[Novocrane]

I've played more than a few characters that would find the idea of working with even the most genial ghoul uncomfortable, to say the least. Even some that "wouldn't risk it". None of them are me, though, and I wouldn't (metaphorically or literally) torch another player's sheet for their choice of character. I'd consider getting everyone happy with the game and team we're playing. I (usually) get that not every table is like that, but sometimes comments make me wonder if everyone sees the limits of their own table.

you save those you have a real investment in until they are hungry for another kill. Till they can not make it without the next job. Until I really need them. It is a nasty cycle… but that is the world we live in…

The quote is about a fixer's life, talking about runners. Murder might not be infectious, but the way it's dangled before runners? Doesn't exactly leave them whole worlds apart from the Infected.

[MijRai]

Well Reaver, I do understand the perspective you're coming from.  There's some quite valid points, it's well argued and it makes sense from that perspective.  It does seem we'll have to agree to disagree, though. 

As a tangent, that whole 'can't afford to take care of the SINless' thing is sort of crazy.  The reason governments and megacorporations don't take care of SINless is because they don't want to!  Why give rights to the expendable work-force and risk them crawling out of poverty?  The money is totally there, they just lack a motivation.  Plus, by not keeping track of the SINless population, they can easily say the numbers are low with some estimate and ignore the vast majority, misleading people into thinking the SINless are a smaller problem than they really are. 

P.S.  VITAS is totally the Bubonic Plague equivalent.  HMHVV is more along the lines of super-HIV from my mind's eye. 

[Reaver]

Well Reaver, I do understand the perspective you're coming from.  There's some quite valid points, it's well argued and it makes sense from that perspective.  It does seem we'll have to agree to disagree, though. 

As a tangent, that whole 'can't afford to take care of the SINless' thing is sort of crazy.  The reason governments and megacorporations don't take care of SINless is because they don't want to!  Why give rights to the expendable work-force and risk them crawling out of poverty?  The money is totally there, they just lack a motivation.  Plus, by not keeping track of the SINless population, they can easily say the numbers are low with some estimate and ignore the vast majority, misleading people into thinking the SINless are a smaller problem than they really are. 

P.S.  VITAS is totally the Bubonic Plague equivalent.  HMHVV is more along the lines of super-HIV from my mind's eye.

Oh, I am not expecting you to agree, or to even change your mind. (Or the minds of anyone else). We are individuals who come from different walks of life and countries (I suspect) its only natural we won't see eye to eye on this, or even a lot of other topics And that's great! If everyone held the same opinion on everything, it would be a boring place!

As for the economies of countries, lets not drag that into this thread.... (my fault from bringing it up). There are several threads here on this subject already about that.

Yea.... VITAS is probably a better fit to the black plague now that I think about it.

[MijRai]

I'm still waiting for VITAS IV.  Bring on the super-plagues!

I generally tend towards the option that provides the most utility in a game (provided the game doesn't explicitly spell out how it works, like with shedim); having the Infected be both monsters and men has so much more flavor and directions to go as compared to 'Oh, they're all bad and should feel bad.'  Allowing the game setting to leave them some wiggle room and gray areas helps with that.  The ambiguity written with the Infected lets us try to find a line, maybe we'll succeed, maybe we won't.  It'll be a fun trip either way. 

[cantrip]

I'm still waiting for VITAS IV.  Bring on the super-plagues!

I'm wondering if they might not tie in a new plague to the CFD story line -- could be purposeful or unintentional. I actually think unintentional would be more scary; no, I take that back -- having a virus spread with an intelligence would definitely be more of an issue.
Unable to overwrite someone? Infect them with the plague of your choice. Could have it built in as a self-destruct when trying to remove the 'infection'.

[JanessaVR]

I'm wondering if they might not tie in a new plague to the CFD story line -- could be purposeful or unintentional. I actually think unintentional would be more scary; no, I take that back -- having a virus spread with an intelligence would definitely be more of an issue.
Unable to overwrite someone? Infect them with the plague of your choice. Could have it built in as a self-destruct when trying to remove the 'infection'.

I'm one of the people who consider CFD an unworkable addition to the game.  It makes older edition ghoul infection rates look fun by comparison.  If CFD exists as written in the Sixth World, there's no way it didn't infect everyone on the planet in less than a month.

Please correct me if I'm wrong (I'm really still using SR4 for the most part, even if I own many of the SR5 books to mine for ideas and I'm still reading through them a bit at a time), but CFD is spread by simple touch, right?  That kind of infection speed would engulf a major city in just one day.

[MijRai]

Nope.  Takes the transfer of an appreciable amount of nanites to pull it off; so bodily fluids can do it.  Or if you aerosolize the nanites and people breathe enough in. 

[Reaver]

Yea CFD is basically kinda like a technological STD...

Common contact is not an issue. Engaging in an exchange of body fluids however is a really bad idea! (Blood, saliva, semen, and other body fluids all contain the nanites.

From there, the rate of set in can take some time. Took FJ almost 3 years for it to overwrite him to the point he had to step away... others have been overwritten in weeks...

While I don't hate the CFD plotline, I think it could use a little more coherant write ups...

[Marcus]

I like all this a lot. Right on. We don't need to be touchy feelie with the zombie apocalypse.
Very nicely put together, and well said. Essence feeding monster are essence feeding monster and they should be solved accordingly.

[cantrip]

All the craziness of CFD aside (and that's a whole lot of crazy). Having nanites programmed to spread any type of biological virus or infection would be catastrophic. Granted HMHVV has a magical component, so much less likely to spread via tech - but anything else could be fair game.

This is where I think the various factions of the CFD plotline would battle it out behind the scenes. If a faction had majority control and was bent on destroying <fill in the blank target >, I'm not sure the 6th world could stop them...not without a ton of collateral damage. It's bad for business if you let your customer base be wiped out by the black plague! Heck just putting nanite trackers in people would be bad enough. 

[MijRai]

I like all this a lot. Right on. We don't need to be touchy feelie with the zombie apocalypse.
Very nicely put together, and well said. Essence feeding monster are essence feeding monster and they should be solved accordingly.

You mean Essence feeding monster is diseased metahuman who sort of needs it to survive.  And only about 10% of them feed on Essence.  The rest only need blood or flesh or bone (which doesn't actually take killing to provide). 

[falar]

Honestly, I'm more okay with straight-up killing Vampires than Ghouls. Vampires have to feed upon the living. Ghouls have an unfortunate diet condition and odor.

[Moonshine Fox]

Honestly, I'm more okay with straight-up killing Vampires than Ghouls. Vampires have to feed upon the living. Ghouls have an unfortunate diet condition and odor.

Kinda the same here. Vamps are essence suckers who have to suck the living soul out, while ghouls just need to eat carrion flesh from a metahuman. Any willing donation or corpse will do and isn't addictive like essence drain is. Still want to try my hand at playing a vamp though.

[Sendaz]

Still want to try my hand at playing a vamp though.

Just so long as you leave the glitter at home.

Otherwise it's KOS.

[Moonshine Fox]

Still want to try my hand at playing a vamp though.

Just so long as you leave the glitter at home.

Otherwise it's KOS.

The only Glitter Boys that should exist are the battle suits from Rifts. I'd be 0 Twilight and all Forever Knight!