[jofer234]

Hi all!
First of all, i am sorry for my English. I am not a native speaker.
I will be GM on the upcoming weekends  . I am new to this system, and i have some misunderstands of matrix section.
Please help me. I searched the internet, corebooks, and this forum but i didnt find answers 
1) Can someone tell me what time pass in the meatworld while you are in the Matrix?In the SH Returns and DragonFall its 2 or 3 turns in Matrix and 1 turn in the Meatworld. But i cant find anything about it in corebook.
2) Okey. Its a suicide mission to attack corporate host because of large defence dicepooll.So decker must exploit Mater/Slave connection to enter the host. But...
Literally we have 50th floor building. How can we quess what EXACTLY device in this building connected to this system? It probably security terminal, yes,but it can be maglock on toilet door on 46th or 32th.
3) Okey. literally another 50th floor building. Runners must steal experimental weapon. Decker found slaved terminal and now walking in host. Decker on 46th floor, others on - 41th floor .In this situation.
a) Can he just exit the host,then join with his team,and enter the host without any problem again on -41th floor? If i understand this right,he lose all marks and disable current running agents and programs only if OS reach 40, Spiders find and erase his marks before that or he reboot his deck to prevent OS reach 40.
b) The team needs to open two doors. First one is slaved to host. So if Decker have direct connection to another slaved device he have direct connection to all slaved devices. Spoof command + Control device against maglock or door device raiting. But the second door is NOT slaved to host. Host is like minimatrix with his own grid. Can decker hack this door like usually non slaved device while he is in the host? Can he hack someone commlin in another building while he is the host?
4) Whats WAN system(s) looks like in the host? Can it be Electronic post like in SH Returns or DragonFall?
5) Can decker or tehnomancer see devices or personas through walls?Example. My decker found someone persona or device with Matrix perception.He switch to AR.Can he still see them?
Its important for me,because if decker can find any device or persona that not running silent on 100m radius...well,he can see all guards or security in through walls.
6) What about walkie-talkies? Most security organisations have private frequency yes,but can decker hack one of them and "join" conversation?
7) Team doesnt want to take publicity points. But they were caught on mission by few witnesses who probably will call the Police Forces. They stiil need to complete their job but arriving Knight Errant its not what their wanted. So,can decker use Matrix Perception or another skill to say which data strams from exactly devices (phone calls) going to police station to prevent this?(hack devices in some way or another.
Well.I guess its all for now. I really hope you will help me guys and i am sorry if all of it was somewhere earlier.

[Top Dog]

Answering part of them now...

1) In SR5, matrix uses the exact same initiative as meatspace. If your decker rolls 28 (VR) initiative, and your street sams roll 29 and 26, Sam 1 goes first (with one action pass), followed by the decker (with one action pass), followed by Sam 2 (again, with 1 action pass). And then the same order on the second action pass, and the third - and then all three get to roll again.

2) Not sure what you mean here. I guess it's legwork to find out which is connected to which? I don't think there's a standard answer to this one.

3a) He wouldn't need to exit the host - he can just switch to AR mode, walk down and join his team, and then (if needed) go back to VR. Switching modes doesn't log you in or out of hosts, that's a seperate thing. If you do exit/enter, I don't see why that would do anything to your marks.

4) Whatever the designer wants.

5) I'm pretty sure you only see the matrix icon; you can see that the icon is there (and within 100m), but not exactly "Oh that commlink is three floors up, 2 meters to the north". But I don't really get Matrix Perception so I may be wrong.

6) Well, sure.

7) You cán use Matrix Perception for stuff like that ("The last Matrix action an icon performed", but it'd get pretty hard to keep track of them all, and I don't think you can see exact destinations - or at least, I can't find any rules about that.

[Xenon]

1. Its the same as in meat world. If you hack from AR you even use your meat world initiative score (and can switch between mundane and matrix actions at will).


2. Not 100% what you ask, but you can use matrix perception on a device to find out it's firewall rating. If it is higher than 2 then it is probably slaved to a master device or host.... Not sure, but I think you can also use matrix perception and use one hit for asking "is the device slaved" and after that another matrix perception test for "i am trying to spot the master that this icon is slaved to".


