[Marcus]

I honestly cannot like this post enough to do it credit.
You win the internet for today , sir ZeldaBravo.
SR5 core is quite complex , about four tmes as much as d&d core 2nd edition, at least from what i have played of d&d2nd.
Creating a character is quite hard , especially if you want to do an effective one ,what with all them opposed dice tests ,
and to actually start with a non mechanically inspired idea and then create an effective char , i dont know how you guys keep doing it.

It helps out a lot to have loads of archetypes to choose from on these forums , however both threads ,
wakshaanis and All4BigGuns's have been going the way of the dodo, the latter more due to being replaced with the former,
the former more due to needing an updated first post , and both where hobbes and you have contributed  lot .

While I agree with you concerning ZB's great post. I don't agree with you at all on 2nd Ed. I have played 2nd Ed for a long time, speed factor, RoF, Thac0 Skills and Powers, and All the rest. Trust me, 5th is not that nearly that bad. Until you do fireball volume math in your head you really haven't considered all that can go wrong.

[revolverocelot420]

I have a question it might silly but has anyone made a face gunslinger that uses holdout pistols or light pistols?

[Kincaid]

I honestly cannot like this post enough to do it credit.
You win the internet for today , sir ZeldaBravo.
SR5 core is quite complex , about four tmes as much as d&d core 2nd edition, at least from what i have played of d&d2nd.
Creating a character is quite hard , especially if you want to do an effective one ,what with all them opposed dice tests ,
and to actually start with a non mechanically inspired idea and then create an effective char , i dont know how you guys keep doing it.

It helps out a lot to have loads of archetypes to choose from on these forums , however both threads ,
wakshaanis and All4BigGuns's have been going the way of the dodo, the latter more due to being replaced with the former,
the former more due to needing an updated first post , and both where hobbes and you have contributed  lot .

While I agree with you concerning ZB's great post. I don't agree with you at all on 2nd Ed. I have played 2nd Ed for a long time, speed factor, RoF, Thac0 Skills and Powers, and All the rest. Trust me, 5th is not that nearly that bad. Until you do fireball volume math in your head you really haven't considered all that can go wrong.

Indoor or outdoor fireballs?

[gradivus]

I have a question it might silly but has anyone made a face gunslinger that uses holdout pistols or light pistols?

FICHETTI EXECUTIVE ACTION
ACC 6 DV 7P AP—  MODE SA/BF RC—  AMMO 18(c) AVAIL 10R COST  300¥
Add internal smartlink or a laser sight,  gasvent 3, personalized grip.
You can aim and burst fire, multiattack  while burst firing or long burst at one target.
Stick-nShock if you want to be leagl, AP if you don't...and there's ammo rules in Hard Target.

Make a social Adept w/authoratative tone[3], improved ability{pistols)[3],Imp Reflexes[1], Combat Sense[1]. With Pistols|Semiautomatics 6|+2. You're looking at 11 dice before AGI and Smartlink/Lasersight. Yo could even give up 1 MR to do the cyberarm cheese. I wouldn't. Of course there's the ever popular transhuman and muscle toner[3].

An Elf unaugmented could have 7AGI, 7 CHA or 6AGI, 8CHA... that's 15 or 16 DP with the light pistol...5hits on average. Chances of getting the 9 hits that equals your limit, not likely... but 6-7 will happen often enough and hey maybe you're some special kind of lucky and roll 8 or 9.
 
example of Gunslinger/Secondary Face

== Info ==
Street Name: Rico Suave
Name: Unnamed Character
Movement: 14/28
Karma: 0
Street Cred: 0
Notoriety: 0
Public Awareness: 0
Human
Composure: 11
Judge Intentions: 11
Lift/Carry: 7 (60 kg/40 kg)
Memory: 7
Nuyen: 5590

== Priorities ==
Metatype: D - Human or Elf
Attributes: A - 24 Attributes
Special: B - Adept, Magician, or Technomancer
Skills: E - 18 Skills/0 Skill Groups
Resources: C - 140,000¥

== Attributes ==
BOD: 3
AGI: 5 (7)
REA: 2 (3)
STR: 4
CHA: 6
INT: 5
LOG: 2
WIL: 5
EDG: 5
MAG: 6

== Derived Attributes ==
Essence:                   6.0
Initiative:                7 ( + 2d6
Rigger Initiative:         8 + 2d6
Astral Initiative:         10 + 2d6
Matrix AR Initiative:      8 + 2d6
Matrix Cold Initiative:    5 + DP + 3d6
Matrix Hot Initiative:     5 + DP + 4d6
Physical Damage Track:     10
Stun Damage Track:         11

== Limits ==
Physical:                  5
Mental:                    5
Social:                    10
   Vashon Island: Sleeping Tiger [+1] (Must be visible)
Astral:                    10

