[Black Bart]

I figured that out after messing with options.
In your op, is karma a dead system i should try a different build?

[falar]

In your op, is karma a dead system i should try a different build?

Troll is a tough meta to build and even tougher in Karma. I'd recommend Sum-to-Ten or Priority. As a ganger, high Meta, high Attributes, middling-to-low cash, no special, middling-to-low skills.

[Marcus]

I agree with and recommend following Falar and Whiskey's advice. This is nice but it needs some expansion and focus.
As is, it's reads as fairly dated.

[Whiskeyjack]

everybody keeps saying autos. I know there are penalties for shotguns but does that outweigh the imagination?

Shotguns are decent. Especially the Mossberg as it is full auto. But you'll also want a long rifle because of range penalties though, and Longarms covers both. That's why Automatics is often recommended because ARs, SMGs, and even MPs are great with more ranges. But a shotgun on full auto firing wide burst will shred the lightly armored.

[Glyph]

I figured that out after messing with options.
In your op, is karma a dead system i should try a different build?

Point build is supposed to be 800 Karma, so you are shorting yourself by 50 Karma.  Sum to ten is better for troll builds that take full advantage of a troll's bonuses to Body and Strength.  On the other hand, a troll face build that I did with sum to ten actually came out ahead when I converted it to point build.  If you see this guy as weak for a troll, but smarter, faster, and more agile than usual, then point build won't disadvantage you too much.

I think the bigger problem is that, frankly, it looks like a previous edition build, from when a lot of those skill groups were individual skills, and when attributes were far less important.  Skills have been devalued - some have been broken down into components (firearms became pistols, long arms, and automatics), some used to be tests you didn't need a skill for (assensing, perception, using gymnastics to dodge), and lots of new, fiddly little skills have been added.  So being "good" at having skills takes more game resources, which comes at the expense of things like attributes (the other component of dice pools) and augmentations (which can give bonuses to dice pools or give you more-than-metahuman ability).

A skill guy is still viable, and the bounty hunter archetype is a decent example of what a skill-focused troll looks like, but I am not sure whether you were aware that you were making a skills guy.  It does come at the expense of having less than the usual troll badassery.


The problem with replacing day job with made man is that the former is a negative quality, while the latter is a positive quality.


Automatics may be versatile, but the pistols and longarms skills are both fine.  For longarms, you can have a sawed-off shotgun for concealability, shotguns or battle rifles for short to mid range, and sniper rifles for long distance.

[Novocrane]

The problem with replacing day job with made man is that the former is a negative quality, while the latter is a positive quality.

That's more of an excuse than a problem. After aggressively ditching unnecessary skill groups, the karma will be there.

[Bushw4cker]

For a Troll Ganger, here is what I would do, and why:

Sum to 10: Attributes(4), Metatype(4), Skills(2), Resources(0), Magic(0)

Attributes
Body 9
Agility 4
Reaction 4
Strength 8
Willpower 5
Intuition 4
Logic 2
Charisma 4
Edge 6

This Attribute selection gives you high Composure and Judge Intentions Dice Pools. Also gives Higher than normal Stun and Physical Damage Tracks

Qualities
Guts
First Impression
School of Hard Knocks
Creature of Comfort(10pt)
Did You Just Call Me Dumb?
In Debt (2pt, 10K Nuyen)
SINner (Criminal) or some combination of Poor Self Control, Addiction, Prejudice



Skills
Blades or Clubs (Your Favorite Type +2) 1
Pistols (Your Favorite Type Here +2) 3
Unarmed Combat 6
Perception (Visual +2) 2
Intimidation (Physical +2) 6
Etiquette (Street +2) 1
Leadership (Rally +2) 3
Athletics Skill Group 2
 with Karma (2pt each skill at Rating 1) I would also get:
Negotiation 1 (Raise it later with Karma if you want, use Edge if you Really must get the Sale price)
Throwing Weapons 1 (For Grenades, Dwarves, ect..)
Palming 1 (Hiding that gun you have when Knight Errant pulls you over for driving while Troll)
Animal Handling 1 (Nice Hellhound...)
Pilot Ground Craft 1 (If you have ride... or if you plan to "Borrow" one..)

