[Xenon]

Then again, unless you are a rigger you don't need wireless devices.....

[Hobbes]

I think abusing RFID tags is extremely against the spirit of the game.

As Xenon pointed out, you can cut through the RFID chaff by simply searching for specific icons rather than generating a list of all icons.   

It's more effort for a GM because he's got to play a smarter hacker if he's going to really mess with you.  But ultimately, if your team's hacker isn't doing his or her job and watching out for Matrix threats you're still going to get hacked to hell and gone. 

Matrix Perception "What is the Agent doing?"  and a continuous edit file action and the Hacker can go about his normal sabotage.

Not all NPCs are going to be able to employ this method.  Corporate gear is going to be tied to a WAN and the number of marks isn't going to be static.  Every time someone logs in or out, or accesses a piece of corporate gear the number of marks is going to change.  But, IMO, Corps should be using Agents for monitoring duty.  Any facility is likely to have Agents assigned to it.  If those agents aren't busy they should be tasked to security.  Heck, security should have some exclusive agents monitoring key vulnerabilities or assets, IMO. 

Smaller groups should be using Agents too, since they likely can't afford a high rating host and a full time team of security spiders. 

Agents!  For when you just can't afford the good stuff!

And, thank you.  My Samurai's like cybereyes.  And want to keep them.  And FWIW my own hackers use Heavy Pistols or SMGs to brick cybereyes.

I find it interesting that Samurais usually have more vulnerabilities than a decker and a fraction of the ability to defend themselves.  Its a nice challenge when the standard powergamer response of "throw more dice" isn't a viable option. 

[Hobbes]

Then again, unless you are a rigger you don't need wireless devices.....

Well, and usually Deckers, but yes.  That's why when the Agent or monitor ap passes along an alert, you spend a free action to shut off all wireless and carry on.

The couple of times I threw a hostile hacker at the group I run for, they just shut down wireless and ignored it once they spotted it (or sparks flew....). 

[susan_brindle]

Doesn't marking something count as a successful matrix perception against it anyway? So as soon as they hacked your first RFID they could learn it was an RFID.

[Whiskeyjack]

Doesn't marking something count as a successful matrix perception against it anyway? So as soon as they hacked your first RFID they could learn it was an RFID.

Sure, but who cares? The whole point is making them waste a ton of actions for no gain and resetting the system so they have to do it over and over and over before they ever find something actually worth spiking. And even then the agent will detect the mark and reset between their actions making it all for naught anyway.

[Hobbes]

Doesn't marking something count as a successful matrix perception against it anyway? So as soon as they hacked your first RFID they could learn it was an RFID.

Sure, but who cares? The whole point is making them waste a ton of actions for no gain and resetting the system so they have to do it over and over and over before they ever find something actually worth spiking. And even then the agent will detect the mark and reset between their actions making it all for naught anyway.

Yup.  Hammers on the worse part of combat hacking, action economy. 

"Roll a bunch of dice.  Okay now roll a bunch more dice.  Okay, now roll some dice to do something, not that it maters because the combat is practically over."

[Adamo1618]

Doesn't marking something count as a successful matrix perception against it anyway? So as soon as they hacked your first RFID they could learn it was an RFID.

Sure, but who cares? The whole point is making them waste a ton of actions for no gain and resetting the system so they have to do it over and over and over before they ever find something actually worth spiking. And even then the agent will detect the mark and reset between their actions making it all for naught anyway.

Yup.  Hammers on the worse part of combat hacking, action economy. 

"Roll a bunch of dice.  Okay now roll a bunch more dice.  Okay, now roll some dice to do something, not that it maters because the combat is practically over."

Agents are your friends here

[Whiskeyjack]

Doesn't marking something count as a successful matrix perception against it anyway? So as soon as they hacked your first RFID they could learn it was an RFID.

Sure, but who cares? The whole point is making them waste a ton of actions for no gain and resetting the system so they have to do it over and over and over before they ever find something actually worth spiking. And even then the agent will detect the mark and reset between their actions making it all for naught anyway.

Yup.  Hammers on the worse part of combat hacking, action economy. 

"Roll a bunch of dice.  Okay now roll a bunch more dice.  Okay, now roll some dice to do something, not that it maters because the combat is practically over."

