[All4BigGuns]

Another reason to keep the cash separate; with it all lumped together, the stronger personality/more charming schmoozer players could end up talking/bullying the ones who aren't as savvy out of their share.

[Sichr]

Yes. You perfectly picked up the very essence of teamwork 


EDIT: IRL such character would be called manager or a team leader...
And srry but I cannot help myself, but if you see team as random assembly of individuals who always have their own agenda first, team second, Id be a bit afraid to be at the same table as you are...

[The Big Peat]

My (now sadly aborted) game started with a flat 400BP, of which you could spend ZERO on Nuyen, as well as a bonus of a flat 250,000¥ lump sum, essentially making them 450BP characters that have been forced to max out on their gear.

I also relaxed Availability (perhaps a bit too much in hindsight) so they wouldn't be stuck with "starter" gear. For this game I'd suggest a "basic" availability of 20, up to 28 w/ Restricted Gear.

Out of curiosity, how did that go down with the magic users? I imagine there were a lot of foci/augmented adepts... I'd have thought that the only thing a pure adept could really do there is start a hedge fund. But interested to see what did happen.

My advice for the prospective GM is to talk over the options with your players. See whether they prefer straight BP, straight KG, or a mix. All of them have their plus and down points and its really down to what suits the group and what the players (and you) are most comfortable with. But I definitley support raising contacts/knowledge skills and such things to ensure that people have the depth of knowledge you'd expect a veteran SR to have.

Damn, I want to play/run this now...

[JustADude]

My (now sadly aborted) game started with a flat 400BP, of which you could spend ZERO on Nuyen, as well as a bonus of a flat 250,000¥ lump sum, essentially making them 450BP characters that have been forced to max out on their gear.

I also relaxed Availability (perhaps a bit too much in hindsight) so they wouldn't be stuck with "starter" gear. For this game I'd suggest a "basic" availability of 20, up to 28 w/ Restricted Gear.

Out of curiosity, how did that go down with the magic users? I imagine there were a lot of foci/augmented adepts... I'd have thought that the only thing a pure adept could really do there is start a hedge fund. But interested to see what did happen.

The Mage dumped most of her Nuyen into a freakin' huge Power focus and the Adept in a huge Weapon Focus... and everyone was wearing tricked-out Milspec armor. Didn't make it past the "cakewalk" shakedown runs before we ended up on a nearly two-month hiatus due to one thing after another, so I have no clue how it would've played out long-term.

[Weebomancer]

Wow this topic got huge pretty quickly. On another note some of the specs I am using for my first test game.

-Giving players what I think a "pro" runner would have instead of giving them BP/Karma to buy it.

This actually is favorable since it means the players don't spend it on skills or attributes. I can give them a safehouse in multiple cities with basic gear in case the chocolate hits the fan or even contacts I feel they might need. The best part is that it won't feel like GM fiat when what they need happens to show up because it's already on their sheets from the start

-485 BP build. 50 forced into Nuyen and 35 forced into positive qualities that do not count against the standard upwards downwards limit. For both Nuyen and Qualities. This means a runner can start with up to 500k if they wish. Or possibly get a ton of positive qualities for few to no negative ones. I use BP because I tried out Karma character creation and I don't like it for this game in particular. I tend to have around 6 players. It's clearly made for smaller groups where more coverage is needed. Also I looked into giving karma and thought of giving out free perks instead. Perhaps this will have a more interesting effect on the game in terms of making the runners feel more powerful. Power is not always directly measured by karma after all small bonuses or perks can do the trick too.

-Availability is 18.

It seems the best area to keep it at as you can get HMG's and medium military armor to start at 18 Availability. Plus it allows for a bunch of other useful things that I generally see on experienced parties. 18 seems to be around a "sweet spot" The whole spot being 16-20. It's stuff you would see on experienced runners (depending on experience) and yet not allowing some fully massive gear. At least not on start. Again it's the spot you would hit depending on how experienced you want them to be. I think it fits well for my vision. Though I might pump it up pending on some things. But a rating 4 foci seems good. I mean you don't find those laying around everywhere XD.

Still thinking of the other stuff at this time but I definitely would like to test this setting out. Now I just need to find test players to try it out.

