[blinkdog]

In the last session, my runners finally figured out that Mr. Johnson's property had been taken to an Aztechnology research facility.

Their response? Call Mr. Johnson directly and tell him they aren't going to finish the run unless they get paid more! 

I rolled with it, and had Mr. Johnson agree to pay them more, but I'm still working out the proper fallout.
Some ideas I've had in mind run along these lines:

- Have Mr. Johnson call the team's Fixer to offer him "his additional cut", have the fixer get really pissed (-1 Loyalty for the contact for each runner)
- Have the fixer call the runners while they are in the middle of sneaking around the facility ... Oops, did one of you forget to set your commlink on silent?
- Have the fixer yell at the characters via commlink while the guards are shooting/casting at them (distraction penalties to dice pools for that combat)
- If the runners don't make good with Mr. Johnson (restore the original rate), they each get a notoriety point.

The player group is not new to role-playing, but they are new to the Shadowrun world.
Truthfully, this Mr. Johnson doesn't have the resources to put the hurt on the team, so they wouldn't have to retire from the shadows.
However, I think I do need some character consequences to drive home the idea: Renegotiating mid-run with the wrong Mr. Johnson is a TERRIBLE idea.

Any other GMs willing to weigh in with ideas or commentary?

[Michael Chandra]

I heavily disagree with the second option. You'd basically be punishing the players for not thinking of every move their characters would make. Some things are just default procedures so do not require being spelled out.

I'd give them one Notoriety for crossing the Johnson, though it might wear off eventually if they can prove they were being underpaid (look at the sample rewards to figure out what would have been a decent pay-out).

By the way, since it's fair to give extra payout for jobs that are way tougher if you follow the Rewards table, but the J cannot offer that up front (unless the team is smart and negotiates a complications-that-aren't-our-fault fee), it makes sense to allow for a raised offer or alternative additional payment midjob. If you are originally doing a 9k job but the difficulty level rises to one worth of a 15k job, I think I got the right to renegotiate. My runners did the same when their enemies turned out not to be Soldati but Bug-Soldati, and they were in the right.

[Reaver]

At the end of the run, have the Johnson screw over the Runners at the exchange.

●credit stick  has been tampered with so that only the original payment is available.

● Johnson shows up with a LOT of muscle and just takes the item (or tries to)

● johnson shows up with the original payment. Take it or leave it. (Remind them they have HOT, stolen property that Aztech just might want back....)


Or, maybe they do get their extra bonus, but the Fixer yells at them and tells them they now have a big black mark on their names. In the shadows, a deal is a deal. *until the screw over....

[Rift_0f_Bladz]

I would go with notority, that is what it is there for. But I also have to agree with the Runners, that was beyond what they were hired for, so they have the right to renegotiate. The other ideas are extreme. And a Johnson screwing with runners to much might wont live long.

[Namikaze]

Remember that Mr. Johnson's primary objective is the completion of the mission.  Once the mission is complete, the team is expendable.  Mr. Johnson should definitely set up an ambush to try to geek the team.  If the team is wise, they'll predict this and set up some sort of leverage on Mr. Johnson.  If the players manage to get away Scot-free via this leverage method, they should be allowed to do so.  Read up on the perspective of Mr. Johnsons in Run Faster - it's clearly a chess game, and the runners found a way to make Mr. Johnson lose.  If Mr. Johnson gets the chance, he'll try to keep the money that he promised to the runners as a result, but if the runners are smart and prepared then Mr. Johnson has lost and he'll lick his wounds and move on.  Next time Mr. Johnson tries to hire these guys though, he'll be extra wary.

As to why not implementing the Notoriety - I'd only avoid implementing Notoriety if the team comes up with leverage on Mr. Johnson.  This would mean Mr. Johnson can't afford to go telling the other Mr. Johnsons of the world that this team is unreliable, extorted more money, etc. because then his secret would get out.  If Mr. Johnson ambushes the team and they fight their way out of the ambush, odds are great that they aren't going to get the money.  It also means Mr. Johnson probably doesn't have the mission completed.  So they'd want to set up a second meeting to resolve things.

And seriously, Mr. Johnson should never have agreed to give them more money.  They took the job, and that's that.  If they walked away from the job because it's an Aztechnology building, then they'd have earned a point of Notoriety and maybe a negative point of Street Cred.  As it is, they just turned the relationship with Mr. Johnson into a hostile one - Mr. Johnson should be prepared for a hostile response.

