[dluxcru]

So I'm working to help a new player who wants to be a rigger. I'm new myself,so I'm just helping to move things along because I know the rules better than he does (he just started reading the manual.) This is what I've cooked up so far working with him on what he wants. If you spot anything that breaks RAW, let me know - first time building a Rigger and we will need pointers. In general, just looking to optimize this character.



Note that we DON'T have rigger 5.0, so right now things from that are off limits - you'd be good to suggest things to acquire after someone bothers to pick up that manual, but right now we can't add any of that. (I don't even think Chummer has support for Rigger 5 stuff yet, so it may be a while before we use that in play.)



== Info ==
Name: Ven'ar Gemreaper            Alias:
Dwarf, M                          Movement: 10/20
3'10", 150 LB                     Composure: 7
Street Cred: 0                    Judge Intentions: 8
Notoriety: 0                      Lift/Carry: 8 (45 kg/30 kg)
Public Awareness: 0               Memory: 7
Karma: 0                          Nuyen: 924
Age: 35                          Skin: Mid Tanned
Eyes: Steel Gray                  Hair: Copper

== Priorities ==
Metatype: C - Human, Dwarf, Elf, or Ork
Attributes: B - 20 Attributes
Special: E - Mundane
Skills: D - 22 Skills/0 Skill Groups
Resources: A - 450,000¥

== Attributes ==
BOD: 5                            CHA: 3
AGI: 5                            INT: 5
REA: 5                            LOG: 3
STR: 3                            WIL: 4
EDG: 2                           

== Derived Attributes ==
Essence: 2.25                     Initiative:           10 + 1d6
Physical Damage Track: 11         Rigger Init:          10 + 1d6
Stun Damage Track: 10             Astral Init:         
Physical: 6                       Matrix AR Init:       10 + 1d6
Mental: 5                         Matrix VR Cold Init:  5 + DP + 3d6
Social: 5                         Matrix VR Hot Init:   5 + DP + 4d6
Astral: 5

== Active Skills ==
Aeronautics Mechanic              Base: 3  + Karma: 0  = 3   Pool: 6
Armorer                           Base: 3  + Karma: 0  = 3   Pool: 6
Automotive Mechanic               Base: 3  + Karma: 0  = 3   Pool: 6
Longarms                          Base: 1  + Karma: 0  = 1   Pool: 6
Pilot Aircraft                    Base: 6  + Karma: 0  = 6   Pool: 12
Pilot Ground Craft                Base: 6  + Karma: 0  = 6   Pool: 12

== Knowledge Skills ==
Engineering                       Base: 6  + Karma: 0  = 6   Pool: 9
Firearms                          Base: 5  + Karma: 0  = 5   Pool: 8
Firearms                          Base: 5  + Karma: 0  = 5   Pool: 8
German                            N                     
Matrix Games                      Base: 2  + Karma: 0  = 2   Pool: 7

== Qualities ==
Born Rich
Day Job (20 hrs)
Juryrigger
Resistance to Pathogens/Toxins
SINner (National) (German)
Steely Eyed Wheelman
Thermographic Vision
Vehicle Empathy

== Lifestyles ==
Truck Bed (Street)  1 months

== Cyberware/Bioware ==
Control Rig Rating 3

== Armor ==
Armor Jacket                        12
   +Fire Resistance 3
   +Insulation 3
   +Nonconductivity 3
   +Thermal Damping 3

== Weapons ==
Cavalier Arms Crockett EBR
   +Imaging Scope
   +Shock Pad
   +Silencer
   +Spare Clip
   +Stock
   +Tripod
   Pool: 6        Accuracy: 6     DV: 12P      AP: -3    RC: 9
Colt M23
   +Gas-Vent 3 System
   +Shock Pad
   +Smartgun System, External
   +Spare Clip
   +Spare Clip
   +Spare Clip
   +Stock
   Pool: 4        Accuracy: 6     DV: 9P       AP: -2    RC: 6
Grapple Gun
   Pool: 0        Accuracy: 3     DV: 7S       AP: -2    RC: 2
Shock Gloves
   Pool: 4        Accuracy: 6     DV: 8S(e)    AP: -5    RC: 2
Unarmed Attack
   Pool: 4        Accuracy: 6     DV: 3S       AP: -     RC: 2