Agents are your friends here

Hacking agent gets a mark. Defending agent notes and resets wireless.

Repeat ad infinitum.

None of this is an ideal game state nor do I think any of it is necessary, but the paranoia makes a degree of sense in setting and all the tools for this set up are there. I'll probably do it with my next Sam because why the hell not, it's a cheap insurance policy even if it's a fairly boring way to shut down the valid tactic of a hacker mucking with your gear.

[Bulshock]

Can't target something running silent until you actually spot it.  Also Data Trails mentions that it's possible to separate out RFID tags from the Matrix Perception for Silent Running Icons (they mention that Demi-GOD's can do it, and after a discussion on it in one of the other threads, this one specifically is where I remember it http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=21583.0 , most of us seemed to come to the conclusion that there is no good reason why a Decker couldn't do the same thing.)  Given that, I'm not sure how well using the Stealth Tags for PAN protection will work.

[Whiskeyjack]

And yet even if something relevant is hacked, your agent resets it, at no action detriment to you and complete action detriment to the hacker.

[Bulshock]

Yeah.  Wasn't saying that it made much difference, just means that things are more likely to get Data Spiked rather then someone trying to get marks.

[Adamo1618]

Doesn't marking something count as a successful matrix perception against it anyway? So as soon as they hacked your first RFID they could learn it was an RFID.

Sure, but who cares? The whole point is making them waste a ton of actions for no gain and resetting the system so they have to do it over and over and over before they ever find something actually worth spiking. And even then the agent will detect the mark and reset between their actions making it all for naught anyway.

Yup.  Hammers on the worse part of combat hacking, action economy. 

"Roll a bunch of dice.  Okay now roll a bunch more dice.  Okay, now roll some dice to do something, not that it maters because the combat is practically over."

Agents are your friends here

Hacking agent gets a mark. Defending agent notes and resets wireless.

Repeat ad infinitum.

None of this is an ideal game state nor do I think any of it is necessary, but the paranoia makes a degree of sense in setting and all the tools for this set up are there. I'll probably do it with my next Sam because why the hell not, it's a cheap insurance policy even if it's a fairly boring way to shut down the valid tactic of a hacker mucking with your gear.

Well, non-hackers don't usually have agents, so against most enemies an extra Complex action to spot them is useful in terms of action economy. And deckers probably don't want to reset their connection every turn, losing marks and spotted enemies.

[Whiskeyjack]

Doesn't marking something count as a successful matrix perception against it anyway? So as soon as they hacked your first RFID they could learn it was an RFID.

Sure, but who cares? The whole point is making them waste a ton of actions for no gain and resetting the system so they have to do it over and over and over before they ever find something actually worth spiking. And even then the agent will detect the mark and reset between their actions making it all for naught anyway.

Yup.  Hammers on the worse part of combat hacking, action economy. 

"Roll a bunch of dice.  Okay now roll a bunch more dice.  Okay, now roll some dice to do something, not that it maters because the combat is practically over."

Agents are your friends here

Hacking agent gets a mark. Defending agent notes and resets wireless.

Repeat ad infinitum.

None of this is an ideal game state nor do I think any of it is necessary, but the paranoia makes a degree of sense in setting and all the tools for this set up are there. I'll probably do it with my next Sam because why the hell not, it's a cheap insurance policy even if it's a fairly boring way to shut down the valid tactic of a hacker mucking with your gear.

Well, non-hackers don't usually have agents, so against most enemies an extra Complex action to spot them is useful in terms of action economy. And deckers probably don't want to reset their connection every turn, losing marks and spotted enemies.

Oh sure.

I think part of the point is that non-hackers should have agents programmed to run their Matrix security because these characters don't know how to do it for themselves. That's reasonable. And a decker is the character in best position to manage their own matrix security and have less need to toggle resets.

[Jack_Spade]

I have to say: The Nixdorf Secretary is an excellent tool to have either as primary or secondary commlink just as a MARK detecting machine. It's as if you have your own dedicated Patrol IC.

[Hobbes]

I have to say: The Nixdorf Secretary is an excellent tool to have either as primary or secondary commlink just as a MARK detecting machine. It's as if you have your own dedicated Patrol IC.

Very much like that, yes.