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Help with an adept character for a new player

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ShadeRaven

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« on: <03-29-16/1553:22> »
Hello there. I am brand new to the Shadowrun and I am about to enter my first game this Friday. My problem is twofold.
First, to me it seems that the character creation phase of the game requires a considerable deal of system mastery similar to the one I am used to in the Exalted rpg by having different costs at character creation and for karma purchases.
Second, our GM has put a restriction for making our characters with the core rules only and the options for other supplements becoming available during play, so I don't want to close my door towards taking one of these options in future by making a wrong choice at character creation. The other characters are more experienced in the system that me, but unfortunately I can't really use their help, because the game will have a competitive element in it (while we are working together, each character alsoha has a goal of his own that might intersect with the goal of another character) so we are advised to keep our builds hidden from the rest.

Anyway. With that out of the way, I would appreciate if you can tell me if the character that I have in mind is achievable by the Shadowrun 5e mechanics and what would be some of the recommended options to make it. If anyone can point be to a ready build that I can use as a reference it would be greatly appreciated.

I want my main focus to be on infiltration (high Stealth and Perception, some Gymnastics and Impersonation) and social skills (high Con and Negotiation, some Etiquette). I also want a viable way to silently disable key targets.
What would be the best weapon skill, adept powers and qualities to achieve my goal? I don't mind if I don't have all of this with a starting character, but I want to get it with the minimum possible karma investment after the start of the game. I would prefer if it can be done with an elf or human character. Should I focus on blades, unarmed or pistols/smgs?

Also, while it seems a bit counterintuitive for an adept, I would really like to have a piece of bioware that my character is planning to purchase in the future (for story reasons). Would that gimp me too much or there are some items where the benefit outweighs the essence cost?

Hobbes

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« Reply #1 on: <03-29-16/1623:54> »
For new players I highly recommend the Archetype challenge thread linked in my signature.  Scroll on down and check out the "Gunslinger" and "Brawling Adept" links.

For your concept the "Gunslinger" builds are going to be a good mechanical starting point.  A little less combat and a little more social perhaps, but certainly a good starting point.  An Elf Adept with a good Agility and Charisma can do most of the things you're looking at out of the gate.  Probably not all though as you've listed off about 10 skills you want to be "Good" at.  If your definition of "good" is 12+ dice you're probably going to have to scale back a bit.

"Bioware for Story Reasons" is perfectly doable for an Adept.  Any Bioware or did you have something specific in mind?

Whiskeyjack

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« Reply #2 on: <03-29-16/1801:14> »
Also, while it seems a bit counterintuitive for an adept, I would really like to have a piece of bioware that my character is planning to purchase in the future (for story reasons). Would that gimp me too much or there are some items where the benefit outweighs the essence cost?
There are many pieces of ware that are great for adepts and outstrip equivalent effects they can obtain with magic. Particularly if you have access to the Chrome Flesh book and the Prototype Transhuman quality therein.
Playability > verisimilitude.

Blue Rose

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« Reply #3 on: <03-30-16/0124:28> »
Prototype Transhuman seems like it can't be an option for this character, as it's a birth status thing, and supplements won't be available until after play.

If you want a weapon for silent take downs, my recommendation is a double-edged sword.  The dart pistol.  Narcoject can often take a target out in one quick, easy shot.  However, it's an exotic weapon proficiency, and somewhat limited in application.  Turns out, stick n shock works on drones and sometimes even spirits, but narcoject?  Not so much.

Melee combat, though, is hard to do as damage values tend to be keyed off of strength, and are rather low unless you have a strength score of 'yes' or a dice pool of 'all of them.'  For that, I would generally recommend things with fixed damage unless you can get at least six strength.  Shock gloves, stun baton, the ever deadly monofilament whip.  Actually, a monofilament whip adept can be terrifying with relatively little investment.  Goes great in a fingertip compartment.  You can even make it a weapon focus, if your GM will let you get away with it.

As for augmentation on an adept?  There are many augmentations that can be worth it.  Spend that essence carefully, but don't think you have to have essence 6, magic 6 to be effective.  It's a trade-off, but it's one you can come out ahead on.  For example, if you want to hit your augmented maximum on agility (four greater than your base stat), doing that directly through power points would cost you four power points, one per point of agility.  Rating 4 muscle toner would cost .8 essence, losing you one point of magic and the corresponding power point.  (Note: You can't start the game with muscle toner 4, but muscle toner 2 may be a good investment for your character.)  This tends to be a much more attractive deal for adepts than mages, as you rarely roll your magic stat for anything, save a select few powers you don't have to take.

