[Elmoth]

Hello all!

Noob to the game here Glad to find such a big SR5 community!

I am working through the rulebook, and using Chummer to process all the information into a character for the game. I would appreciate a lot if you could provide feedback here I have read quite a few insightful stuff here and on Reddit already and think it is a great source of info. Thanks for the people that do those really comprehensive reviews and  guides for characters and equipment. Extremely helpful!

WARNING: Only core SR5 book used in the game!

My idea started around a gun adept, but it slowly started to move in the direction of an INFILTRATOR, a concept that I really like. The change happened when I Selected Wall running as a cool power (Matrix the movie style) and it slowly built up into an agile catlike thief. It is an adept devoted to Cat, so a modern thief using chameleon gear, lockpicking stuff and running in the walls and jumping between large open spaces has a lot of appeal here. The gun cata is positive, but not maxed out (nor I pretend to have it maxed out unless you advise me strongly otherwise).

However, I am unsure if the character that I have build *can* be an infiltrator (with a fairly OK gun cata as well) or has some glaring failures. Equipment has really driven me nuts here... And I do no t know if the final equipment list is OK or not. I am not looking out to minmax the character, but to make sure that it is at least competent.

On the issue of WEAPONS, I would prefer tasers, really, since the character is not overly violent per se (at least how I see her), but tasers seem to suck big time compared to other guns (specially ranges and magazine capacity) that I finally dropped them. Is that a bad move?


Without further addo, here comes the character:



== Personal Data ==
Street Name: Rae
Name: Rae
Movement: 12/24 (2m/hit)     Swim: 7 (1m/hit)   
Karma: 0
Street Cred: 0
Notoriety: 0
Public Awareness: 0
Human Female Age 32
Height 1,65 Weight 52
Composure: 6
Judge Intentions: 8
Lift/Carry: 8 (45 kg/30 kg)
Memory: 6
Nuyen: 29¥

== Priorities ==
Metatype: E,0
Attributes: A,4
Special: C,2
Skills: B,3
Resources: D,1

== Attributes ==
BOD: 5
AGI: 6
REA: 5 (7)
STR: 3
CHA: 3
INT: 5
LOG: 3
WIL: 3
EDG: 2
MAG: 4

== Derived Attributes ==
Essence:                   6
Initiative:                12 +3d6
Rigger Initiative:         12 +3d6
Astral Initiative:         10 +3d6
Matrix AR:                 12 +3d6
Matrix Cold:               5 + DP +3d6
Matrix Hot:                5 + DP +4d6
Physical Damage Track:     11
Stun Damage Track:         10

== Limits ==
   Chameleon Suit [+2] (Only for Sneaking, Must be visible)
Physical:                  6
   Chameleon Suit [+2] (Only for Sneaking, Must be visible)
Mental:                    5
   Audio Enhancement [+2] (Only for audio Perception)
   Medkit [+3] (Only for First Aid and Medicine)
   Medkit [+6] (Only for First Aid and Medicine)
   Vision Enhancement [+2] (Only for visual Perception)
Social:                    5
Astral:                    5

== Active Skills ==
Automatics (Assault Rifles) Base:  1          Pool:  7 (9)
Computer                 Base:  1          Pool:  4
Con                      Base:  4          Pool:  7
Disguise                 Base:  5          Pool: 10
Etiquette                Base:  3          Pool:  6
First Aid                Base:  2          Pool:  5
Gymnastics               Base:  1          Pool: 11
Impersonation            Base:  2          Pool:  5
Locksmith                Base:  4          Pool: 10
Negotiation              Base:  1          Pool:  4
Palming                  Base:  5          Pool: 11
Perception               Base:  4          Pool:  9
Pilot Ground Craft       Base:  2          Pool:  9
Pistols (Semi-Automatics) Base:  6          Pool: 13 (15)
Running                  Base:  1          Pool:  6
Sneaking                 Base:  5          Pool: 13
Swimming                 Base:  1          Pool:  4
Tracking                 Base:  2          Pool:  7
Unarmed Combat           Base:  1          Pool:  7

== Knowledge Skills ==
Cityspeak (language)     Base:  3          Pool:  6
Dog brawling             Base:  2          Pool:  5
Fences                   Base:  1          Pool:  4
Gang identification      Base:  2          Pool:  5
Japanese (language)      Base:  3          Pool:  6
Sperethiel (language)    Base:  3          Pool:  7

