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need help with security ideas

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Tenabrae

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« on: <09-17-13/1901:57> »
Hi guys new to the forums but I've been running various games for about 5 years. My main group
(yay all my friends and family in one spot, a miracles has occurred), and they all may very good character, however they are very poor. They have decided that after this run they want to hit up a store that sells phones and cyberdecks,,,,,  :oTo their credit they are a well organized and fairly stealthy group. MY problem is that the phones and cyberdecks are pricey and I cant see the normal guy wearing the store uniform being the only type of security on something that can cost from 50k to 350k, But at the same time I don't think that Judge Dredd would make a good salesman or even a mall cop. Any Ideas.  BTW if this is in the wrong forum sorry in advance

Shamie

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« Reply #1 on: <09-17-13/2210:23> »
do you mean going at night or a full frontal robbery?

If it is the later you have many options. For one every item in the store has rifttags (or whatever the name for electronic tags shadowrun use) that is gonna be track to the runners location. Maybe the Judge Dredd isnt the vendor but he is gonna track them. If it is a good store with access to expensive goodies chances are they are in a hood with good security.

hope it helps

Tenabrae

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« Reply #2 on: <09-18-13/0005:23> »
Thanks for the reply. I like the rifttags (or whatever they are called). They plan on doing this at night  and as stealthily as the can. I also believe the plan to case the joint lol. Also yes it is in a good neighborhood, I don't see some of the lower end places having the gear they want and even in the good ones they don't have to many (1 or 2 at best) due to fact not everyone can afford it . Normally this group doesn't think of robbing things outside of the contract so to speak but I can see why.  Trying to be fair and not outright saying no this place doesn't exist  is kinda difficult. I want them to struggle and conquer, to get that feeling of satisfaction and not to kinda cheat.  Sadly though me as a player would think of it as well. I mean your are a criminal after all so might as well. Anyway that's off topic, Any other ideas would be appreciated.

RHat

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« Reply #3 on: <09-18-13/0014:18> »
What is it that they want?
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Tenabrae

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« Reply #4 on: <09-18-13/0040:33> »
The want to hit up something like a Apple store. They want phones and more importantly they want cyberdecks. They want to upgrade the teams decker and to sell the excess on the black market. They do have the contacts for selling and buying illegal goods. I of course wont let them have the absolute top of the line, there is no way that they have that when it comes to cyberdecks. But with that said they may have  the 12r ones (1 or 2) and thats close to a million. The lowest cyberdeck is almost 50k. Phones however are a different issue but just as bad. even if they have only ten of the top  thats 80K. (using 5th ed) and they can stuff quite a bit of those in a duffel bag not to mention cyberdecks. Small easy to transport and have and excellent resale value not to mention worth a small fortune, smart but kinda game breaking. 

RHat

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« Reply #5 on: <09-18-13/0104:19> »
I wouldn't expect it to be possible, at all, to walk into a store and come out with a cyberdeck - you'd have to come back again later once it actually shows up.  Commlinks and such could be sold at the standard rates (perhaps reduced for the legality of the item), I suppose, but for the top end ones 10 on hand seems high, and keep in mind that fencing stuff gets you 25% of the price.

Past a certain price point, a retail establishment simply will not have a particular item on site.  Going with a simple nuyen = real dollars conversion, even commlinks seem too expensive for that.
« Last Edit: <09-18-13/0106:35> by RHat »
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Tenabrae

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« Reply #6 on: <09-18-13/0119:28> »
Huh, ok why wouldn't they have a few cyberdecks. Is it because of the restricted nature?  I do like the idea of the that you have to order and you can pick up at the store but doesn't that lose business? Wouldnt they keep an example of the product to show people at the very least? That would however solve my problem unless they do something to make the product arrive there. Like make an order than steal it type deal. And yes some of them did take the SIN flaw. But even if that happens they get the one and just the one. Kinda screwed on the phone thing however. They would keep quite a few on hand to sell even the best but I could limit the number of all the phones. Thanks man keep it coming this is very helpful.

RHat

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« Reply #7 on: <09-18-13/0123:15> »
Combination of their restricted nature, and the fact that they're just too damn valuable - you have to expect a certain amount of "shrink" in retail, after all.

And the deck wouldn't likely be sent until after it's been fully paid for, so ordering it to sell isn't all that functional.
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Dangersaurus

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« Reply #8 on: <09-18-13/1043:42> »
Cyberdecks  are illegal right? Or at least the parts that allow hot-sim? Seems like the store would have a souped-up hobbyist commlink called a "Novatech Navigator Kit," which is (wink-wink-nod-nod) "fully customizable."  Customers or resellers would then assemble it using after-market parts to make it into a true cyberdeck.

Some of the parts and software - the hot-sim patch in particular - might not even be sold in the same store for plausible deniability (like head shops in cities where pot is illegal for example - you can buy pipe parts, maybe you can buy a complete pipe or bong. You have the find the final component off-site).