== Commlink ==
Erika Elite (ATT: 0, SLZ: 0, DP: 4, FWL: 4)
Vulcan Liegelord (ATT: 0, SLZ: 0, DP: 5, FWL: 6)
   +Autosoft (MCT Rotodrone Manuevering) Rating 6
   +Autosoft (Ares Alpha Targeting) Rating 6
   +Autosoft (Electronic Warfare) Rating 6
   +Autosoft (Clearsight) Rating 6
   +Encryption
   +Toolbox
   +Signal Scrub
   +Virtual Machine
   +Armor
   +Biofeedback Filter
   +Guard
   +Sneak
   +Sneak
   +Wrapper
   +Armor

== Gear ==
Ammo: APDS (Sniper Rifles) x20
Ammo: Regular Ammo (Sniper Rifles) x20
Ammo: Regular Ammo (Assault Rifles) x160
Canteen, One Liter
Certified Credstick, Silver
Flashlight, Infrared
Goggles Rating 6
   +Flare Compensation
   +Image Link
   +Low Light
   +Vision Enhancement Rating 2
   +Vision Magnification
Grapple Gun
   +Catalyst Stick
   +Stealth Rope (100m)
Miniwelder
Miniwelder Fuel Canister
Musical Instrument (Good)
Power Tool (Cheap) (Drill)
Roll of Duct Tape
Ruler (Cheap)
Subvocal Mic
Tool Belt (Cheap)
Tool Kit
Tube of Epoxy
Vehicle Tire (Cheap)

== Vehicles ==
MCT-Nissan Roto-drone (Medium)
   +Rigger Interface
   +Weapon Mount
   +Ammo: Regular Ammo (Assault Rifles) x100
   +Autosoft (Pilot) Rating 6
   +Minigrenade: Smoke x6
   +Sensor Array Rating 3
MCT-Nissan Roto-drone (Medium)
   +Rigger Interface
   +Weapon Mount
   +Ammo: Regular Ammo (Assault Rifles) x100
   +Autosoft (Pilot) Rating 6
   +Minigrenade: Gas x6
      +Neuro-Stun VIII
Northrup Wasp (Autogyro)
   +Heavy Weapon Mount
   +Heavy Weapon Mount
   +Rigger Interface
   +Spoof Chips
   +Ammo: Regular Ammo (Medium Machine Guns) x250
   +Autosoft (Pilot) Rating 6
   +Autosoft (Stoner Ares M202 Targeting) Rating 6
   +Autosoft (Aztechnology Striker Targeting) Rating 6
   +Autosoft (Manuevering) Rating 6
   +Sensor Array Rating 3
Steel Lynx Combat Drone (Large)
   +Chameleon Coating
   +Heavy Weapon Mount
   +Rigger Interface
   +Weapon Mount
   +Ammo: Regular Ammo (Assault Rifles) x100
   +Autosoft (Pilot) Rating 6
   +Autosoft (Manuvering) Rating 6
   +Autosoft (Ares Antioch-2 Targeting) Rating 6
   +Autosoft (Colt M23 Targeting) Rating 6
   +Minigrenade: Fragmentation x6
   +Sensor Array Rating 3
Toyota Gopher (Heavy-Duty Pickup)
   +Morphing License Plate
   +Rigger Interface
   +Smuggling Compartment (Troll)
   +Spoof Chips
   +Autosoft (Pilot) Rating 6
   +Sensor Array Rating 2

[Rosa]

Granted i'm no rigger Expert, but it seems to me that Gunnery is missing from your skill list, which is a huge part of playing a rigger.

[忍]

A troll sized smuggling compartment, eh?

That's about the size of a dumpster. Unless you dismember said troll beforehand...