Use some Karma for Resources.

I think this the best way to start out a character, and I think it fits the character concept.  Your a Ganger, you don't have much money, or if you do, it's only very recently.. Having Edge 6, helps tremendously, more than any single piece of Cyberware/Bioware you can get.. 6 dice and Rule of 6, 6 times a session (give or take, depending on GM/Qualities/ect)

[Black Bart]

Sorry for the inactivity the past couple days. Two newborns and a full time job are a handful. I think I have a character pretty well fleshed out but I have a couple of questions.

1. I don't see my Ini roll going above 8+1d6 any idea?  I'm using the chummer5 build.
2. I played with a gm that allowed a Lined coat to hide weapons, and was wondering if that could apply here?
3. What is the limit panel? I've been trying to mess with it but don't really understand the concept.
4. If I chose the Sinner quality what would I use as the value?

Again I'm sorry about not keeping up with this but I am almost done unveiling this new runner

[Hobbes]

Sorry for the inactivity the past couple days. Two newborns and a full time job are a handful. I think I have a character pretty well fleshed out but I have a couple of questions.

1. I don't see my Ini roll going above 8+1d6 any idea?  I'm using the chummer5 build.
2. I played with a gm that allowed a Lined coat to hide weapons, and was wondering if that could apply here?
3. What is the limit panel? I've been trying to mess with it but don't really understand the concept.
4. If I chose the Sinner quality what would I use as the value?

Again I'm sorry about not keeping up with this but I am almost done unveiling this new runner

1.  Cram and Psyche, or more 'ware.
2.  Lined Coats give a bonus to concealment, several other armors from Run and Gun do as well if you have that book.
3.  Limits are part of the core dice rolling mechanic in 5th edition.  See p. 46, but essentially your Limit is the max number of hits you can have regardless of your dice pool and what you roll.
4.  Sinner comes in a four grades.  Criminal, National, Corp limited, and Corp.  Each has a different value and some slightly different limitations.  For a Ganger Criminal makes the most sense, but your background story could dictate otherwise.

[falar]

1. I don't see my Ini roll going above 8+1d6 any idea?  I'm using the chummer5 build.

Drugs, man, drugs. Get you some Jazz and Psyche and it'll all be good.

[Black Bart]

I'm sure those would be great help for that.

[Black Bart]

So here goes nothing. I used the Sum to ten build with an A, A, E, C, E build. Man... I really like the Karma system.

Street Name: Black Bart

Bod 9
Agi 4           Rea 5
Str 8            Cha 2(3) Added 1 point+15 Karma
Int 5             Log 4
Wil 3           Edge 6

Phys Cond 13      Stun Cond 10     
Initiative 10+1d
Armor 15               Ess 5.62
Nuyen Remaining 1,181           Composure 6
Judge 8                 Lift 17
Memory 7             Movement 8/16

Qualities

Positive
City Slicker
Home ground (Puyallup)
Jack of all trades
Thermo Vision (Natural)

Negative
In Debt II
Predjudiced (Common, Outspoken) (Humans)
SINner (Criminal) (Charles Earl Bowles)
Slow Healer

Contacts
Marjorie Gang Leader Puyallup (2/2)
Caleb  Beat Cop Seattle (2/3)
Sarge Fixer Penumbra (3/1)


Skills (I tried to take advice of everybody and stayed away from over indulging skill points, and I'm not entirely sure how to write it here.