== Contacts ==
"Sparkhand" Jared; Seatle; Adept doctor (2, 1)
Derek; Clause; Drug dealer (1, 1)
Frank Castle; Seattle; Arms dealer (3, 1)
Lars Manning; Seattle; Police lieutenant (2, 3)

== Qualities ==
Addiction (Moderate) (street drugs)
Adept
Allergy (Uncommon, Moderate) (Dogs)
Catlike
Mentor Spirit (Cat)
Natural Athlete

== Powers ==
Combat SenseRating: 1
Improved Ability (skill) (Pistols)Rating: 1
Improved Reflexes 2
Light BodyRating: 2
Wall Running

== Lifestyle ==
Low ("small flat")  1 Months

== Armor ==
Armor Clothing (Good clothes)       6
Armor Jacket                       12
Chameleon Suit                      9
   + Nonconductivity 2
   + Thermal Damping 3
   + Trid Projector
Helmet                              2
   + Trodes

== Weapons ==
Ares Predator V
   + Concealable Holster
   + Silencer
   + Smartgun System, Internal
   + Spare Clip
   + Spare Clip
   + Spare Clip
   + Spare Clip
   Pool: 13 (15)   Accuracy: 7   DV: 8P   AP: -1   RC: 2
Colt America L36
   + Concealable Holster
   + Concealable Holster
   + Silencer
   + Smartgun System, External
   + Spare Clip
   + Spare Clip
   + Spare Clip
   + Spare Clip
   Pool: 13 (15)   Accuracy: 9   DV: 7P   AP: -   RC: 2
Grapple Gun
   Pool: 0   Accuracy: 3   DV: 7S   AP: -2   RC: 2
Knife
   Pool: 5   Accuracy: 5   DV: 4P   AP: -1   RC: 2
Streetline Special
   + Concealable Holster
   + Spare Clip
   + Spare Clip
   + Spare Clip
   + Spare Clip
   Pool: 13   Accuracy: 4   DV: 6P   AP: -   RC: 2
Unarmed Attack
   Pool: 7   Accuracy: 6   DV: 3S   AP: -   RC: 2

== Commlink ==
Erika Elite (ATT: 0, SLZ: 0, DP: 4, FWL: 4)
   + Meta Link

== Gear ==
Ammo: APDS (Holdouts) x30
Ammo: APDS (Light Pistols) x50
Ammo: APDS (Heavy Pistols) x100
Ammo: Flechette Rounds (Holdouts) x30
Ammo: Gel Rounds (Light Pistols) x50
Ammo: Gel Rounds (Heavy Pistols) x50
Ammo: Stick-n-Shock (Heavy Pistols) x20
AR Gloves
Bug Scanner Rating 4
Camera, Micro Rating 1
Certified Credstick, Silver
Certified Credstick, Standard x5
Chisel
Contacts Rating 3
   + Smartlink
   + Vision Magnification
   + Flare Compensation
Datachip
Earbuds Rating 3
   + Select Sound Filter Rating 1
   + Audio Enhancement Rating 2
Fake SIN (Elisa Garret) Rating 4
   + Fake License (Firearms) Rating 4
   + Fake License (Heavy pistol) Rating 4
   + Fake License (Concealable weapons) Rating 4
   + Fake License (Light pistols) Rating 4
   + Fake License (Security expert) Rating 4
   + Fake License (Adept License) Rating 4
Gas Mask
Glasses Rating 1
   + Vision Enhancement Rating 2
   + Thermographic Vision
   + Image Link
Grapple Gun
Jammer, Directional Rating 1
Lockpick Set
Long Haul
Medkit Rating 3
Medkit Rating 6
Micro-Transceiver
Microwire (100m)
Miniwelder
Rapelling Gloves
Slap Patch, Stim Patch Rating 3
Slap Patch, Trauma Patch
Standard Tags x10
Stealth Tags x10
Survival Kit
Tag Eraser
White Noise Generator Rating 1

== Vehicles ==
Suzuki Mirage (Racing Bike)       
   + Sensor Array Rating 2

Thanks a lot in advance!

Cheers,
Xavi

[忍]

You definitely have a good start, however I don't see much point in having the PredV and the colt. Also, addiction can be both confusing and brutal. I only see that you have long haul, which as a gm I wouldn't qualify for moderate. I really dig the character though!

[Hobbes]

Try Stats A; Magic B; Skills C; Meta D; Resources E.  Gets you 6 Magic and 5 Edge on a Human. 

