[White_Ghost]

I'm holding judgement until I've got the book in my hand, but going by what others are saying, it seems like TM's got hit with a giant nerf bat, which makes me frown. They were great generalists before, and now they're seemingly poor at everything, but have a chance of coming out ahead if a game lasts 50 sessions.

I hope when you get the book, you'll find that incorrect. The TM is looking like a very attractive option to me.

Yeah, you have between 25 and 50 karma you can spend during chargen for character improvement.  There's a list of specific items you can spend it on in the Chargen chapter, but there's honestly no real reason you couldn't houserule that you can start as an initiate with it.

I like this rule. And there's always the option of starting at a higher level than character creation by adding a little karma.

[Boomstick]

• Technomancers have more upward growth, but less versatility. Complex forms are powerful, and can hedge around OS, but TMs are limited to only a few CFs to start with, and may only know Res x 2 total.

ONLY? Well, if programs are expensive, as are decks, well I guess having a max of 12 (because I guess TM will mostly be maxed for the sake of being able to chose level 6 rating when needed) CF is not so limiting. Especially when there is for now a total of 14 CF
And I don't know the total number of programs, but by nature, it is more limited than spells.

[White_Ghost]

Keep in mind that Complex Forms are markedly more powerful than normal programs, if not only because of the fact that using them doesn't accrue Overwatch Score.

I'm also sure that there will be more when we get our hands on the Matrix splat book.

[Boomstick]

Which add to my point that versatility is not a real problem to TM by saying that basically they even have even more power. Great;)

[Reiper]

Keep in mind that Complex Forms are markedly more powerful than normal programs, if not only because of the fact that using them doesn't accrue Overwatch Score.

I'm also sure that there will be more when we get our hands on the Matrix splat book.

So if I'm understanding overwatch correctly, this means TMs will end up being more covert in their hacking, assuming they stay smart? Of course they are still limited by their complex forms, especially starting out

[StarManta]

So if I'm understanding overwatch correctly, this means TMs will end up being more covert in their hacking, assuming they stay smart? Of course they are still limited by their complex forms, especially starting out

More covert, yes, completely covert, no. None of the complex forms actually gain you marks on a target, so you still have to use normal matrix actions for a lot of stuff. But, you can use Cleaner on your overwatch score....

So, yeah. More covert, just not completely.

[Reiper]

So if I'm understanding overwatch correctly, this means TMs will end up being more covert in their hacking, assuming they stay smart? Of course they are still limited by their complex forms, especially starting out

More covert, yes, completely covert, no. None of the complex forms actually gain you marks on a target, so you still have to use normal matrix actions for a lot of stuff. But, you can use Cleaner on your overwatch score....

So, yeah. More covert, just not completely.

True, if they were completely covert then they would be overpowered. Right now, it seems they may have a pretty nice niche in stealth hacking, but obviously they still have to work at it and be careful, especially since they take stun damage.

[StarManta]

Actually, they take physical. Technomancers always hot-sim now unless they're in AR.

[Baquette]

They were always hotsim in SR4 as well IIRC.

MfG

[RHat]

Actually, they take physical. Technomancers always hot-sim now unless they're in AR.

Rgith, but unless it's changed from SR4A, Matrix damage goes to stun for them. And if Matrix damage goes straight to physical...  That would be a bad change.

[StarManta]

Matrix damage does indeed go to Stun, but hot simming means that biofeedback does physical.

[RHat]

That's more in line with expectations...  How's biofeedback damage work in regards to resistance?

[Shinobi Killfist]

If you let your hacker hit that many major systems with no ill consequences, it's not the game that made it that easy, it's you. It's your job to instill a sense of reality and consequence. It's your job to make the government and corporations something to fear, not just mindless and weak corporations.

Damnit man.

um he only had to hack 2 systems, the local court system(not exactly a AAA) showing the decison went to lone star x and a local doc wagon facility,(agai not exactly a AAA) forging a doc does not require them to hack a system all they had to do was put it in 2 places.  The adventure gave them a long time and the long hack is stupid hard to stop in 4e.

1.  I don't artificially increase the challenge to make the run more dangerous/difficult
2.  I actually use the matirx rules.
3.  I don't bone people because they came up with a good plan and I want things to be hard for them.

You are right though, I had one job.  To run a fun adventure, I succeeded.

[RHat]

On the subject of Matrix Rules...

1) Is there any indication of how they're going to handle inter-stream balance for Technomancers?  There seems to be some risk of Logic streams becoming the ultimate technomancers, which I would certainly not like to see.

2) Is it possible to run Programs not relating to Sleaze or Attack from a Commlink?

[DamienHollow]

How do non hacker defend against hacks? Firewall? ICE / agents? Nothing?

MfG

Skin Link and fiber optic cable...