In combat, do note that perhaps the single most important number on your character sheet is initiative.  The Improved Reflexes is probably the most important, and eventually you'll probably want that at rating 3, though not necessarily at character creation.  There are some other options for getting it up (Cram and Jazz spring to mind), if you can't fit it in right off the bat, though.

ShadeRaven

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« Reply #4 on: <03-30-16/0525:18> »
Thanks a lot for the suggestions. I have decided to go with Hobbes's gunslinger adept since with a few minor changes it seems to do what it I wan't it to do pretty well, but I have a few questions:
Any particular reason for picking the Browning over the Ares Predator besides financial considerations? Unless I am missing something the smartgun system is hands down better than laser sight and the bigger clip size is only icing the cake.
How is this character dealing with recoil from semi-auto bursts or even semi-auto shots?
What piece of bio/cyberware and what martial art will compliment this build as a future purchase? I already have attribute boost, so the muscle tonner seems redundant.

Mestoph

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« Reply #5 on: <03-30-16/0733:07> »
I dont know why but when i want to build gun/face adept it  always looks like

== Info ==
Street Name:
Name: Unnamed Character
Movement: 12/24
Karma: 0
Street Cred: 0
Notoriety: 0
Public Awareness: 0
Human
Composure: 10
Judge Intentions: 10
Lift/Carry: 5 (30 kg/20 kg)
Memory: 8
Nuyen: 6000

== Priorities ==
Metatype: E(0) - Human
Attributes: A(4) - 24 Attributes
Special: B(3) - Adept, Magician, or Technomancer
Skills: B(3) - 36 Skills/5 Skill Groups
Resources: E(0) - 6,000¥

== Attributes ==
BOD: 3
AGI: 6
REA: 5 (8)
STR: 2
CHA: 5
INT: 5
LOG: 3
WIL: 5
EDG: 3
MAG: 6

== Derived Attributes ==
Essence:                   6
Initiative:                10 (13) + 4d6
Rigger Initiative:         13 + 4d6
Astral Initiative:         10 + 2d6
Matrix AR Initiative:      13 + 4d6
Matrix Cold Initiative:    5 + DP + 3d6
Matrix Hot Initiative:     5 + DP + 4d6
Physical Damage Track:     10
Stun Damage Track:         11

== Limits ==
Physical:                  5
Mental:                    6
Social:                    8
Astral:                    8

== Active Skills ==
Animal Handling            : 0                      Pool: 4
Archery                    : 0                      Pool: 5
Armorer                    : 0                      Pool: 2
Automatics                 : 6 [Submachine Guns]    Pool: 15 (17)
Blades                     : 0                      Pool: 5
Clubs                      : 0                      Pool: 5
Computer                   : 0                      Pool: 2
Con                        : 6 [Fast Talk]          Pool: 13 (15)
Cybercombat                : 0                      Pool: 2
Demolitions                : 0                      Pool: 2
Disguise                   : 4                      Pool: 9
Diving                     : 0                      Pool: 2
Escape Artist              : 0                      Pool: 5
Etiquette                  : 1 [Street]             Pool: 6 (8)
First Aid                  : 0                      Pool: 2
Forgery                    : 0                      Pool: 2
Free-Fall                  : 0                      Pool: 2
Gunnery                    : 0                      Pool: 5
Gymnastics                 : 1                      Pool: 7
Hacking                    : 0                      Pool: 2
Heavy Weapons              : 0                      Pool: 5
Impersonation              : 0                      Pool: 4
Instruction                : 0                      Pool: 4
Intimidation               : 0                      Pool: 4
Leadership                 : 0                      Pool: 4
Longarms                   : 0                      Pool: 5
Navigation                 : 0                      Pool: 4
Negotiation                : 6 [Bargaining]         Pool: 11 (13)
Palming                    : 4                      Pool: 10
Perception                 : 6 [Visual]             Pool: 11 (13)
Performance                : 0                      Pool: 4
Pilot Ground Craft         : 0                      Pool: 7
Pilot Watercraft           : 0                      Pool: 7
Pistols                    : 6 [Tasers]             Pool: 12 (14)
Running                    : 1                      Pool: 3
Sneaking                   : 4                      Pool: 10
Survival                   : 0                      Pool: 4
Swimming                   : 1                      Pool: 3
Throwing Weapons           : 0                      Pool: 5
Tracking                   : 0                      Pool: 4
Unarmed Combat             : 0                      Pool: 5

== Knowledge Skills ==

== Qualities ==
Adept
Allergy (Uncommon, Mild)
Mentor Spirit (Raven)

== Powers ==
Combat Sense Rating: 2
Improved Ability (skill) (Automatics) Rating: 3
Improved Reflexes 3
Traceless Walk
Voice Control Rating: 1

== Weapons ==
Unarmed Attack
   Pool: 5   Accuracy: 5   DV: 2S   AP: -   RC: 2

i dont know how to finish this character because it looks a bit bland :V.