3a. The decker can walk with his team while at the same time his augmented reality persona is in the host (or out on the grid). He keep all the marks and his overwatch score will increase every 15 minutes until GOD find him. If the decker reboot his deck then he no longer have any marks and he no longer have an overwatch score. You don't need to be in VR to enter a host, you can do it from AR just fine.


3b. The decker have a direct connection to all slaved devices if he is
1) in side the host that the slaved device is slaved to
2) have a physical wire between the device and his cyberdeck
Having a physical wire beteween a device and his cyberdeck does not mean he automatically have a direct connection to other slaved devices, but if he place a mark on a slaved device you also get a mark on the master (no matter if you used a direct connection or not). with a mark on a host you can enter it and from there have a direct connection to all slaved devices (ignoring host ratings when hacking them).

when inside a host you cannot hack devices out on the grid that is not slaved to the host.
you first need to exit the host.

When you are outside a host you can hack any device out on the grid, but devices slaved to a host will defend with host ratings.

a host can have devices from multiple buildings slaved to it.
just because you are in a different building does not mean there have to be another host.
it can be the same.

devices in the same building does not have to be slaved to the same host.
just because your are in the same building does not mean all devices are slaved to the same host.
it can be different hosts.

however,
a security rigger will only be directly connected to the devices slaved to the host.
if there are devices slaved to another host or not slaved to the host then he will not have a direct connection to them.
(and the security rigger might be miles away from the actual facility he is protecting...)


4. whatever GM decide.
It can look like a jungle.
It can look like an underwater reef.
It can look like an office building...


5. yes (and what Top Dog said).


6. most communication is done over the matrix. the decker need one mark on the device and then use the snoop action to view all communications from and to that device. the decker can use send message to retransmit the information to others in the team.


7. if you mark and snoop a commlink (or rather the persona formed on a commlink) and it make a call you can use matrix perception to find the destination icon of the call (Uses Of Snoop, red box on p. 242). But it is hard (and a bit dangerous to your overwatch score) to mark and snoop them all..............

depending on your reading you might also be allowed to place a mark direclty on the KE host and then snoop all incomming and outgoing phonecalls and video feeds etc. at once

[jofer234]

Whoa!
So much good info. Thanks a lot guys!!!
2)
Yeah, i meant methods except Legwork.

[Zweiblumen]

5) I'm pretty sure you only see the matrix icon; you can see that the icon is there (and within 100m), but not exactly "Oh that commlink is three floors up, 2 meters to the north". But I don't really get Matrix Perception so I may be wrong.

To elaborate, you can see the matrix icon and know that it is within 100m of you, to find the exact location of it you can Trace Icon.  You need to have 2 marks on the item to get the Trace, and then maintain it as long as you have at least 1 mark on the icon.

[jofer234]

Well...just as i thought i completely dont understand matrix runs :/
Guys, help me again please if you can.
1) PANs.
So...we all can create PANs to protect our devices.But what if team decker wants to protect some team devices?I think PAN means Personal Area Network, not Another Person Personal Area network. And i dont understand next moment- okay,he made the PAN with StreetSam devices. Now the StreetSam on the other side of town and under Matrix attack.Is it any noise raiting applicable?
2) How the corps can find runners except meatworld legworking?Example,.Decker entered the Host,did what he wanted,and vanished into the real live.Can corps spider find the deckers mark, and just use matrix perception to find his deck?
3) i created two or three maps for matrix run for my decker.I allow him to use standart movement like in meatworld.But everytime he just runned to the file/Wan and that is!.Host 4 raiting completed!
i didnt see any matrix rule for this.What am i doing wrong? My Ic and Spider even cant find him to attack.Yes,he is strong with his starting bioware and chrome augmentation i have no question here.But i just wanted to have enough time to find him.
4) Everyone can spot devices in 100m range if they are not running silent. That means, you actually know what it is (gun,commlimk,else) right?
i am really sorry for my english again and probably too simple matrix questions.I am not lazy,but i really dont understand the Matris 
I hope i will understand it more with your help.

