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Your Shadowrunners Morals....just how low will they go?

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Outsider

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« on: <02-14-11/1828:57> »
Now most of us that play Shadowrun know that it's not all rainbows (or even a  double rainbow) and sunshine. So as an on again, off again GM for Shadowrun I like to see how low my runners morals will go. When I play I like to keep things in reason and also try to get the other player to "toe the line". The characters are pragmatic at best but never lowly. So share your stories of just how low your character went or your team(s) and if you're a GM how low your players went.
There are two things cheap in life. A plane ticket and piano wire.

V zhizne tolko dve veshi bivayut deshoviye: bilet na samolet i struna dla pianino.

Loki

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« Reply #1 on: <02-14-11/1924:31> »
Where do you live that plane tickets are cheap? It's a couple hundred bucks here for the ticket then thousands more in therapy after the TSA molests you.

Also, my runners are pure angelic beings who commit no wrong, do not pass gas, and help lil old troll ladies across the street.
« Last Edit: <02-14-11/1926:42> by Loki »

Charybdis

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« Reply #2 on: <02-14-11/2029:41> »
Erk, errr...ahem *cough* well.... things have gone from bad to worse for my free spirit PC recently  :-\

We're running through the Ghost Cartel module of adventures (centering on Tempo distribution and intrigue), and my PC who started out as an explicitly 'no wetwork or drug distribution'  runner, has slowly spiralled further and further into a mass-murdering drug dealer.

*Ack. I was going to post examples, but didn't want to list spoilers  :-X *

I must note, however, it's been a fun slide for me as a player, doling out the visible regret and moral decline as the PC realises they're diving further and further into the nasty stuff.

However, the PC is holding onto a bright light at the end of the tunnel. As it specialises in infiltration and deception, it's playing along with the fixer and adventure modules as a self-employed undercover agent, intent on destroying the source of Tempo (and has convinced at least one other PC to go along with the new end-game in mind).

Is pretty interesting to play in the group, but WOW are there a lot of regrets.
Idealistic entity that I'm playing, have even donated a lot of run-money to 'Victims of Crime' Charities and institutions.... you know..guilt money  :-[

I'm loving the game  ;D
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topcat

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« Reply #3 on: <02-14-11/2036:59> »
Seen the moral spectrum from white hats to black hats.  Whatever works for the group and makes for a good story, go with it!  :D

Fizzygoo

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« Reply #4 on: <02-14-11/2325:01> »
I have a player that has taken Pacifist. Not the hardcore 10 pt version, "just" the 5 pt version (I think it's 10/5, no books at work, but yeah). He's running with a pistols aptitude street sam, and a katana/broadsword wielding adept of death. So long as the Pacifist and the mage of the group can talk things down...no problem. But we've yet to get into combat...next game night perhaps. I hope to test the Pacifist over and over and over again :)

If I get the Pacifist to kill...yay, I win! If the Pacifist keeps to his code...yay he wins! Either way, should be fun.

Of course it's not just the players that can take the low road. GMs can be pretty nasty as well. I haven't hit my (mostly new to SR) players with anything bad yet (we've only done Food Fight and now about 1/2 way through On the Run). But by last game I had finished a book on the history of cannibalism (long story, but I like cannibal jokes, friend got it for me, I read it, now I've got real life cannibalism (very disturbing) on my, well, mmmm braaaainnns...anyway), two of the players took a taxi to a dive bar in the barrens, on the outskirts really, but deep enough they had to pay up front and more than usual for the ride. So they're passing through burnt out slums with pimps and pushers and everything else and then they hit one particularly lifeless and quiet block. One player looks out the window and sees a flash from an oil-drum fire down an alley. As the taxi passes by, the player sees one humanoid figure pull up the seemingly lifeless arm and torso of another humanoid up off the ground, rip off the triceps flesh with its free hand, and begin to lower the meat down its throat. Then the alley is gone, passed by like every other alley on their trip.

