[Michael Chandra]

Really? Because that is listed in Unwired as a possible example. Or do you mean most GMs wouldn't allow that since it demands too much finetuning the command so is unreasonable as an option unless it's a really well-written virus or a Sprite?

[JoeNapalm]

Not the part about hacking an arm and making it attack the owner.

I've seen several people state that as fact, but none support it with an explanation.


Unwired 102:

It would take too much space to provide an exhaustive list of possibilities, but here are a few examples (players and gamemasters are encouraged to be creative when devising other options—as always, the gamemaster has final say):
• Cybereyes can be shut down or crashed to make the target blind.
• Pre-recorded or self-created (using Computer + Edit) sounds could be played within hacked cy-
berears to make the target hear things.
• Incriminatingevidence(forexample,forgedsmartlinkfootage
of a shooting) could be downloaded into an implant’s memory,
framing the victim for a crime.
• The implant may be activated (for example, triggering foot an-
chor implants to keep someone from running away) or shut down
(turning an internal air tank off, to force them to breathe).
• The target character may be shut out of controlling his own implants by deactivating DNI or altering the account privileges
(requiring a Hacking + Editing Test).
• Seizing control of a cyberarm and using it to attack others, or
even the cyberlimbed character.

Emphasis mine.

Now, yes, there are many defenses and requirements to get to that point, but if you do...they've got a serious problem.


-Jn-
Ifriti Sophist

[mtfeeney = Baron]

There you go.  I just wish someone had posted that earlier, since it was one of the earlier points of contention.  Now the question is just whether ou can hack from DNI-enabled devices to other DNI-enabled devices via the DNI.

[Michael Chandra]

By the way, those are possible examples. It would be reasonable that, giving how it takes time to learn how to use a cyberlimb, only a rigger who has experience with cyberlimbs can use the limb for that. Or a well-programmed virus, or a sprite.

[mtfeeney = Baron]

Or for all we know, the limb has a completely user-friendly internal interface...  Maybe it has a super simple system, like internal commands that intuitively control it.  We honestly just don't know.  The arm could be wired exactly like a real arm, or the DNI-linked translator part could be converting your brain's muscle-movement signals into the command "punch 45 degrees down, 12 degrees right".

[Michael Chandra]

Augmentation 32:

Unless otherwise stated, cyberware that is capable of being activated or deactivated can be done so with a mental impulse. This is because the cyberware has been connected to the user’s nervous system, so it can be used in the same way the user would move a finger or flex a muscle. Typically, when a cyberware device is installed, the user must spend some time adjusting to this new ability and will doubtlessly trigger the device accidentally a few times. Activating or deactivating cyberware is a Free Action.

It's extremely usage-friendly, but then again you're not jumped in so you basically have to simulate the brain signals.

[JoeNapalm]

Augmentation 32:

Unless otherwise stated, cyberware that is capable of being activated or deactivated can be done so with a mental impulse. This is because the cyberware has been connected to the user’s nervous system, so it can be used in the same way the user would move a finger or flex a muscle. Typically, when a cyberware device is installed, the user must spend some time adjusting to this new ability and will doubtlessly trigger the device accidentally a few times. Activating or deactivating cyberware is a Free Action.

It's extremely usage-friendly, but then again you're not jumped in so you basically have to simulate the brain signals.

Why would they take a step backwards?

A cyberlimb has it's own control software.

The DNI converts neural impulses into a signal that the limb can use, but someone hacking into the limb is behind the DNI.  They don't need neural input. They're in the limb. They own the limb. Neural input is a huge step backwards.

It's like saying, "If you hack a computer remotely, you have to simulate keyboard and mouse input!"

No. Just no. Once you're in, you control the limb directly, using it's own built-in software.

The full section I cited from Unwired (I'm not pasting in entire pages) doesn't say anything about needing pilot programs, simulated neural input, or anything else. To contradict the section I cited above, you'll have to provide some evidence from one of the books.



-Jn-
Ifriti Sophist

[Michael Chandra]

Good point. If they manage to get into the limb itself, it'd work. But that's if they get into the limb. If they get into your Sim-system and can only pass on mental commands to the limbs, it'd be a different tale and the best they could do is likely just turning it off.

[JoeNapalm]

True, though I'd take dead cyber over dead meat any day!


-Jn-
Ifriti Sophist

[Michael Chandra]

Whelp, they're making this interesting in 5e, with some gear having an increased bonus with wireless on over wireless off, the bonus being higher if the risk is greater.

[Basic]

What are some reasons some one would even bother having wireless on in there cyberware.

[Mirikon]

What are some reasons some one would even bother having wireless on in there cyberware.

Enhanced functionality, such as getting diagnostic reports, etc. But since cyberware is pretty much always slaved to the PAN, it still means hacking the PAN and going in from there is still the easiest way to go.

[Aryeonos]

Their signal is so bad anyway it would take a microdrone to tap it just to hack the limb directly.

[Michael Chandra]

Technically the cyberware is connected to your brains. Only some cyberware would require slaving to your PAN. Wired Reflexes and Cyberlimbs can be controlled purely with the mind.

[CanRay]

"Mungo'z inn yur brainz."  "Haxxorzing his Cybernetics?"  "Noo.  I haz knifey."