Athletics 2               Ettiquette 5(7) (street)
Intimidation 8         Longarms 10
Negotiation 4         Palming 5
Perception 7(9) (Visual)      Pilot Ground Craft 6
Pistols 5(7) (Semi-Autos)         Unarmed 10

Knowledge Skills
Street Drugs 10         Gangs 9
Area Knowledge Seattle (Puyallup) 9(11)                Ettiquette (Police) 8

Cyberware
Spurs (Used)

Lifestyle Squatter
Troll Club House 1 month 350
Cramped -10% Dangerous Area -20% Metatype +100%

Gear/Armor/Weapons

Armor
Lined Coat (11)                                                Forearm Guards (3)
Attachable Gear Access                                 Gel Packs
Gel Packs                                                           

Good pants (synth leather)                           Good shoes
Cheap socks                                                   Cheap undergarments
Cheap shirt                                                      Cheap gloves
Weapons

Ares Viper Slivergun                                                                       Defiance T-250, Short Barrel
(Sound Suppressor part of base weapon)                                Hip Pad Bracing System
Hidden Gun Arm Slide
Smartgun Sys (Internal)

Gear

Goggles (Rating 3)                                                     Earbuds (Rating 3)
Flare Comp                                                                  Audio Enhancement (Rating 2)
Low LIght                                                                      Spatial Recognizer
Vision Enhancement (Rating 3)
Smartlink

Backpack (Cheap)
Can of spray paint (Dark Blue)                       Can of spray paint (Black)
Lighter                                                                 10 packs of Ultra-Lux brand cigarettes
Liter Canteen

4 hits Asia       3 hits Jazz
4 hits Red Mescal     5 hits cram
5 hits Hurlg     4 hits Push
4 hits Novacoke    2 hits Betameth
2 Dreamchips     1 Moodchip
1 Personaflix   2 Tripchips
Pocket Notebook (Keeps separate track of deals and money owed)

Metalink Commlink
Browse

40 Flechette Rounds (Heavy Pistols)
30 Shells Regular Ammo (Shotgun)

Certified Credstick (Standard) $1000

Vehicle
Harley Scorpion

Being born and not being wanted has it's downfalls. Especially when you're in the blight in one of the worst cities in the world. Tacoma was a great place, if you were normal. Puyallup was not. It was home of rats, disease, starvation and anyone who couldn't make it in Seattle. Black Bart was born here, his parents ditched him as soon as he could walk. Life for a troll isn't glamorous. Especially with a policlub branding you the devil, or the son of said deity. He was beaten to the edge of death, but a fresh young badge named Caleb Gafferty came to his aide. Caleb broke protocol and brought young Black Bart to his home in suburban Seattle. It cost Caleb his friends, his wife and almost his job bring the "Trog" home. Caleb showed Black Bart how to shoot a gun, how to make an honest living. But that didn't suit Black. He would never be better than a "Trog" to anyone. So he broke into a liquor store and drank himself to sleep in it. LoneStar showed up and roughed him up exclaiming "He was so drunk we almost died in there." Black spent 3 years in a cell, brandished with the name Charles Bowles.
The day he got out he went back to Puyallup, and inquired into joining with the Troll gang "Forever Tacoma" He got in after getting his ass beat a few times. He rose in rank not soon after, becoming second Lieutenant to Marjorie. For a Troll she didn't look half bad, if horns, and muscles as big as a breeders head is your thing. But he wanted out of the normal gang life. So he became a freelance and connected with a fixer, Sarge. "I'll get you anything you could dream of, but just remember. I don't know you from Adam, if the wrong person comes looking for you."
Two months have passed and now I'm in deep with some heavy hands.
"Fuck I've gotta make more then what I am selling this shit."
I oughta call Sarge and see if he knows where I can get some work.

[Strange]

I think you did you contact wrong. Looks like you have a group contact.  Does your shadowrunning team share this? That's what the group is supposed to represent.  Usually you earn group contacts after character generation, unless the GM has something in mind.

Confused about your note under charisma.  It costs 15 karma OR 1 build point to raise an attribute from 2 to 3.  Looks like you might have been confused there.  If you can't afford the point, having a charisma of 2 only lowers one applicable skill down one point, not really a loss.

I like this character a lot.  Makes sense, pretty powerful, and looks like fun to play.

[Black Bart]

Gc is Tacoma Forever gang with Marj as main Contact.
On chummer I put one karma point and off to the side it put a big 15 so I'm gonna guess 15 BP

[Glyph]

It costs 15 karma to raise an attribute from 2 to 3.  There aren't really any all-purpose build points in Priority - just separate points to assign to skills, attributes, special attributes, etc.