I like keeping my players aware of just how bad things can get, but they don't always have to be in the middle of it :)
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FastJack

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« Reply #5 on: <02-14-11/2335:24> »
It's definitely a hard road to follow, especially if you like your Shadows dark and your Punk dystopian. It can lead to all kinds of issues, not just whether or not to kill, but whether or not to preach to the team, and what to do if there's a serious falling out.

Tagz

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« Reply #6 on: <02-14-11/2344:18> »
My group is a little bi-polar when it comes to morals.

They will risk it all to save the ass of a guy they barely know, and get 3 members killed in the process.  They'll go out of their way to help contacts, some of whom are just using them.

And then they will do things like nearly beat the crap out of a 7 year old ork girl who led them in a circle in Caracas's La Rinconada.  There was going to be a point to following her, but they decided to just levitate her and pound on her for wasting their time.  I had the local gang that gets paid for protection show up.

I try to find their character's moral center and find the compass spins in circles.

Mystic

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« Reply #7 on: <02-15-11/0218:05> »
Depends on the character, to be honest. When I create a character, before stats and whatnot I come up with a concept. That concept determines how said character will act. For example, my "favorite Merc" has a strict personal code of conduct. No deliberate targeting of civilians, avoid collateral damage whenever possible, go for the precision hit, honor the contract.Granted that last part can get a bit tricky. He has no qualms about blowing away people in their sleep provide they represent an actual tactical target.

Now, on the flip side, I have also played a cybered out hitman who honors only one thing: the contract. Blow away an orphanage..sure! Poision kittens and puppies in the pound, when you need it done by? Didn't matter as long as he was paid. He simply didnt CARE. He was SO about the "contract" that other members of the group had to promise payment in the middle of a bar fight before he would help.

Only once did I play a truly psycho-killer type. And to be honest, I found it boring. Its easy to just kill everything in sight just to be a badass, its much more fun to have the limits because the challange is in keeping whatever code you have.
Why in the frag did they put ME in charge?

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Fortinbras

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« Reply #8 on: <02-15-11/0442:41> »
It has been my experience that whatever type of campaign the group decides upon at the beginning, it will flow the opposite way very quickly.

A lot of my players were excited to play Shadowrun because we had been playing VtM for a year or so before and I was a pretty big stickler for the Humanity rule, not wanting my players to start murdering everyone in sight. That game slowly deteriorated into the group committing mass murder across several states and my players constantly bemoaning the fact that there were repercussions for killing people.

In Shadowrun, they did a run in an office where the street sammy said "No one leaves alive." and proceeded to kill every wage slave on the floor. I think he did this to get a rise out of me, seeing as I was very no-kill in Vampire, but I didn't really react because it's Shadowrun, people die all the time.
Sure, now the players have a bit of a rep for murder and he created one heck of a background count, but there were no mechanical consequences and I told him most people on the street didn't care.
Then, all the players were left starring at the totality of what they had done. From then on out, they aren't nearly as kill everybody crazy, and have actually developed a bit of a conscious for caring about those widows they've created.

I don't know if it's because people are contrary, the setting is bleak so the players want to fight that, or if the "naughtiness" of being bad fades when no one cares, but I've found the best way to truly test my player's morals is to have no moral prejudgments of my own and simply describe the events as they unfold.
It turns out, they aren't as bad as they think they are.
« Last Edit: <02-15-11/0444:51> by Fortinbras »
O, proud Death, What feast is toward thine eternal cell, That thou so many princes at a shot So bloodily hast struck?
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Kot

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« Reply #9 on: <02-15-11/0500:31> »
I've GM'd a few Shadowrun street-level games for six teens of age 14-17. They've taken out a kill-squad of humanis, killing them all in one round, without even letting them pull a trigger... And they did discuss things afterwards, obviously feeling wrong even about killing a bunch of racist murderers in a game. I was surprised, because it was strange, I'd expect more trigger-happy, less moral restraints. But they did well, saving lives when it would have been easier to just loot the corpse, and then even defending the guy from his gangmates, and trying to clear his name. And in the grande finale they almost got wiped out, because they didn't want to hurt the spirit-possessed troll more than it was necessary.
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savaze

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« Reply #10 on: <02-15-11/0758:21> »
The group I played with was more of the 'If it can get me on the news I'll do it' variety...

