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So about the Pueblo Corporate Council...

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Monkoflords

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« on: <02-26-16/2353:05> »
So, in a month or two, I'm planning on offering to run Shadowrun for my local group when our current game finishes up. I was either planning on running it in Seattle, because of the material out for it, or bring it closer to home to Phoenix (and surrounding areas).

I have the Almanac, so I have the information in there, but that's about it. Is there any place I can read more?

Also, I'm looking to brainstorm ideas for Phoenix itself. Given it appears to be right on the border with Atzlan, I'm sure there's got to be something going on there.

Pap Renvela

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« Reply #1 on: <02-27-16/0041:11> »
Native American Nation Vol 1   3rdESR

Has some background info that's still relevant.

Crimsondude

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« Reply #2 on: <02-27-16/0251:50> »
Shadows of North America has about a paragraph on Phoenix. It's rather vague. Phoenix was the largest PCC city until it took over Los Angeles. It's the largest manufacturing center in the country, which is to say that it has a lot of Matrix hardware fabrication facilities and the like.

Oh, it's also the headquarters of Phoenix Biotechnologies. PBT is a AA-rated megacorporation and was for a long time PCC's largest non-Matrix corporation. It took some serious blows in recent years, in large part because Hestaby was a major shareholder—probably the largest shareholder after the PCC itself—and it became fair game. It's unclear what happened to her shares, but the damage seems to be done and the PCC doesn't seem inclined to bail PBT out. Spinrad Industries is a possible white knight that may possibly acquire PBT.
« Last Edit: <02-27-16/0312:27> by Crimsondude »

Sendaz

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« Reply #3 on: <02-27-16/0458:55> »
The PCC should be ripe with options.

Besides absorbing the Ute Nation, remember also they were ceded pretty much all of Aztlan's lands inside what was once Texas, effectively creating a buffer between the CAS and Aztlan.(See Storm Front for this).

The latter of which might become something the CAS would like taking back sometime, whether diplomatically or otherwise.

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adzling

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« Reply #4 on: <02-27-16/1107:11> »
Ghost Cartels has a section on the PCC and Los Angeles as does Corporate Enclaves.

Nath

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« Reply #5 on: <02-28-16/1131:10> »
Besides absorbing the Ute Nation, remember also they were ceded pretty much all of Aztlan's lands inside what was once Texas, effectively creating a buffer between the CAS and Aztlan.(See Storm Front for this).

The latter of which might become something the CAS would like taking back sometime, whether diplomatically or otherwise.
And do only see Storm Front for this version. If you go back to Dirty Tricks in which the plot was originally introduced, it was nowhere near "pretty much all of Aztlan's lands inside what was once Texas".

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Storm Front, pages 18-19
While the PCC was willing to cut Aztlan some slack and didn’t hold them completely accountable for Sirrurg’s attacks, the CAS wasn’t nearly so forgiving. They placed responsibility for the attacks directly on Aztlan’s shoulders, though most suspected it was merely a ploy to send troops in and reclaim parts of Texas. In an utterly surprising move, Aztlan then sold large portions of Texas to the PCC.

> I would’ve laid good cred that Silva would have been the morning’s next sacrifice after he sold Texas off. Apparently, he didn’t bother to consult his partners on the Aztechnology board. But dammit, he lived! AND was still president! I guess there still are surprises left in this world.
> Sunshine

In a strategic sense, it was a bold move. By giving away parts of Texas, Aztlan managed to accomplish several objectives in one swoop. First, they avoided expanding the war and also created a buffer between them and a hostile foreign nation. [...]
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Dirty Tricks, page 87
The Rio Gambit
On August 7th, Aztlan president Enrico Silva sold a chunk of Aztlan territory that was once a part of New Mexico and Texas to the Pueblo Corporate Council (or, more specifically, to a consortium of Ute investors). It runs from the PCC down to El Paso, follows the Rio Grande, then heads straight north as it gobbles up Kermit. Aztlan keeps Odessa, but giving up Roswell is interesting due to Sirrurg. As everyone knows, President McMulkin had pushed getting Texas back as a huge part of his campaign and had been in negotiations with Aztlan President Silva about the issue for over a year. The Treaty of Denver talks threw things into a pot, of course, but something about Ghostwalker and Perianwyr going eye to eye must have spooked him into action, and I don’t think that he cleared everything with Aztechnology. He got called up for an emergency meeting with the powers that be, but whatever he said, it must have worked, as he’s still breathing. Texas politicians were thrilled at first, since they assumed that the PCC would sell the land to them, but when that didn’t happen, it got ugly. All of a sudden, “Puebs” has become a filthy word for dishonorable actions and betrayal, and the Texans have been howling for blood and war. Thus far, cooler heads have prevailed, but I don’t know for how long. [...]

> As for why the PCC won’t sell, it has to be voted on by the nation, most likely added to the Vote of No Confidence in October. In addition, the owners are former Ute nationals who are blocking moves to sell it unless Aztechnology is allowed back into the nation. Both sides are locked in negotiations, but are also hiring deniable assets to get information. Chief on everyone’s mind is how this group got the money to make the purchase when the Ute were some of the poorest people in North America.
> Dr Spin

> I have it on good authority that they purchased it for one nuyen. Turning the CAS and the PCC against one another secures their northern border while they push against Amazonia in the South, which is worth more than the land the Azzies sold.
> Plan 9
So the Pueblo were supposed to take over only the part of Texas that is directly south of  New Mexico. That is, about one quarter of Texas lands occupied by Aztlan: El Paso and 400 kilometers of desert around former Interstate 10.