What piece of bio/cyberware and what martial art will compliment this build as a future purchase? I already have attribute boost, so the muscle tonner seems redundant.
muscle toner>atribute boost but thats my opinion  You can get orthoskin if you are going meele and its cheap, for sword kenjutsu/wudang with iaijtsu.
« Last Edit: <03-30-16/0751:50> by Mestoph »

Hobbes

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« Reply #6 on: <03-30-16/1024:56> »
Thanks a lot for the suggestions. I have decided to go with Hobbes's gunslinger adept since with a few minor changes it seems to do what it I wan't it to do pretty well, but I have a few questions:
Any particular reason for picking the Browning over the Ares Predator besides financial considerations? Unless I am missing something the smartgun system is hands down better than laser sight and the bigger clip size is only icing the cake.
How is this character dealing with recoil from semi-auto bursts or even semi-auto shots?
What piece of bio/cyberware and what martial art will compliment this build as a future purchase? I already have attribute boost, so the muscle tonner seems redundant.

Likely I choose Browning Ultra Power because the character doesn't have a Smartgun implant as well as the cost.  FYI, the reason the build has two pistols is because the artwork had two pistols.  There really isn't any mechanical benefit for two Pistols, if you see some bit of kit that you'd want ditch the extra pistol. 

Recoil?  Aim, Single shot, repeat until victory would be how I would do it.  Any Burst Fire, 1rst is free, 2nd from 2 str, 1 point penalty for a simple burst.  Once you get Hard Targets you'll have options for dealing with that last point of recoil. 

Also Ambidexterity isn't doing much for this build, Jack of All Trades and Perfect Time are qualities from other supplements that would be "better" if you have access.  If not, don't worry about it and just shoot with one hand and Shock Slap with the other as needed.

Implants.  Smartlink, Datajack, Muscle Toner, Damage Compensators, ReaKt, Narco, Reflex Recorders....   The list goes on and on.  It depends on playstyle and how much lewts the GM is handing out.

I really like that build, I think it does a couple things real well and covers all the 'runner basics.  Hope you enjoy it!

ShadeRaven

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« Reply #7 on: <03-30-16/1124:00> »
That explains it. Thanks for the help. I think I will ditch the second gun and the bike to get a smartlink and upgrade to Ares Predator V then.

Regarding my future purchases I was thinking on eventually getting a cyber hand and lower arm with custumised agility 7 and enhanced agility 3 plus a gyromount, tailored pheromones and reflex recorder. But of course that is in the post 100 000k earned future so it's to early to think about it.

What I don't understand is what is the augmented maximum for my dexterity and would the attribute boost stack with the enhanced stats of the cyberarm?

Beta

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« Reply #8 on: <03-30-16/1203:37> »
Note that as you are adding cyberwear you are losing adept powers.  A cyberlimb at standard grade is a full essence point, so also a full magic point, meaning a full PP lost.

Sometimes it is worth it, but be very careful on how much cyber you stack on, or you won't have much 'adept' left!

Hobbes

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« Reply #9 on: <03-30-16/1255:33> »
Cutting off a 7 agility meat arm makes me cringe from an efficiency stand point.  ;  )

You really don't need a Gyro mount in a cyberarm unless you're toting around really gawd awful huge guns and Complex action full auto turn after turn.   That really doesn't happen in most games.  For the most part you need 1 point of recoil comp on any gun and you can simple action burst fire every turn forever without any recoil penalties.  1rst bullet is free, 2 or more str gets another point, 1 more point of recoil comp from whatever and you're able to Simple Action Aim, Simple Action Burst without penalty every turn. 

Hold down the trigger until the mag runs dry doesn't happen in game IME.  Others may have different experience.

And to Beta's point, you'll lose a power point when you lose the Essence.  That's a fairly high cost for "Cool" IMO, but if its part of the character concept, rock on. 


ShadeRaven

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« Reply #10 on: <03-30-16/1311:13> »
I was mostly interested in the gyro arm for the enhanced dexterity and the ability to run and gun without penalty, but yeah - I see your point. Also it's not like I'm going to cut it intentionally, but knowing how our campaigns go... it's not a matter of if, but when a shit is going to hit the fan.

Whiskeyjack

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« Reply #11 on: <03-30-16/1418:04> »
Half limbs are in a really weird utility space.
Playability > verisimilitude.