[Seraph]

Okay, I don´t really know where to post this, it´s about characters, but more then one. So If im wrong just move it.

So our group has been playing RPGs together for a few years and everyone has played for some years, 3-10 i think. And now we got our eyes on Shadowrun 4A:ed. We usually get a rather broad varity of skills and personas while gaming together. But since we don´t know all that much about the campaign builds for this setting we ( i ) would like to know what you think of our chances of survival, completing missions, overall etc etc.

So the group then.

1 Break and enter infiltrator character. Much focus on talking her way out of harm and stealth.
1 Mage, focusing on manipulation magics and lots of languages for interpretation.
1 Dronerigger, focusing on his drones and a broad varity of Logic skills electronics/mechanics/hacker
1 Adept Face, hugh amounts of charisma powers and qualities, few other traits actually
1 Fighter, going Tank with cyberware and loads of armor. Few other traits
1 not chosen yet ....

Do you se flaws directly, is there something we have missed that´s crucial?

Thanks for commingfeedback!

[wylie]

need a hacker, or have 2 character be ready to aid each other with hacking skills if that is their 2ndary position

[Critias]

Unless their GM doesn't want to fool with the Matrix or something, yeah.  You guys are gonna want someone that can hack (unless that's covered by your rigger and you just didn't mention it).

[JoeNapalm]

I like the strong focus on defense, but you may need a Designated Hitter (DPS, as the kids like to say).

Any of those guys can do harm...but sometimes it is nice to have a straight-up killer in your corner.

-Jn-
Ifriti Sophist

[Seraph]

Yeah, we like to roll safely, but like everyone knows that is never how things end.

The rigger guy has around 10-13 dice in hacking, so we have one. Just forgot to write it.

Like you say there, a true DPS monster is what we need. The mage can sling stuff, but it sucks if he´s downed.
The Break and enter girl can handle herself rather well in a fight, so can the rigger. The rigger will not enter the front very often though.

We agreed that every char should have atleast one skill that they can kill something with, but a pure fighter with loads of guns and swords and plastic could be useful when shit hits the fan.

Will it be beneficial to have more then one hacker char? Sure if one is downed but the hacker can work from outside and is never really on the lines either? Or am i wrong about this?

[Cass100199]

You have 6 players already. That's my upper limit, personally.

[Seraph]

oohh, im not talking about adding players, just modifying the uses and purposes within the group.

But according to what you guys have said i think we will manage rather well.

[Tsuzua]

To be fair, anyone on the list can do a quite good job with the dps as well.  It's not that hard to be a good combat character in SR.  You need a decent attack roll (how big depends on the group, but I typically go with 10+ dice), 2-3 IPs, and enough defenses that you can survive (ideally barely standing if possible) a narrow long and short burst of AR fire.   

[JoeNapalm]

There's a big difference, though, between a good combat character and a dedicated combat build.

Any decent build in SR should be a good combat character. A decent dedicated combat build eats mooks like popcorn, though.

Depending on the style of your team and game, you might not need one...but it doesn't hurt to know someone.

"What about calling your friends?"

"Campa? Quino? They would destroy the city."

-Jn-
Ifriti Sophist

[Makki]

"A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects."
    — Robert Heinlein, Time Enough for Love

[Joush]

Of course, nonspecailized Shadow Runner's tend to be dead ones. Still, it's not a class based game, and I'd suggest almost every character be able to handle a few different jobs. (Of course, you are still likely to be really good at the skill you use to stay alive as a Shadowrunner)

[Solomon]

Of course, nonspecailized Shadow Runner's tend to be dead ones.

My experience is the exact opposite. Hyperspecialized characters tend to be dead weight except in their one area whereas a generalist is useful almost all the time. The rest of the team routinely ends up defending the hyperspecialized character unless the specialization is combat and if the specialization is combat, that character doesnt get used if everyone else does their job right. The only really specialized character I like on my teams is the hacker/technomancer because you need that for data jobs but anything else and specialization on a crazy level just makes them useless for anything else with beginning points.

[Kontact]

Mr. Lucky.

[JoeNapalm]

Of course, nonspecailized Shadow Runner's tend to be dead ones.

My experience is the exact opposite. Hyperspecialized characters tend to be dead weight except in their one area whereas a generalist is useful almost all the time. The rest of the team routinely ends up defending the hyperspecialized character unless the specialization is combat and if the specialization is combat, that character doesnt get used if everyone else does their job right. The only really specialized character I like on my teams is the hacker/technomancer because you need that for data jobs but anything else and specialization on a crazy level just makes them useless for anything else with beginning points.

It somewhat depends on the campaign, but if you don't have specialists, you have a team of average people.

Which is more useful? Two characters with mediocre Face abilities, or one Face?

As was said earlier, it is fairly to make any build combat-capable. The specialist should only need defending if they are doing their job in the middle of a fight (assuming their job isn't fighting).

Yes, if you specialize, there will be times when you aren't in the spotlight, but the team as a whole will generally be much more capable, as they have a ton more dice to throw at any given problem.

- Jn -
Ifriti Sophist

[Solomon]

To me it depends on what else those people can do. Do I want two secondary faces who are also reasonable combatants, one is a half decent hacker or tech and the other has a nice sized truck and some first aid? I prefer having a team that can handle a situation in more than one manner and bring more than one awesome skill to the table. It just seems unrealistic that you have a guy who has 20 dice in sniper rifles and can't fight unarmed, never learned to drive, and doesnt know any military etiquette or recon skills. Where the hell does this guy come from? I know everyone tries to maximize their points but the characters I see really should come from somewhere and make sense holistically. How do you play a character that only knows three skills but knows them to world renowned levels? Where did he grow up that he doesnt know anything else?

Plus, lets be honest, if all somebody has is a hammer - say con or sniper rifles at 20 dice - then every problem he faces is a nail, subject to sniper rifles or con. It gets predictable, it gets boring for everyone and when it doesnt work they have nothing else to offer.