32/2 skill points will go a long way if you cut out some of the chaff.  Take Pistols (Semi-auto) at 6, Sneaking (Urban) at 6, Con (fast talk) 6, Perception 6 (visual), use your group points on Outdoors and Athletics, take 1 point in Etiquette (corp), and Hardware (alarms). 

Stats, I'd shuffle 2 points of Body to Charisma. 

Powers, pick up 2 levels improved attribute (Agility) and drop the Improved ability pistols for Agility boost.  If you have access to other books one level of "Hang Time" is cool to combo with Wall Running.  You run up a few Meters and "Stick". 

Spend 10 Karma on Nuyen and pick up your Shadowrunner basics, nothing fancy.  Armored Jacket (or Mortimer's of London if you have access to Run and Gun), Helmet ( or Balistic Mask), favorite pistol, APDS and Stick and Shock, fake SIN, cheap transport, ect. 

Spend 2 Karma each on Driving, Locksmith, and Palming and whatever else you feel you'll need.  Just get the one rank to start.  If you run out of Karma and still need more skill points drop Natural Athlete.  If you have access to Cutting Aces sourcebook the Alibi positive quality is great, Jack of All Trades is also nice for the long run.

Negative Qualities, Addiction "Street Drugs" isn't a thing, you've got to pick a specific one and with your stats I wouldn't unless you can get Pharmaceutical Grade from Chrome Flesh, then Psyche addiction is my recommendation. 

Overall you really want to start with 6 Magic if you can.  Gear on an Adept can wait.  With 5 Edge you're not an Edgelord but you can fake it pretty well.  Get a meh dice pool in something, pick up a couple dice from whatever gear or situational modifiers you can, maybe an assist from one of your team, and then blow the limit and add 5 more dice and re-roll 6s.  High Edge makes those minor investments go much farther. 

[Beta]

The first thing to keep in mind about infiltration in SR is that most places worth breaking into have security that takes magic and cyberware into account (and for that matter meta-human types).  Depending on the nature of the campaign this may matter more or less, but you should assume that anywhere corporate will have things like cameras and motion detectors, locks everywhere, guards on patrol, and at least a chance of astral security (which will pick up that you are awakened and so pay you particular attention).  Any security measure can be defeated – that is why they layer different types. 

The second thing is that you are part of a team, and getting you somewhere doesn’t help a lot if you can’t bring your team along, too.  And those varied and layered security measures?  This is also part of why you work in a team -- decker to deal with a lot of the security devices, people with skills for dealing with metahuman guards in one way or another, infiltration skills for other circumstances, etc.  You don’t have to be good at everything, and you shouldn’t be dead weight in too many situations (in other words don’t be too narrow in what you can do – you need to specialize, but your team can’t really afford to have you specialized in something that only comes up once every third run)

I say all of this very much as someone who prefers to go around obstacles rather than through them, and love the idea of an intrusions expert.

My experience is that in SR5, stealth and bypassing technological and human monitoring is accomplished largely by magic.  Improved Invisibility and Silence will avoid most detection measures between them, and when it comes to just normal sneaking, spirits provide a huge boost so that modest sneak abilities are usually all that are needed.  If you can rely on that sort of magical cover, then Locksmithing can be useful (it says Lockpicking in the Core rule book (CRB), but errata changed it to Locksmithing iirc).  Otherwise you need a decker to deal with the cameras and so forth, at which point the decker may be able to handle the locks as well.

As for dealing with magical security, the only thing that is any good at that is generally also magic (astral perception just to know that it is there, magic to attempt to deal with it before it reports on you).  (Some people grumble about ‘MagicRun,’ because on top of the above, spirits can be very potent in combat, magicians can use spells to deal with a large variety of situations, and so forth.  But magicians have their limits, and also need team mates).

Or to put it another way, imagine the following situation.  You’ve gotten into the target building and up a staircase to the right floor.  Because of prep work your team did, you know that need to go out this door, turn left, and go down a corridor for 20 metres to your target door.  Sliding a tiny camera on the end of an optical fibre under the door, you see that every ten metres there is a ceiling mount with cameras looking both ways down the corridor – no doubt with a software agent somewhere monitoring the feed for unscheduled movement, and possibly with a live guard scanning through the feeds periodically too.  You expect that your target door is locked.  There are other doors along the corridor, and you don’t know if anyone is behind any of them, and if so if they may come out.  There could be ultrasonic motion sensors running, but you can’t see that.  What is* your role in getting into the target room going to be?  (* or was, if you would have done something ahead of time to enable the team to get there from here)

[Rooks]

I suggest reading page 358 on for security systems gonna need locksmith and hardware as well as maglock pass keys sequencers keycard copiers auto picker electronic kit celluar glove molder

[Elmoth]

Hello all!