== Active Skills ==
Animal Handling            : 0                      Pool: 5
Archery                    : 0                      Pool: 6
Armorer                    : 0                      Pool: 1
Automatics                 : 0                      Pool: 6
Blades                     : 0                      Pool: 6
Clubs                      : 0                      Pool: 6
Computer                   : 0                      Pool: 1
Con                        : 1                      Pool: 8
Cybercombat                : 0                      Pool: 1
Demolitions                : 0                      Pool: 1
Disguise                   : 0                      Pool: 4
Diving                     : 0                      Pool: 2
Escape Artist              : 0                      Pool: 6
Etiquette                  : 1                      Pool: 8
First Aid                  : 0                      Pool: 1
Forgery                    : 0                      Pool: 1
Free-Fall                  : 0                      Pool: 2
Gunnery                    : 0                      Pool: 6
Gymnastics                 : 1                      Pool: 8
Hacking                    : 0                      Pool: 1
Heavy Weapons              : 0                      Pool: 6
Impersonation              : 1                      Pool: 8
Instruction                : 0                      Pool: 6
Intimidation               : 1                      Pool: 8
Leadership                 : 1                      Pool: 8
Longarms                   : 0                      Pool: 6
Navigation                 : 0                      Pool: 4
Negotiation                : 1                      Pool: 8
Perception                 : 6                      Pool: 11
Performance                : 1                      Pool: 8
Pilot Ground Craft         : 0                      Pool: 2
Pilot Watercraft           : 0                      Pool: 2
Pistols                    : 6 [Semi-Automatics]    Pool: 16 (18)
Running                    : 1                      Pool: 5
Sneaking                   : 6 [Urban]              Pool: 13 (15)
Survival                   : 0                      Pool: 4
Swimming                   : 1                      Pool: 5
Throwing Weapons           : 1                      Pool: 8
Tracking                   : 0                      Pool: 4
Unarmed Combat             : 0                      Pool: 6

== Knowledge Skills ==
Area Knowledge: Seattle    : 3 [Downtown]           Pool: 8 (10)
English                    : N                      Pool: 0
Organized Crime            : 3 [mafia]              Pool: 8 (10)
Spanish                    : 6                      Pool: 11

== Qualities ==
Adept
Allergy (Common, Mild) (Soy)
Creature of Comfort (High)
In Debt III
Prototype Transhuman
SINner (National) (Alejandro Martin Paolo Montalbán y Merino)
Trust Fund III

== Powers ==
Authoritative Tone Rating: 3
Combat Sense Rating: 1
Cool Resolve Rating: 1
Improved Ability (skill) (Pistols) Rating: 3
Improved Reflexes 1

== Cyberware/Bioware ==
Bilateral Coordination Co-processor
Muscle Toner Rating 2
Tailored Pheromones Rating 2

== Armor ==
Vashon Island: Sleeping Tiger       13
   +Chemical Protection 2
   +Concealed Pocket
   +Custom Fit
   +Fire Resistance 2
   +Newest Model
   +Nonconductivity 5
   +Ruthenium Polymer Coating 3

== Weapons ==
Fichetti Executive Action
   +Chameleon Coating (Pistol)
   +Concealed Quick-Draw Holster
   +Gas-Vent 3 System
   +Personalized Grip
   +Smartgun System, Internal
   +Spare Clip
   +Spare Clip
   Pool: 16 (18)   Accuracy: 9   DV: 7P   AP: -   RC: 6
Fichetti Executive Action
   +Chameleon Coating (Pistol)
   +Concealed Quick-Draw Holster
   +Gas-Vent 3 System
   +Personalized Grip
   +Smartgun System, Internal
   +Spare Clip
   +Spare Clip
   Pool: 16 (18)   Accuracy: 9   DV: 7P   AP: -   RC: 6
Unarmed Attack
   Pool: 6   Accuracy: 5   DV: 4S   AP: -   RC: 3

== Commlink ==
MCT Blue Defender (ATT: 0, SLZ: 0, DP: 1, FWL: 5)

== Gear ==
Contacts Rating 3
   +Flare Compensation
   +Smartlink
   +Image Link
Earbuds Rating 3
   +Sound Link
   +Spatial Recognizer
Fake License (Adept License) Rating 4
Fake License (Restricted Bioware License) Rating 1
Fake License (Firearms License) Rating 1
Fake License (Concealed Carry Permit) Rating 1
Fake SIN (Rico Suave) Rating 4

[FST_Gemstar]

Gradivus: how is Edge so high?

[Marcus]

Indoor or outdoor fireballs?

Indoor, of course. Outdoor is easy, though there is always the catching the forest on fire issue.

[Marcus]

Gradivus: how is Edge so high?

D is Human (3) I think. So 2+3.

[FST_Gemstar]

Then Magic is too high at 6... just nitpicking... sorry!

[Marcus]

Then Magic is too high at 6... just nitpicking... sorry!

Magic B straight adept is magic 6, and the bioware is under P-transhuman, so it looks right to me, I haven't done the full math break down to be sure that the cost line up. But at first glance it checks out. Bilateral Coordination Co-processor is bioware, despite it's name, I had to look that up b/c I was sure it was cyber.

Nothing apologize for though, it's easy to make mistakes and it good to have folks double check. I know I make many errors during character creation, its why we have this forum.

[FST_Gemstar]

Whoops - Not thinking Adept! Thanks!