The deal also includes Roswell and the surrounding area, which never belonged to Texas. As far as previous sourcebooks went, south of New Mexico and Arizona, around Roswell and Tucson, went to Aztlan with the Treaty of Denver (possibly a decision from southern Apache tribes to join Aztlan instead of the Pueblo council, but the topic has never been addressed). Since Dirty Tricks mentions Roswell but focus on Texas holdings, I guess only the easternmost part of New Mexico may have changed hands as a "corridor" to connect Pueblo territory to El Paso area.

It does shorten the frontline by some 140 kilometers, west of Lubbok and Midland, which would have actually been the only internationally recognized border between Aztlan and Texas. That's far from establishing a significant buffer zone. Everything else, from Odessa/Midland to Corpus Christi, is still on a frontline, with Corpus Christi, Austin South, San Antonio and the Spurs home arena occupied by Aztlan.

As a side note, Dirty Tricks makes it a point that "Ute investors" bought the land and refuse to sell it was if it was supposed to matter. In real life, private property is mostly irrelevant as to whether the Aztlan, Pueblo or Texas states recognize it as a territorial holding. Aztlan can sell lands it own to some Pueblo citizens and removes its troops and administration from the area, the Pueblo government has to accept control, and could also give it back to Texas on a whim. Not to mention the fact that buying all of El Paso 660km² estate for one nuyen ought to throw them among the richest individuals on Earth.

Crimsondude

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« Reply #6 on: <02-28-16/1659:44> »
The Apache ended up in the Sioux Nation. Their opinion on the matters of PCC are almost certainly irrelevant as far as anyone with power in the PCC and Sioux are concerned.

Nath

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« Reply #7 on: <02-28-16/1722:35> »
There are apache in the Sioux according to NAN SB volume I and SiF: Sioux Nation. But none of them state all apache ended up in the Sioux (actually, none of them even remotely touch the issue beside name dropping). There are no apache presence listed for any of the other NAN, but such information is lacking, one way or another, for Aztlan, besides the fact Aztlan got all the southern portion of their lands.

So, major tribes partly or fully resettle one thousand kilometers north from where their territories were prior to the war and those territories happens to be the only part of US territory that gets annexed into a neighboring country instead of one of the new Native American Nations? That sure hints at serious effort to be sure their opinion would be irrelevant in the Pueblo. Whether it was the Hopi and Zuni tribe who didn't want the Apache inside their nation borders, or the Apache themselves who didn't want to be inside those borders.

Wakshaani

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« Reply #8 on: <02-28-16/2032:14> »
Note that the "Sold for one Nuyen" allegation is just a rumor, not a proven fact. There's a lot of murk in that. INtentionally. :)

Have I uploaded the map that shows the territory? I don't know if it's ever been shown off. Hrm.

PiXeL01

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« Reply #9 on: <02-28-16/2045:32> »
Then drop it here. I for one would like to see it as I'm not a US native.
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Wakshaani

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« Reply #10 on: <02-28-16/2243:08> »
Man, I forget sometimes how bad Photobucket's gotten. Teh ads... my system's old and crotchety (kinda like me) ... it can't handle it. Still, one upload later, and Rio Gambit is Go!



The darker red lines show the old border between the PCC and Aztlan and teh PCC and CAS. The outlined area is the land from teh Gambit. As you can see, Aztlan and the CAS still verymuch share a border; the Gambit drove a wedge into the PCC-CAS alliance, however, when the PCC didn't give it back when asked. Teh CAS, or more accurately Texas, sees the area as righfully theirs. The PCC disagreed. Tempers ... got hot.


PiXeL01

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« Reply #11 on: <02-28-16/2258:18> »
Thank you kindly
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Wakshaani

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« Reply #12 on: <02-28-16/2304:55> »
My pleasure! As you can see, it's an area about as large as the state of Lousiana, so it's a LOT of land, and when compared to the overall size of teh PCC, it's not Lousiana Purchase big, but pretty dang big.

The reborn Rio Grande being in that chunk, and with it a lot of fresh water, is a *big* *deal* for teh Pueblo.

Crimsondude

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« Reply #13 on: <02-28-16/2316:44> »
Whether it was the Hopi and Zuni tribe who didn't want the Apache inside their nation borders, or the Apache themselves who didn't want to be inside those borders.

Depends on how powerful old grudges are. It clearly influenced the formation of some states (i.e., how the Utes screwed over the Navajo Nation).

Then again, the first GGD strike blew the top off a very sacred Pueblo mountain when the Pueblo were integral to the movement. It's as weird as we need it to be.
« Last Edit: <02-28-16/2318:56> by Crimsondude »

Monkoflords

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« Reply #14 on: <02-28-16/2338:28> »
Thanks for the replies all!

This is all very interesting. It looks like a nation that grew suddenly and violently, and may be feeling the aftershocks of that. A lot of competing voices that were not there before.