Thanks for the insightful feedback! We just got through our first scene (Play by forum, so slow play here) where 3 other runners left us in a sorry state. Well not really since they were just trying to steal some stuff from us, but we managed to look quite pathetic in the process  Now the Director allows us to swap stuff around, within limits.

I changed the concept from a cat adept to a dog adept. Why? Because 1 Cat Adept was not working for me and 2 the Dog concept offered more story potential. Now she is a member of  The Irish Terriers, an extended gang of followers of Dog (shaman leader et al) specialized in tracking and retrieval. I like the concept. I took totem (dog), Dependents (the gang) and First impression (terriers are cute ) to work around the concept. Also changed the contacts to round it up.

You definitely have a good start, however I don't see much point in having the PredV and the colt.

Colt is her main weapon. Predator V was suposed to be there for when she expects a bullet storm, not to carry around regularly. I ended up changing the Predator for a Warhawk, so going for even a more extreme option here. Still, her main weapon will be an Ex Shcker taser. i like not having a "kill the dude" option as her first one, since she is a retriever in design, not a cold blooded killer. I like how the taser works. Even if I read around the net that tasers are not that good in shadowrun, I do not see much problem with that option here; a pistol should not be used at extreme ranges anyway, and the 9S with -5AP stats sound OK to me to drop guards...

Also, addiction can be both confusing and brutal. I only see that you have long haul, which as a gm I wouldn't qualify for moderate. I really dig the character though!

Yeah. ended up dropping this for Dependents. I think Dependets is quite harsh as well, but it offers story potential and I like it. Thans for the tip here

Try Stats A; Magic B; Skills C; Meta D; Resources E.  Gets you 6 Magic and 5 Edge on a Human. 

[SNIP the rest of the really thoughtful comments]

Thanks a lot for the rundown on the character build. Very interesting. However, it might be too much of a change for the game master to accept. Will have to check, but basic design probably needs to stay similar. Will take your advise as a benchmark anyway regardless of what he says. Kudos for a great rundown.

The first thing to keep in mind about infiltration in SR is that most places worth breaking into have security that takes magic and cyberware into account (and for that matter meta-human types).  Depending on the nature of the campaign this may matter more or less, but you should assume that anywhere corporate will have things like cameras and motion detectors, locks everywhere, guards on patrol, and at least a chance of astral security (which will pick up that you are awakened and so pay you particular attention).  Any security measure can be defeated – that is why they layer different types. 

The second thing is that you are part of a team, and getting you somewhere doesn’t help a lot if you can’t bring your team along, too.  And those varied and layered security measures?  This is also part of why you work in a team -- decker to deal with a lot of the security devices, people with skills for dealing with metahuman guards in one way or another, infiltration skills for other circumstances, etc.  You don’t have to be good at everything, and you shouldn’t be dead weight in too many situations (in other words don’t be too narrow in what you can do – you need to specialize, but your team can’t really afford to have you specialized in something that only comes up once every third run)

I say all of this very much as someone who prefers to go around obstacles rather than through them, and love the idea of an intrusions expert.

My experience is that in SR5, stealth and bypassing technological and human monitoring is accomplished largely by magic.  Improved Invisibility and Silence will avoid most detection measures between them, and when it comes to just normal sneaking, spirits provide a huge boost so that modest sneak abilities are usually all that are needed.  If you can rely on that sort of magical cover, then Locksmithing can be useful (it says Lockpicking in the Core rule book (CRB), but errata changed it to Locksmithing iirc).  Otherwise you need a decker to deal with the cameras and so forth, at which point the decker may be able to handle the locks as well.

As for dealing with magical security, the only thing that is any good at that is generally also magic (astral perception just to know that it is there, magic to attempt to deal with it before it reports on you).  (Some people grumble about ‘MagicRun,’ because on top of the above, spirits can be very potent in combat, magicians can use spells to deal with a large variety of situations, and so forth.  But magicians have their limits, and also need team mates).

