[HarshRhettoric]

So I am a Street Samurai, the most lethal predator in the sprawl.  There is nothing I cannot kill.  I have just come into a lot of money--enough to go from Wired Reflexes 2 to a Synaptic Accelerator 2.

What happens to the essence that is left over?  Do I get it back?  Can I get clonal parts to restore my meat?  Can I use it immediately to get different augmentations that have little or nothing to do with my nervous system?  Am I stuck with these implants until I'm old and the wired reflexes kill me?  This is an oft-overlooked aspect that most GMs gloss over, because no one wants to tell their player that they will be stuck at .8 Essence forever.  I always sort of imagined that most shadowrunners get into the business on the assumption that someday, they will be able to shed all of the skillwires and adrenal pumps and live a relatively normal life.

Thoughts?

[firebug]

The rules in previous editions have made it pretty clear; you are stuck at .8 Essence forever.  If you remove augmentation, you get an "essence hole".  For example, my character has a R4 Used Skillwire system and an R4 Used Skilljack, totalling 1.0 Essence cost.  When she eventually upgrades them to R5 Betaware, together they will only cost 0.7--  But she still only has 5 Essence.  However, if she gets more 'ware, like, say, a Pain Editor that costs 0.3 Essence, it would "fill" the Essence Hole first, and wouldn't end up lowering my Essence by more.

Here's another example if that one was kinda scatted.

Buy R2 Muscle Replacement: 4 Essence

Sell R2 Muscle Replacement, buy R2 Muscle Toner & R2 Muscle Augmentation:  4 Essence with a 1.2 Essence Hole

Buy R1 Wired Reflexes on top of the Muscle Toner and Muscle Augmentation:  3.2 Essence
Essence doesn't come back, sadly.  Related, this is why critters with Essence Drain (like Vampires) are so dangerous.

[DeathEatsCurry]

There was a crazy expensive treatment in Augmentation for SR 4 i believe that allowed you to slowly heal back essence (Might have been cyber induced essense only) aaand thats about it.

[firebug]

There was a crazy expensive treatment in Augmentation for SR 4 i believe that allowed you to slowly heal back essence (Might have been cyber induced essense only) aaand thats about it.

Oh yeah, here it is.  It gave you back 0.1 Essence (that wasn't currently being taken up by augmentations) back per month, with a price of 75,000¥ at the start and then an extra 20,000¥ every months, and you needed to spend 7 days every month in the clinic, or else you had to pay the 75k "starting cost" again.

It'd probably be more expensive now; everything else went up in price, and there's almost no way it was done without some kind of nanotechnology making it easier (thus explaining an increase in price, as that can't be relied upon anymore).

[JimmyCrisis]

I would totally allow essence to heal up over time.  Years, really, but still, it should come back.

[Reaver]

I would totally allow essence to heal up over time.  Years, really, but still, it should come back.

You can "regrow" a Soul??

Cause that is what essence represents. Your Soul, Will-to-live, Super Ego.... Essence is that intangible 'thing' that makes you unique. ... Not sure how you regrow that..

[Senko]

Think of it in the sense of recovering from traumatic evets sure they'll never be who they were but eventually they'll still be able to function. Rather good example of this is in the rose queen where a guy is tortured and broken when young. Eventually over the course of the book he recovers and becomes a strong leader and warrior but he's never who he would have been.

[Michael Chandra]

There was a crazy expensive treatment in Augmentation for SR 4 i believe that allowed you to slowly heal back essence (Might have been cyber induced essense only) aaand thats about it.

Oh yeah, here it is.  It gave you back 0.1 Essence (that wasn't currently being taken up by augmentations) back per month, with a price of 75,000¥ at the start and then an extra 20,000¥ every months, and you needed to spend 7 days every month in the clinic, or else you had to pay the 75k "starting cost" again.

It'd probably be more expensive now; everything else went up in price, and there's almost no way it was done without some kind of nanotechnology making it easier (thus explaining an increase in price, as that can't be relied upon anymore).

And of course the most important part: Damage done to Magic/Resonance was not restored, so your maximum remained the same and your current value as well.

[Poindexter]

i feel like with great attention to self, serious reflection, and a good deal of private time, yeah. you can re-grow a soul.

[Sendaz]

or with the right mojo, just steal some from someone else. 

[JimmyCrisis]

I would totally allow essence to heal up over time.  Years, really, but still, it should come back.

You can "regrow" a Soul??

Cause that is what essence represents. Your Soul, Will-to-live, Super Ego.... Essence is that intangible 'thing' that makes you unique. ... Not sure how you regrow that..

Well, considering that there is no evidence a soul exists in the first place, I suppose that how it works in game depends on what mythology you prefer.  But essence is also a reflection of your humanity and identity.

Let me pose a question.  You buy and axe.  When the handle breaks chopping wood, you replace the handle.  Later that summer, the head chips and you replace the head.  Is it still the same axe?  When you have cyberware installed, that's the question your essence is asking.  If your souls is comfortable in your body, it sticks around.

Now, why that is relevant is this:  our bodies are growing and shedding cells every day.  Every seven years, all of your organs have been regrown and replaced, you literally have a new body.  So, if you don't lose essence every seven years, what does that imply?  I think it means that your essence becomes accustomed to its container.  Each scrape or scratch won't peel off your essence.  Even nearly bleeding out won't.  So, the way I see it, you essence will eventually regrow to fill it's container, cyberware included.  Will it ever get back up to 6?  Maybe not.

[Michael Chandra]

Yeah, no. Fluff and mechanics are against it.

[JimmyCrisis]

Yeah, no. Fluff and mechanics are against it.

Apparently, not in 4th edition.  What makes SR unique among RPGs is that each edition follows a coherent timeline in which all the other editions still exist.  A technique or practice from S4 still exists in the setting.  Thus, existing magic treatments that restore essence would still be possible in this edition.

Besides, we're talking hypothetical, not practical.  Your Shadowrunner will have to have all his cyber replaced by the time their essence would regrow into it, negating any benefit.

[Michael Chandra]

Yeah, no. Fluff and mechanics are against it.

Apparently, not in 4th edition.

A very expensive special procedure is far from natural recovery like your idea, and even that did not help against magic loss. Furthermore, you were talking about regrowing even past cyberware, which was not in SR4. SR4 merely let you slowly heal your essence hole. So no, even in 4th edition the fluff and mechanics are against it.

[Namikaze]

I agree with Michael - from what I've read of the process, it involved some weird bastardization of magic and technology, and still had its limitations.  Once you've lost your humanity, it's lost to you.  You might be able to fake it with some tech, but the real thing is gone.