government uses shipping for is mostly military and humanitarian goods - but Horizon really, really doesn't want to push the PCC to the point of saying 'screw this, we're out of here', because if they did, an hour later Aztlan and Aztechnology rolls up to Horizon's corporate HQ and knocks with a tank round.
-
Since Aztlan doesn't really have any distractions to deal with then the answer would be a no. It might possibly could have been done during the Az/Am war
-
Since Aztlan doesn't really have any distractions to deal with then the answer would be a no. It might possibly could have been done during the Az/Am war
Ayup. The PCC and CAS were getting *quite* cozy, and with SIrrurg having moved into Roswell to strike at each of them as well as in Aztlan (Trying to trigger an international incident or seven), while teh Azzies were tied in with Amazonia, dealing with Sirrurg strikes, and having to worry about ever-twitchy Yucatan ... it was a bad place to be. The Rio Gambit dstracted the PCC and turned their CAS ally into an upset rival. Just like that, the Azzies freed up the northern border from what could have been serious invasion worries.
It was expensive, sure, but cheaper than war.
-
The no man's land between LA and San Diego is a toxic radioactive wasteland, according to Corporate Enclaves. Also, the Alchera in the area is problematic. Aztlan didn't offer up San Diego either.
A more viable, and likely already in place strategy is Boise, which is split between the SSC, TT and former Ute. The Snake and Columbia are both navigable, and closer to SLC. But the point may not be so much the actual use of the rivers, but rather the potential use. If you only have one port, that port has you by the short curlies. If you imply that you'll build another port, the first will fight to maintain its monopoly.
-
Typical river navigable is a long way short of an ocean port. Even the St. Lawrence seaway uses ships much smaller than current ocean going vessels. Offloader from a large freighter to a river boat may still be better than offloading to trucks .... but it is still vastly inferior to an ocean port.
-
Not to derail the conversation, which I am enjoying, but is Boise split in-canon? I know that's what the Shadowrun Wiki (http://shadowrun.wikia.com/wiki/Boise) says, but I've never seen that in print. Is that from Never Deal with a Dragon?
-
I'm gonna guess Shadows of North America has a tiny blurb.
I've just expanded it so much in my head canon that I'm not sure how much is published. As I recall, the bit I saw was before the Ute got annexed by the PCC.
-
I was under the impression that the Rio Grand was navigatible due to magic in a similar way it changed many other natural things.
-
Not to derail the conversation, which I am enjoying, but is Boise split in-canon? I know that's what the Shadowrun Wiki (http://shadowrun.wikia.com/wiki/Boise) says, but I've never seen that in print. Is that from Never Deal with a Dragon?
Tir Tairngire SB featured a map that interupt the border between Tir Tairngire and Salish-Shidhe where it sould go through Boise. The border otherwise follows the Instate-84, which would put Boise southern suburbs inside Tir Tairngire. According to the map, the Ute border appears to be about ten or twenty kilometers south of Boise.
As far as I can tell, the text never mentionned Boise situation. It worth noting the border between the Tir and the Salish doesn't result from an international treaty, but ought to hail from the initial Tir coup. The fact the map shows the border just above the I-84 may suggest the Tir border patrol drives it as a means of establishing their control. On the other hand, there should probably be a story for the Tir to control only Boise souther suburbs. The official story is that the Tir troops were highly successful, so rather than failing to take full control of the city, they may have only attempted to seize control of a Boise "immigrant district" (possibly because they were very far from the main objectives and possible reinforcements).
The map in Shadows of North America and Sixth World Almanac shows Boise at the point where Tir, Salish and Ute border join.
I haven't been able to find any text about Boise in Native American Nations, Volume 1, Tir Tairngire, Target: Smuggler Havens, Shadows of North America and Land of Promise. Only The Sixth World Almanac has one sentence, page 193. I have no idea where the Wikia gets the border raid in the late 2060ies from.
-
Shadows of North America does have two paragraphs on Boise plus one Shadowtalk comment. It talks about how Boise has had a rough century, ever since it was depopulated after the Treaty of Denver. See p 123:
"Originally the Cénesté claimed the city, but after a short fight with Salish loyalists they were forced out. Today the southwest corner of the city is technically in Tir hands - but this is more a polite fiction used to justify a large tax and duty free merchant zone."
I presume they actually mean "tax- and duty-free", as the current wording/punctuation somewhat suggests two opposites ("large tax" vs. "duty free").
Good thinking to check the map in Tir Tairngire. I hadn't thought to do that.
-
I was under the impression that the Rio Grand was navigatible due to magic in a similar way it changed many other natural things.
Not as far as I'm aware, but I'll confess to not having read everything there is - and I haven't read the NAN books or SoNA in a dog's life. I'm not saying it's not possible, because it absolutely is, but the Rio Grande is like a poor man's Nile river - one which without man's interference floods its length for about three weeks every spring as it takes care of the snowmelt from its catchment basin, but which (because of weather patterns) simply doesn't have enough for the rest of the year to be anything more than a nice, lazy, and relatively shallow river.
Just as an FYI, this is the Rio Grande's catchment basin:
(http://www.cerc.usgs.gov/data/best/search/images/RioGrandeBasin.jpg)
The waterflow of the dark brown area (northern basin) is primarily snow-melt driven, which is of course once per year; the waterflow of the light brown area (southern basin) is primarily summer rainfall, which isn't all that heavy due to the mountain ranges that are all right there west of them. (Snow has time to build up, and melts relatively all at once. :/ )
-
So I finally got Native American Nations 1, and I appreciate the little section in there on the PCC, though there isn't too much (and some of the information is outdated).