Magnaric

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« Reply #9 on: <09-18-13/1116:21> »
Personally, I say let them pick the difficulty. Case in point;

Say there's a store that sells Cyberdecks/Cyberwear/expensive Commlinks/other techy valuables. Now, first obstacle is that right out of the gate they require basic info, background checks for customers, etc. Okay, decent fake SIN can take care of that with a little luck. Next, they have different availability for different levels of gear. Say the basic inventory is street-level, common stuff. Think the basic HTC or Samsung phones the back of a store has in boxes. Decent, make a quick buck on them, but not exactly a huge payday. Those they keep in store at all times because they sell regularly.

Then there's the showcase models. These are the ones they have in the glass cases for display, and while they have some of them in stock to buy, it's a limited inventory. However, they're a step above the regular, run of the mill stuff, something only yuppies with rich parents can usually afford.

And finally, there's the premier model, the creme-De-la-creme, that's the newest hot model. It has all the bells and whistles, newest tech, and is a pricy mo-fo. Everyone wants one. However, the store doesn't keep them in stock, they only order them to buy for individual customers. And to order one, you have to give your usual background info, SIN, etc, but also a downpayment of say something like 10% or so, to ensure you're a serious buyer.

Now, the store itself has regular security, alarms, motion sensors, basic Matrix secuirty firewall, etc. Nothing insane but a decent bit. Additionally, the showcase models are kept in secured display cases that only the store manager and assistant manager have the key to. Those display cases can be cracked, but they're tamper-proof glass, have extra secirity focused on them at night, etc.

The other thing is the area of town. This is a decent store, so this district is patrolled by LoneStar/Knight Errant foot patrols and drones, with regular beat cops driving around in their cars just like regular cities nowadays. So basically, they now have a choice.

A) Try to grab the lower-tier models, maybe have a decent operation to scan and wipe the RFID tage from them and try to sell them for a profit. Granted, they have multiple units to sell in order to make any kind of money, which will be harder since they would likely have to find multiple fences, depending how many they steal. Involves getting past street security, overcoming the store security, and grabbing the units without setting off any alarms, plus removing any ID tags and finding a low-level fence.

B) Go for the showcase models. Involves all the same as option A, as well as getting into the tamper-resistant display cases, or into the secure area of the back where they keep them. Again, RFID tags, plus registration numbers on them and such. Fence would have to be low to mid level, since these units are still fairly common but not exactly throwaway or single-use stuff. Might even be worth keeping if any of the PCs can use them as upgrades, though they'd want to scrutinize them for tags, redundant security, etc first.

C) In order to get access to the best of the best the store has requires some legwork. Not only do the PCs have to have someone pose as a potential buyer, his background and fake SIN have to be nearly flawless. Plus he'll need a dummy bank account with funds in it to make a downpayment, or at least a certified credstick with the funds on it. This is where the party face really shines, as the ability to schmooze can really make or break a situation like this. Assuming everything looks good and they order the unit, the PCs will then have to do some checking on the ETA of the unit in order to intercept it, likely on the truck in transit. Otherwise they can try to break into the store afterwards for it, but security might be tightened at this point, depending how suspicious/prudent the manager of the store is.
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RHat

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« Reply #10 on: <09-18-13/1810:52> »
Cyberdecks  are illegal right? Or at least the parts that allow hot-sim? Seems like the store would have a souped-up hobbyist commlink called a "Novatech Navigator Kit," which is (wink-wink-nod-nod) "fully customizable."  Customers or resellers would then assemble it using after-market parts to make it into a true cyberdeck.

Some of the parts and software - the hot-sim patch in particular - might not even be sold in the same store for plausible deniability (like head shops in cities where pot is illegal for example - you can buy pipe parts, maybe you can buy a complete pipe or bong. You have the find the final component off-site).

Cyberdecks are simply restricted, not outright illegal - if you have the right licence, it is entirely legal to possess.  That includes the otherwise illegal components like the hot sim module.

Deck building rules would be required for what you're suggesting anyways, and those won't be seen until (probably) Data Trails.
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Dangersaurus

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« Reply #11 on: <09-18-13/1813:07> »
Any competent GM could make up some ad hoc rules for assembling a deck. Why such an emphasis around here on "wait for this supplement" and "wait for that supplement"? People are playing RIGHT NOW.

RHat

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« Reply #12 on: <09-18-13/1824:06> »
Any competent GM could make up some ad hoc rules for assembling a deck. Why such an emphasis around here on "wait for this supplement" and "wait for that supplement"? People are playing RIGHT NOW.

No GM is gonna want to throw together rules that let players cheat their way around the costs for things like decks.
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Dangersaurus

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« Reply #13 on: <09-18-13/1828:10> »
Absolutely gobsmacked. I suggested it as a way to say that all the parts wouldn't be in the same place, or even available.

RHat

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« Reply #14 on: <09-18-13/1917:49> »
Absolutely gobsmacked. I suggested it as a way to say that all the parts wouldn't be in the same place, or even available.

Which is fair, but keep in mind that it's actually contrary to how the deck rules/fluff stand.  For example, your suggestion more or less requires a hot-sim module to be sold separately, which (unlike a cyberdeck with an integral hot-sim module) is flat out illegal.
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