[ZeConster]

Remember that Mr. Johnson's primary objective is the completion of the mission.  Once the mission is complete, the team is expendable.  Mr. Johnson should definitely set up an ambush to try to geek the team.

Actually, I think there's a part in Run Faster where a Johnson explains he'll steal from runners if he can (if you're incompetent and weak enough to let it happen, you deserve it, he argues), but he's never killed a team afterwards, because that's bad for your reputation.

[Spooky]

Personally, I would go with either one of Reaver's options or Namikaze's direction, depending on the table that I am gm for.

[MijRai]

Eh, I'm of a slightly different opinion than folks, it seems.  I'd say if the job changes to a great extent (like 'recover this property from a private residence' to 'recover this property from a secured Aztechnology facility/MCT Zero Zone/dragon lair/what-have-you') then negotiating for more payment (be it money, favors, equipment, what-have-you) is completely fine. 

Now, if they go about it in a bad way, then there should be negative ramifications for how they handled it.  Threats, punishments, reprisals, no extra pay, etc.  But that's if they handle the situation poorly.  Calling up and mentioning that 'milk run' where you have to take a baby's piece of candy has turned into breaking into a corporate stronghold, makes total sense for a renegotiation, especially if you weren't fed the whole story or something along those lines.  Taking the corporate stronghold infiltration job, then threatening to quit if you don't get an extra 10,000 nuyen apiece or you'll sell the Johnson out, or something like that?  He should be trying to bend you over every barrel possible. 

[Namikaze]

Eh, I'm of a slightly different opinion than folks, it seems.  I'd say if the job changes to a great extent (like 'recover this property from a private residence' to 'recover this property from a secured Aztechnology facility/MCT Zero Zone/dragon lair/what-have-you') then negotiating for more payment (be it money, favors, equipment, what-have-you) is completely fine.

That's true.  We don't really know what Mr. Johnson told the crew to begin with.  I was operating from the position that he had told them it was located at a specific address or whatnot.  The team should be more than capable of looking that up before the meet is done.

[Sendaz]

A situation not dissimilar to this came up in Fire & Frost, pg 163-164, where through a series of events now has the team possibly going down to Antarctica.  (transport would be on the Johnson's tab )

They made it perfectly clear to the Johnson that the current rate of pay was not going to cut it. 

He was not amused, but he agreed to double the pay.

Sometimes circumstances do change and if significant, a change in pay is not uncalled for.

[Tai-Pan]

The topic renegotiation is also mentioned in the Manhattan fluff from stolen souls. While i wouldn't make it a rule there are times when it will happen.

[Reaver]

There are exceptions to every run.

But the question stands as: "what is expected VS what is offered"

If a Johnson hires you to track down an item in the city, and recover it, then expect to have to raid a complex. The item ain't in Starbucks, otherwise the Johnson could have gotten it himself.

On the same note, if the item has been taken to a different country, well, in many Runner's eyes, the job is done as the item left their search zone. If the Johnson still wants it recovered, then he should expect to have to pay more. (Or at least cover the incidentals)

But, calling up and demanding more money when the scope of the original agreement still stands? That is how Runners end up in gutter... with large holes in them.

[Emperors Grace]

I dunno..., did they know they were running against AAA in the original deal?  If so the difficulty level didn't really change.

I would have had the Johnson (as he's low level threat wise) tersely agree but then (after exchange) the group gains noteriety and the fixer calls them to say "not cool" as the Johnson docks the fixer's take to reclaim the loss.  (How they now handle their fixer might change loyalty ratings).

If they agreed to a milk run on a mom and pop and the johnson snuck in a AAA hit, all's fair to renegotiate (and inform the fixer that you're pissed that he hooked you up with a weasel).  Also fair for the Johnson to leverage word of mouth during renegotiaton and/or offer the whole gig to a different team.

(edits for spelling)

[The Wyrm Ouroboros]

Just because the Johnson didn't have complete info on the target doesn't mean the PCs get to renegotiate when the going gets tough.  Run Faster has some great Johnson-POV thoughts on this, and for the most part, I agree.  The facility has higher-than-standard security that you didn't know about until you were hip-deep in the place?  Too bad, why didn't you do your research, and where's my gizmo?  If in the course of events the PCs discovered that the Johnson knew and concealed that knowledge from the PCs, then sure, mid-run or end-run renegotiation can happen - but if you fulfill the contract and the Johnson demands more (see Pananagutan for an example) then based on your new knowledge, you are perfectly within your rights to demand more - especially if the Johnson wants you to go on a suicide run.