Charybdis

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« Reply #11 on: <02-15-11/0820:41> »
The group I played with was more of the 'If it can get me on the news I'll do it' variety...
Ack!

We had a player like that. His smiling face after mono-whipping a few Lone Stars was the last thing anyone saw before the HTR team Assault-rifled him to death.... (Yes, the verb, to Assault-Rifle...it means 'to perforate with multiple sharp metal projectiles, from range, at high speed)
'Too much is never enough'

Current PC: Free Spirit (Norse Shamanic)
'Names are irrelevant. Which fake ID do you want me to quote from?'

Phreak Commandment V:
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TheWanderingJewels

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« Reply #12 on: <02-15-11/0839:39> »
The Characters by in Large try to go the non-lethal route (attracts much less attention (and hardcore motivation) from KE and other Corporate types), but there are times when I've pushed to see if the monster will come out. They also have an NPC merc (Sonny) who encapsulates the trope "Good Is NOT Nice" and goes out of his way to make examples of people who make others lives miserable for his own personal giggles.

 A notable bit in his background is that when the Japanese pulled out of Yomi, he led a raid to deal with the hardcore IJA, IJN troops left behind and is rather famous in the Japanese metahuman community in that they know about him, and aren't saying who or what he looks like if the Japan-a-corps come asking.

He has a severe dislike for Japanese Corps and particularly the Imperial Japanese Military and has been actively hunting in the background for troopers who had been stationed on Yomi that were subsumed into the corps. He's been leaving a trail of bodies behind him that the players are somewhat aware of (he's good enough to cover his tracks), and only recently have they become aware of his reputation as the Jiyu Senshi  by his exploits in CalFree.

He had called in a favor from the players during a down time period for getting patched up. They found him in a Seattle warehouse in Tacoma that was under control of the Japanese Meta-human controlled Yakuza, (name escapes me at the moment) with an older but still physically robust Japanese gentleman bound and gagged, both pretty bloody and messy. As the groups mage medic patched him up, they asked who the guy was. He stated that he was former governor Saito of San Fran and he's been tracking him for a long time. He also stated the man had some ties back to Yomi, which was simply a tack-on from his decidedly infamous reputation in Frisco.

He also stated that he'd contact some Yomi and Frisco survivors about them man through back channels and that they were coming to thank him. Personally. I played this one calmly as after getting patched up, he had a lunch pail brought in by, what they found out to be much later to be his GF (Japanese elf with the pearly skin variation) who had been used as a "comfort woman" while she was in Yomi, as other japanese metas filtered in.

He stated he was going to send the head back to Japan and needed it intact. The rest was the survivors to play with. He put on a bit of uplifting bapitist music while the metas did to him what the Fremen did to 'The Beast' Raban from Dune, and he silently sipped his tea, smiling.

The female players were appalled as were some of the males. Sonny simply shrugged and said, "This way, no lawyer gets paid, no life sentence, no weaseling out. And some deserving people get a bit of therapy. Win Win."

The characters haven't made as much light hearted comments around him since then.
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Usda Beph

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« Reply #13 on: <02-15-11/1149:06> »
If we're fighting CorpSec Usda will use  JustForce (trying hard to not kill) If we're fighting "Evil" CorpSec, If they die they die. Usda does have that tiny personality quality glitch "Berzerk Rage". But he doesn't start out wanting to kill everyone in a 3/4 mile radius.

On the other hand my "Face" has no problems with shooting whoever he needs to negotiate information out of the oposition.
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theKernel

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« Reply #14 on: <02-15-11/1752:16> »
I like it as low as you can feasibly go. I once had a heavy weapons Ork make swiss cheese out of an old lady a mom and baby in a subway to get away from the cops.
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