Or to put it another way, imagine the following situation.  You’ve gotten into the target building and up a staircase to the right floor.  Because of prep work your team did, you know that need to go out this door, turn left, and go down a corridor for 20 metres to your target door.  Sliding a tiny camera on the end of an optical fibre under the door, you see that every ten metres there is a ceiling mount with cameras looking both ways down the corridor – no doubt with a software agent somewhere monitoring the feed for unscheduled movement, and possibly with a live guard scanning through the feeds periodically too.  You expect that your target door is locked.  There are other doors along the corridor, and you don’t know if anyone is behind any of them, and if so if they may come out.  There could be ultrasonic motion sensors running, but you can’t see that.  What is* your role in getting into the target room going to be?  (* or was, if you would have done something ahead of time to enable the team to get there from here)

The first thing to keep in mind about infiltration in SR is that most places worth breaking into have security that takes magic and cyberware into account (and for that matter meta-human types).  Depending on the nature of the campaign this may matter more or less, but you should assume that anywhere corporate will have things like cameras and motion detectors, locks everywhere, guards on patrol, and at least a chance of astral security (which will pick up that you are awakened and so pay you particular attention).  Any security measure can be defeated – that is why they layer different types. 

Ok. Hopefully I will not find a spirit in every respirator vent I try to enter though An important thing to consider in any case!

The second thing is that you are part of a team, and getting you somewhere doesn’t help a lot if you can’t bring your team along, too.  And those varied and layered security measures?  This is also part of why you work in a team -- decker to deal with a lot of the security devices, people with skills for dealing with metahuman guards in one way or another, infiltration skills for other circumstances, etc.  You don’t have to be good at everything, and you shouldn’t be dead weight in too many situations (in other words don’t be too narrow in what you can do – you need to specialize, but your team can’t really afford to have you specialized in something that only comes up once every third run)

I say all of this very much as someone who prefers to go around obstacles rather than through them, and love the idea of an intrusions expert.

Meh. That was a less happy idea....
The idea is that he should be able to work alone as well as a part of a team.
Being a forum-based game is important here, since there can be solo runs as well as the main missions" with the whole team assembled, so some semblance of credibility for a solo character should be convenient.

My experience is that in SR5, stealth and bypassing technological and human monitoring is accomplished largely by magic.  Improved Invisibility and Silence will avoid most detection measures between them, and when it comes to just normal sneaking, spirits provide a huge boost so that modest sneak abilities are usually all that are needed.  If you can rely on that sort of magical cover, then Locksmithing can be useful (it says Lockpicking in the Core rule book (CRB), but errata changed it to Locksmithing iirc).  Otherwise you need a decker to deal with the cameras and so forth, at which point the decker may be able to handle the locks as well.

As for dealing with magical security, the only thing that is any good at that is generally also magic (astral perception just to know that it is there, magic to attempt to deal with it before it reports on you).  (Some people grumble about ‘MagicRun,’ because on top of the above, spirits can be very potent in combat, magicians can use spells to deal with a large variety of situations, and so forth.  But magicians have their limits, and also need team mates).

So a mage or a decker are better infiltrators than me. OK. Not changing the characer to those though A pitty the game is designed that way.

Or to put it another way, imagine the following situation.  You’ve gotten into the target building and up a staircase to the right floor.  Because of prep work your team did, you know that need to go out this door, turn left, and go down a corridor for 20 metres to your target door.  Sliding a tiny camera on the end of an optical fibre under the door, you see that every ten metres there is a ceiling mount with cameras looking both ways down the corridor – no doubt with a software agent somewhere monitoring the feed for unscheduled movement, and possibly with a live guard scanning through the feeds periodically too.  You expect that your target door is locked.  There are other doors along the corridor, and you don’t know if anyone is behind any of them, and if so if they may come out.  There could be ultrasonic motion sensors running, but you can’t see that.  What is* your role in getting into the target room going to be?  (* or was, if you would have done something ahead of time to enable the team to get there from here)

Can happen. Will try to go though th vents in any case, or find another way in, probably as a security guard probably ask a team member to run interference somewhere (decker, start a fire, explode a small bomb somewhere,...whatever) to distract the building security. There are other ways, I guess. I suppose that being a decker or mage could be better, but I am not And well, at least I can run jump and shot if things go south


[/quote]

I suggest reading page 358 on for security systems gonna need locksmith and hardware as well as maglock pass keys sequencers keycard copiers auto picker electronic kit celluar glove molder

With locksmith and hardware you can do everything you are suggesting, right? Still, got all the gear you are suggesting. Thanks for the pointeres

Thanks everybody. Will try to repost the updated character when I update the character in Chummer5. Will try to rebuild it as Hobbes pointed out, but it is unlikely that such massive changes will fly in this game, though. But as an exercise (at least) it will be very interesting

Cheers,
Xavi