[I_AM_ZHOUL!!!]

1. This is a bit of a convoluted point. So I'm going to break it down into simple sentences to make sure I say it right.

 All Devices have an Icon that's visible on the Matrix.

Only Devices can be in a Master-Slave set up.

Devices have a Firewall=Device Rating unless specifically stated otherwise.

Only Commlinks, Cyberdecks, & RCCS can have a Persona set up on them. (There is a special modification that you can do for other devices but we'll ignore that right now.)

You can not have set up a Master-Slave relationship between a Device & a  Persona. (This causes problems for Technomancers but they have a bunch of other problems also. You shouldn't let your players play one... it's confusing & weak even when you know the system.)

So with all those bit of information I'll try to explain what happens in your 1st question. So the Decker has a Deck, it has a Device Rating of 3. He can Slave (DR×3) 9 Devices to his Deck as the Master. Those 9 Devices can now be defended by whatever is the higher of the 2 options between Master & Slave. You can choose to use which ever option is the highest for both things. The Decker now boots his Persona on his Deck, his Decks Device Icon disappears & is replaced with the Avatar of his Persona Icon. Since the Deck no longer has a Device Icon all those Slaved Devices are now part of the Deckers PAN until he Reboots his Deck and it regains it's Device Icon on the Matrix again. There is no Noise Penalties for Defense Tests, Noise is only a factor when you are trying to manipulate the Matrix yourself. So the Street Sam is attacked by some punk kid who thinks he is the best ever to play a Prank on the Sam. So the kid seeing the Sams commlink since he is within 100m & the Sam is not Running Silent. He wants to reboot the Sams commlink so it'll play the most annoying song the kid had ever heard The Macarana on repeat. So he does a Hack on the Fly to get a Mark on the Commlink, The Commlink is a Sense FW 3 & the Sam has a Intuition of 5 & The Deck has a FW of 4 & Intuition of 3. So the Defense Test is with 9 dice (Sams Intuition of 5 & Decks FW of 4) against the punk kids Hacking & Logic die pool.

In a lot of cases, when you have a high level Commlink  (Avalon or Caliban) it's better to use it on your own PAN instead of the Decker, if you have a halfway decent Int & Wil since it has such a high Firewall itself to rely on.

[jofer234]

So...decker or anyone else can use this system only while he is in the VR Matrix, right?
I think i got it know.
Can you help me with other questions please?
2) I just read book again, and found they cant.But i guess corps spider at least can share this mark to his corp.Well,looks like there is only Legwork i guess. Except Trace icon, trace IC and etc.

[I_AM_ZHOUL!!!]

So...decker or anyone else can use this system only while he is in the VR Matrix, right?
I think i got it know.
Can you help me with other questions please?
2) I just read book again, and found they cant.But i guess corps spider at least can share this mark to his corp.Well,looks like there is only Legwork i guess. Except Trace icon, trace IC and etc.

No Deckers can hack any point in the world while in AR. A satellite uplink & a couple Datajack & Antennas and you could Hack someone or something in Australia as easily as the chummer sitting next to you drinking his morning cup of soycaf. You would need to know pretty much exactly what Icon you are looking for & it'll probably still take quite a while to sort through the Matrix Perception tests playing the 20 question game but it can be done. Once you located the Icon you are good to go. The 100' rule is just so you're brain is not overwhelmed by the sheer vastness of information available. It's a safety measure so people minds don't melt trying to process it all. But if you go looking the you can "see" it in the Matrix. Kinda scary when you really think about it, huh?

#2. Yeah... pretty much. They'll know your Mark but can't Trace where your body is without a Trace. Once GOD gets involved they hammer you & send people to pick you up. That 40 number is essentially them triangulation of the effect you are having on the Matrix around you. Data usage spike, Data anomalies, things like that.... and once they got you, they GET you!!! Kinda rude about it and all... all you're really doing is making people listen to the Macarana on repeat, right???