[dluxcru]

Good point on Gunnery - maybe put that in favor of Longarms?.


 The skills balance was really tight on this guy, and I do see it as one of the weaknesses here - a lot of early-game karma will need to be put into them. Which mechanics skill is usually good for drone repair? It might help to drop the armorer skill but that was kind of important to the character - it'd have to be picked up in game.

[adzling]

Riggers need to pump logic and gunnery cause their drones won't hit squat without the rigger jumped in.
This guy has too much meat space attributes when his reaction logic int and will should be prime.
I'd pare back to two drones and the truck and get some logic enhancing ware installed.

[Rosa]

Well i'm back with 2 cents more.

After having checked the core rulebook i would say that you need a high Agi for gunnery, high reaction for pilot skills and high logic for the technical skills.

About skills, i don't see the need for armorer, but i can understand that the player would like it. You most definitely need gunnery. Does the piloting skills really need to be that high? If they do then maybe start with one of them high and the other somewhat lower, which can then be bought up during play, maybe high pilot air craft and lower pilot groundcraft, since with the vehicle choice Theres a clear focus on air vehicles. Build/repair tests are extended tests, so maybe you don't ned to put more than 1 in those? Also what about Electronic warfare for those jamming counterjamming Things? If you do lower the piloting skills, maybe you can get some lost dice back by taking a specialization fx in remote operation.

As i said before i'm not a specialist in riggers, so if i've missed anything or have just shot wide of the mark, then i do apologize.

[adzling]

Rigger's use logic for gunnery when jumped in.
So no need for high agility.

[FancyDerek]

Control Rig [3] = 208000

Control Rig [2]= 97000
Used Reaction Enhancers [3]= 29250
Cerebral Booster [2]= 63000
Total189250

Just a thought... let's you fit in Smartlink too (which is rather useful).

Drones can't run autosofts that are higher in rating than their pilot.

The character has no fake ID.

The character owns no weapon that could be licensed with a fake id.

Last but not least- when KE or LoneStar shoots him down for flying a restricted aircraft unlicensed with a forbidden weapon remember I said he had no ID and no weapon that isn't forbidden.

[Banshee]

Rigger's use logic for gunnery when jumped in.
So no need for high agility.

ummm ... nope
being jumped in has no effect on what attribute is used for a skill ... I know there has been a lot of discussion and erroneous logic related to this by citing the "Control Device" matrix action, or at least I think that is where the idea comes from ... regardless Gunnery uses Agility

[Tym Jalynsfein]

Rigger's use logic for gunnery when jumped in.
So no need for high agility.

ummm ... nope
being jumped in has no effect on what attribute is used for a skill ... I know there has been a lot of discussion and erroneous logic related to this by citing the "Control Device" matrix action, or at least I think that is where the idea comes from ... regardless Gunnery uses Agility

Ummmm... Incorrect...
There has been a lot of discussion about it because you do not use Agility, but Logic.

Page 184 - Passive Targeting

In passive targeting, the vehicle’s Sensor attribute substitutes for the Accuracy of the weapon as the advanced targeting system makes up for any flaws in the weapon design. The attacker rolls Gunnery + Logic [Sensor]. The target’s Signature modifiers are also applied as a dice pool modifier.

Seems pretty clear to me that it is Logic and Not Agility.

[Banshee]

Rigger's use logic for gunnery when jumped in.
So no need for high agility.

ummm ... nope
being jumped in has no effect on what attribute is used for a skill ... I know there has been a lot of discussion and erroneous logic related to this by citing the "Control Device" matrix action, or at least I think that is where the idea comes from ... regardless Gunnery uses Agility

Ummmm... Incorrect...
There has been a lot of discussion about it because you do not use Agility, but Logic.

Page 184 - Passive Targeting

In passive targeting, the vehicle’s Sensor attribute substitutes for the Accuracy of the weapon as the advanced targeting system makes up for any flaws in the weapon design. The attacker rolls Gunnery + Logic [Sensor]. The target’s Signature modifiers are also applied as a dice pool modifier.