I was thinking of taking the airship system, and replacing it with a more widespread internal light rail system. Mainly because train based action sequences amuse me. Also, since I assume Aztechnology is out, who replaces the general nonsense like Stuffer Shack? Internal companies?
-
Understand that international finance and corporate law is bloody complex. Stuffer Shack may well be a corporation that is entirely owned by Aztechnology, but it is not Aztechnology, e.g. 'Aztechnology's Stuffer Shack'. The PCC doesn't want the AZT in its territory? Great, AZT can't be there, AZT troops can't march along the fence line, AZT guards can't stand inside the door with their assault rifles. That doesn't necessarily mean that Stuffer Shack, the wholly-owned corporation which itself might achieve a AA rating, is banned - because The Shack is not necessarily considered Aztechnology Corporate Property, any more than the local McHugh's franchise is the corporate property of the McHugh's Corporation. Oh, sure the one inside the Seattle Pyramid is, and perhaps the flagship store in Seattle is as well, but remember the baseline rule of extraterritoriality - it has to be clearly labelled as being owned by an extraterritorial corporation.
That said, it'd be relatively easy to simply reskin it. Grab a modern convenience store, stick it under a megacorporate flag (even the PCC's, because after all, they ARE a corporation), and poof, done.
About the rail system - could work, especially if it were a high-speed monorail between cities, with the airship stuff being only out from those 'lesser' depots. A RL high-speed rail line between Los Angeles and Las Vegas has been proposed I don't know how many times now ...
-
I had the individual Stuffer Shack franchises rebrand under another she'll corp. They might be called Stuf'R Shack or Cosa de Casa. They aren't extraterritorial and they stay small enough to go under the wealth cap for surprise inspections. They need to be careful about their goods so they have a pretty even spread of Pueblo goods . AZT goods get repackaged in SLC so that they count as domestic product.
-
That said, it'd be relatively easy to simply reskin it. Grab a modern convenience store, stick it under a megacorporate flag (even the PCC's, because after all, they ARE a corporation), and poof, done.
I ran a campaign in the PCC last year and did exactly this.
After a kilometer, there's an Apex - colloquially known as "The Ape" - the local competitor to Stuffer Shack. Stuffer Shack is owned by Aztechnology, which has been officially booted out of the PCC. They're dragging their heels, naturally, but in the meantime the locals are trying to grab market share.
-
Shadows of North America does have two paragraphs on Boise plus one Shadowtalk comment. It talks about how Boise has had a rough century, ever since it was depopulated after the Treaty of Denver. See p 123:
"Originally the Cénesté claimed the city, but after a short fight with Salish loyalists they were forced out. Today the southwest corner of the city is technically in Tir hands - but this is more a polite fiction used to justify a large tax and duty free merchant zone."
So I somehow managed to read this section twice and entirely skip those two sentences each time - I guess my eyes were searching for "Tairngire" or "Ute" keyword (the source for Ute/Pueblo presence do seems to be 6WA though).
Understand that international finance and corporate law is bloody complex. Stuffer Shack may well be a corporation that is entirely owned by Aztechnology, but it is not Aztechnology, e.g. 'Aztechnology's Stuffer Shack'. The PCC doesn't want the AZT in its territory? Great, AZT can't be there, AZT troops can't march along the fence line, AZT guards can't stand inside the door with their assault rifles. That doesn't necessarily mean that Stuffer Shack, the wholly-owned corporation which itself might achieve a AA rating, is banned - because The Shack is not necessarily considered Aztechnology Corporate Property, any more than the local McHugh's franchise is the corporate property of the McHugh's Corporation.
Using a subsidiary is so easy (either by creating a new company or buying an existing one) that is actually very rare, at least in real life, for the law to be naive enough to not account for this. Things like operating licenses usually require disclosure of ownership and changes in ownership or in less stringent cases, only foreign ownership. Bans then extend to any controlled subsidiary and possibly even independent subsidiaries. In the most stringent cases (like, for example, US ban on Iranian business), any business relationship can get you blacklisted, so as to defeat a lot of shell companies tricks.
There are ways to hide ownership. It can be as simple as setting up an intermediary level of separation with another subsidiary, if possible in a country that would shun legal requests about ownership. On the other hand, authorities may also deny operating licenses whenever the ownership trail looks suspicious.
Another methods is to have a completely separate company owned by one or several straw-men that would happen to be loyal former employees. The same same people would then set up another independent company in another country that will be used to channel profits to the parent company.
Overall, the biggest the operations, the more likely it will be subject to thorough inspections. It's one thing to set up a ten-employees shell company as a cover for black ops, and another to own a dozens of malls racking millions in profits around the country.
Also, hiding ownership excludes the subsidiary from the benefit of the parent company extraterritoriality among other things. Megacorporations are supposed to rule the world economy because extraterritoriality gives them an edge over the competition and because they have capabilities that are unavailable to smaller competitors (like paramilitary security forces, Matrix and magical assets...). A hidden subsidiary is not going to benefit from any of those - so it'll be playing the same game local companies and multinationals are playing, and likely losing it to other megacorporations.
-
To Nath's point, Native American Nations, Volume I has a Shadowtalk comment discussing exactly the same thing. I grant that it's from 25 years ago in-canon, but I still treat it as true in my campaigns.
>>>>>[The council's regulatory body really knows its drek, chummer. They check into every applicant company's ownership, and they know every trick in the fragging book: shell companies, indirect ownership, strawmen, the works. And even if things look cool on the surface, they've got real smooth deckers who can crack into anything to make sure it's cool under the surface too.]<<<<<
-Digital Alien (03:50:26/3-18-52)
Hey, this Friday will be the pre-anniversary of that comment! Only 36 more years to go.