[PauloAM]

Damn, I was letting the table's Technomancer use the Matrix as a kind of "radar" for every device that was in 100m range...

So they just get like a list? Then would have to Trace every single one of them to know their exact locations in real time?

[I_AM_ZHOUL!!!]

Damn, I was letting the table's Technomancer use the Matrix as a kind of "radar" for every device that was in 100m range...

So they just get like a list? Then would have to Trace every single one of them to know their exact locations in real time?

Pretty much... it's a ridiculous amount of information to process that the 100' is just so you can interact with stuff around you for basic existence. But actually plotting all that information in real time while tour moving would burn your brain out. It wasn't designed to process that kind of sensory overload. We got our heads as big as we could possibly get them & still pass between a woman's hipbones. That's the hard limit that stopped us... we'd no longer be human if we could do what you're describing.

[Xenon]

I am not sure I agree with the whole "burn your brain out" argument tbh....

You automatically spot the icon of any device not running silent within 100 meters (or within the same host) and you only need one hit to spot the icon of a device not running silent (according to the normal perception table; device icons are about as easy to spot as the threshold to spot a neon sign or a gun fight) and no matter how far away it is located (you can spot a device icon even if it is physically located on the other side of the world). You only need one net hit to spot the icon of a silent running device (again no matter how far away it is located).

If you see another person down the street you automatically also see his PAN icon (and if you wish you also automatically also see all his wireless device icons and file icons - unless he is trying to hide them). If he step into a car and drive to the airport, entering a plane, fly to Europe and even initiated silent running you can continue to spot him (no test required). You may continue to spot him until he reboot (or bend the matrix with the Hide matrix action). You also automatically spot all devices you own or have placed your matrix mark on.

[Xenon]

But what if team decker wants to protect some team devices?

It take about one minute to make the decker the legal matrix owner of a device. He can then slave it to his master device in his PAN (normally a high firewall commlink but can also be a RCC or cyberdeck).

When the device is under attack the decker will defend it with his mental attributes and the firewall of the master device in his PAN.

Now the StreetSam on the other side of town and under Matrix attack.Is it any noise raiting applicable?

It doesn't matter if the device that the decker is the matrix owner of is located on the other side of town. The decker will still defend with his mental attributes plus firewall.

If the device is left unattended (like a maglock) then it will just defend with its device device rating and it's own firewall.

Noise never apply when defending.

Can corps spider find the deckers mark, and just use matrix perception to find his deck?

The host can spot the decker via Matrix Perception from its Patrol IC or if the decker failed a sleaze action, mark the decker twice with Probe IC and/or if the decker failed two sleaze actions and then trace the physical location of the decker using Trace IC.

If overwatch score of the decker reach 40 then GOD will converge. The host will get 3 marks and the physical location of the decker will be reported to the host and grid owner.

The host's security decker can spot, mark and trace the physical location to the cyberdeck where the decker formed his persona.

There is no way to track the decker via the matrix if the decker jack out before he is traced.

3) i created two or three maps for matrix run for my decker.

You don't really traverse different nodes anymore (unless you are doing a deep run into the foundation to reach an archived file). Once inside the host you can use Matrix Search with a base time of 20 combat turns to find the pay data you are looking for. The host's Patrol IC might get more than one attempt to spot the intruder before he manage to find the correct icon.

4) Everyone can spot devices in 100m range ..

Guess I answered this in my previous post.

[korusef]

But what if team decker wants to protect some team devices?

It take about one minute to make the decker the legal matrix owner of a device. He can then slave it to his master device in his PAN (normally a high firewall commlink but can also be a RCC or cyberdeck).

You don't have to be the legal matrix Owner of a device to have it in a PAN.

if you fail a Sleaze action against a slaved device, only the device’s owner gets the mark on you, not the master too.

That implies that the device owner and the master owner are different personas.

[Xenon]

Agree that the book isn't very clear on this. It has has been clarified that both the slave and the master in a Personal Area Network need to have the same owner.

If you slave your device to a host (being part of a WAN) only you (the owner of the device, not the host) get a mark on a hacker that fail a sleaze action against your device.