Seems pretty clear to me that it is Logic and Not Agility.

but that is a special limited case where you choose to target via sensors (in which case the sensor rating replaces the accuracy) and doesn't matter whether you are jumped in or not ... in fact doesn't even matter if your a rigger or not

[Tym Jalynsfein]

Not a limited case, and yes, it matters.

You do not need Sensors if you are physically manning the gun as you use your eyes and manual dexterity (your Agility). This is no different than firing an SMG or MMG or whatever manually fired weapon you choose to employ.

If you are piloting a Drone and wish to shoot something, though, you cannot use your Eyes becuase you can only use your Dron'e Sensors. As such, you fire the weapon with either passive targeting (which uses Gunnery + Logic) or you go for Active Targeting (which will add bonuses to your Subsequwnt attacks). In either case, when the weapon is fired, it is fired remotely and not directly, therefore using Gunnery + Logic. It is the electronics that matter and not your ability to move your own muscles. The relevant stat for that is Logic (how well you can interpret the sensor feeds and adapt).

[Banshee]

You're missing the most obvious point though.
It is limited because you choose to attack sensors not have to ... all attackers have the option of making a standard attack or a sensor assisted attack if they are using a device that is equipped with sensors period! ... it doesn't require any use of a control rig either therefore it doesn't matter if you're a rigger or not
What you are saying is correct if using sensors to target, just not the only option ... even when piloting a drone because even though you may be using the sensors to "see" you are not necessarily targeting with them ... and also worth noting using Logic only applies to passive targeting not active targeting

An extension of your logic applied to a real world application would also mean that manual dexterity and reflexes would have no effect on your ability to play Call of Duty (or similar)

[dluxcru]

I'm not personally interested in hosting the "Logic vs. Agility" debate on here. It's clear I need points in both stats for shooting regular guns and fixing drones, so both are going to receive points. If you want to figure out which is which, that discussion belongs in the rules topic. My apologies if this sounds rude, but it's not constructive something I find constructive to helping build this character. Ultimately, that's a matter that the GM decides, anyway.

I'm thinking I may pull some points from Pilot Ground Vehicle, and put them into Gunnery and maybe Electronic Warfare from what I'm hearing here. Strength might get pulled from to boost that too.

I do agree that we need to get him a Fake SIN. We do have a national SIN that could include a pilot's licence, but that's not exactly ideal because runners usually don't want a criminal SIN. That and a small pistol are both on the "tweaks to gear" list.

In terms of the cyberware, I may take that suggestion on Reaction Enhancers + Cerebral Boosters. How big is the difference in drone performance between the two setups? The savings in cost could definitely solve the Fake SIN problem, and that alone might justify the change. (EDIT: Noticed that has 15R as well, so it actually HAS to change.) Also noteworthy for future use - would Reflex recorders affect rigging? If so they might be a great boost to Longarms, Gunnery, and Pilot Ground Craft.

Which drones have autosofts higher than their pilot rating? I'm kind of confused by pilot programs in general. Do they come with the drone (since they are determined by the device rating) or do you have to buy them separately?

[忍]

Also noteworthy for future use - would Reflex recorders affect rigging? If so they might be a great boost to Longarms, Gunnery, and Pilot Ground Craft.

--

Which drones have autosofts higher than their pilot rating? I'm kind of confused by pilot programs in general. Do they come with the drone (since they are determined by the device rating) or do you have to buy them separately?

1. Recorders should work. A skill is a skill.

2. Drones have a Pilot Rating. This determines its Device Rating. Drones can either use a number of programs equal to half its Device Rating (CRB) or a number of programs equal to its Device Rating (R5).
With the CRB the drone can arguably have any rating autosoft. With R5 it can only use an autosoft with a rating up to its Device Rating.

The Pilot Rating will act as an attribute while an autosoft will act as a skill.
IE Pilot + [Weapon] Targeting would be an average attack roll.