[Qemuel]

they are still creepy.

I remember feeling "off" for the next couple of days after seeing JL.  It messed with me... and made me think, which is why I think it is one of my all time favorites.

[Angelone]

I don't think I've ever seen that movie. Which is a gross oversight that I must correct. Is it kinda surreal like the Cube? (or whatever that movie with J-Lo was)

I remember my first time playing the original Silent Hill, it was 4am, I was all alone, sitting in my dark room, then all the sudden the controller started beating like a heart. I threw the controller to the floor, jumped over my recliner, and almost cried.

Edit- Very few games get much of an emotional response from me. The Silent Hill series usually does and the Metal Gear Solid games. I cried at the end of MGS 3 and cried a few time during 4.

[FastJack]

The Cell starring J-Lo, Vince Vaughn and (my man!) Vincent D'Onofrio.

More Guillermo del Toro, less Tarsem Singh.

[Usda Beph]

Funny thing about Jacob's Ladder was I got it, and that made the movie kinda leave me feeling  "Yeah...and?"

[Mäx]

Or with an Edge of 4, you could just call the shot to bypass armor (even a bazillion armor) and Longshot it with Edge for 1 auto-hit

IIRC, you can't use edge on a longshot test, its allready an use of edge in itself.

[The_Gun_Nut]

Yessss...which gives you a number of dice equal to your Edge attribute to roll.  In this case four (4).  Which can be used to produce a single automatic hit.

[Mäx]

Which can be used to produce a single automatic hit.

No, buying hits can only be used in a non tresfull situation on a test that has no negative effects from failure.
Longshot test to bypass armor doesn't qualify in anyway.

[Welshman]

No, buying hits can only be used in a non tresfull situation on a test that has no negative effects from failure.
Longshot test to bypass armor doesn't qualify in anyway.

Not exactly:

Gamemasters should only allow this when the character has an exceptionally large dice pool (and is unlikely to fail) or when the situation is non-threatening and nonstressful.

If someone has enough dice to almost certainly ensure a hit, then buying hits can save time and dice rolling. It is up to the GM to make the final decision on allowing buying of hits.

[FoxBoy]

Hmmm.. armor 20+

Levitate spell, hang'em over the edge of a high rise.. hehe. Can he fly?

There's also armor affecting spells that can do the numbe too. Drop a building on him... armor piercing rounds..

He's also probably going to be distinctive as all heck in that amount of armor too. And it's not like you can go walking down the street to the local stuffer shack with that armor on.

At some point he's going to be known, and when that happens, the chances of a J thinking of him as a deniable asset becomes a bit slimmer...

could also set the players up where armor is not an option. Going in armored into a facility can be a red flag.

[Welshman]

Levitate spells... Hmmm I seem to recall the X-Men having Jean Gray use Colossus at a bullet.

Sometimes your own allies can be your worst enemies. An overly armored tank would look a lot like a battering ram to some magic using types. Coyote Shaman anyone?
 

[Mäx]

If someone has enough dice to almost certainly ensure a hit, then buying hits can save time and dice rolling. It is up to the GM to make the final decision on allowing buying of hits.

Yes and 4 dice isn't exactly an exceptionally large dice pool, nor is a longshot test to avoid armor a non-threatening and nonstressful situation.
So my point stands.

[The_Gun_Nut]

Except when the firer in question is a sniper shooting from several hundred meters away with complete and total surprise.  Where, exactly, is the stress or threat in the situation that we have been discussing for the last couple of pages?

[Usda Beph]

I think the problem with the armor v damage is when I score a hit it should do damage. Even if it's only one point. Once the opposed test is won by the attacker then the defender should take some damage. IE the defender was hit. the damage resistance test should by no means reduce the successful hit to '0'.

It kinda takes away the need to roll to hit. After all if you are grazed by a bullet you are HIT. If a bullet bounces off your Armor you are not. Damage resistance should never overrule a successful hit. After all '0' damage isn't hit now is it?

[FastJack]

You shoot a bullet at Superman. You hit, but he took no damage.

If the target's armor/dodge/etc. is high enough to reduce all the damage to zero, it just means they were able to avoid damage from the hit, not avoid the hit. Think of it this way, you were shooting at the target's head. You got a decent roll and the bullet traveled towards the target's head. But they are able to twist and move in reaction to your shot that instead of getting hit somewhere vulnerable, they get hit in the most protected part of their armor. And instead of a straight on shot to the armor (resulting in the stun damage), they are able to position it so that it's a glancing blow to the armor (0 damage).

Is it realistic? No. But then again, as I keep reminding people, this is a cinematic game set in a world of elves and dragons.

[Usda Beph]

Superman can't be a runner either. Waaaaaaaaaay not enough BP for Supes to be one!Your examples are of "Not hitting"

If the target's armor/dodge/etc. is high enough to reduce all the damage to zero

No damage no hit.

Think of it this way, you were shooting at the target's head. You got a decent roll and the bullet traveled towards the target's head. But they are able to twist and move in reaction to your shot that instead of getting hit somewhere vulnerable, they get hit in the most protected part of their armor

Then I haven't hit my target.

A hit means I got past the armor and have done damage. That is a hit, anything else is a miss. I understand your argument but I disagree with the idea that there are two chances for players and NPCs to avoid damage. Remember I have played in games with elves, dragons (& giant fighting robots) for 30 years, in all that time when I hit my target, they take damage.

If I hit someone with a baseball bat and they are wearing a football helmet, they are probably going to survive. Are they going to be hurt? Damn skippy. That's that one (or more) point of damage.