[Sichr]

and what about skills? You mentioned only gear and money, if I get it right...and maybe a few qualities (which is interresting idea, well I can see that it can be difficult for players  to find that many possitive qualities without breaking core concept...well that is just a feeling)
Skillz...you know...that thing that makes difference between the noob and the professional...

[bangbangtequila]

Since you are tending towards filling out the character rather then making them better specialists (an interesting, and in my opinion good, move considering how powerful a basic character can be already) why not add a certain base set of skills? Any experienced runner will know how to use Pistols, set a bomb, run at least basic Matrix gear, field strip a weapon, throw a punch, etc. Why not provide a small set of rating 2 skills to reflect things picked up?

[Weebomancer]

I should have noted that in the first part. When I said giving them what I think "pro" runners have I meant EVERYTHING. Not just stuff and people. I just didn't use skills as an example. So instead of extra BP for buying more skills I will just give them skills. But seeing as how I'm still trying to decide on what and how I decided not to use it. For now though I think 2 is a good rating for all those. I would say athletic skills and stealth should be at 2 since those are used almost infinitely in any run. As to weapons I agree on pistols but then the next question comes along. Longarms and Automatics? Some people in real life in modern times can use shotguns and rifles, and just as many do automatics instead. Should I give 1 or 2 to those? Also other skills I think should be dependent on character background. Maybe one guy was in the army? I would say he has most weapons skills at 2 then. You can see where I don't want to blanket statement skills. Saying every runner picks up heavy weapons is a little iffy...demolitions maybe but heavy machine guns and rocket launchers?

That is why I would like to state it's coverage in the first part. But again I don't want to break character concept with that.

[All4BigGuns]

I should have noted that in the first part. When I said giving them what I think "pro" runners have I meant EVERYTHING. Not just stuff and people. I just didn't use skills as an example. So instead of extra BP for buying more skills I will just give them skills. But seeing as how I'm still trying to decide on what and how I decided not to use it. For now though I think 2 is a good rating for all those. I would say athletic skills and stealth should be at 2 since those are used almost infinitely in any run. As to weapons I agree on pistols but then the next question comes along. Longarms and Automatics? Some people in real life in modern times can use shotguns and rifles, and just as many do automatics instead. Should I give 1 or 2 to those? Also other skills I think should be dependent on character background. Maybe one guy was in the army? I would say he has most weapons skills at 2 then. You can see where I don't want to blanket statement skills. Saying every runner picks up heavy weapons is a little iffy...demolitions maybe but heavy machine guns and rocket launchers?

That is why I would like to state it's coverage in the first part. But again I don't want to break character concept with that.

I'd say let them build for their specialties and then give them rating 2 or 3 in the skills you think are appropriate that they didn't get (social, technical and vehicle skills on the street sam types, combat skills on the hacker/rigger/mage types, etc.)

[Mirikon]

I like the 485 BP idea, with 35 forced into extra qualities and 50 into extra nuyen. If I could make one suggestion, though, I'd add the following things:

* Allowing them to join a magical group for 2 BP.
* Allow them to buy levels of Initiation/Submersion for 1 BP=2 Karma (round up).

I'm saying this because for the Awakened/Emerged types, A good portion of their advancement is in the form of Initiation/Submersion, not in spending nuyen like with mundanes.

[Weebomancer]

Actually I was wondering on what I should do for that. Certainly allowing initiation and submersion was going to be there but I had no idea on how to handle it. That's a good idea 1 BP = 2 Karma. So far my list is the following.

- 485 BP with 35 spent on qualities and 50 on nuyen. These do not affect the cap.
- Access to metamagic and submersion for the cost of 1 BP to 2 Karma.
- Anything I think they should have will be added such as skills, safehouses, and backup gear stashes.
- Runners will play 3 missions before the actual game starts to gain "extra" contacts.
- Starting availability is 18.

House Rule Set: No amount of power will save you from stupidity! This is also for anyone interested in playing this game if I get enough interest I might try to run it on the forums here. Also Special Snowflake Syndrome and Power Gaming is fun and I won't kick players for trying it. Here is why.

1. I allow ridiculous characters. Nothing gets me excited like planning the arrest of a nine foot tall lizard that glows in the dark. Be smart people, stealth isn't always about a high dice pool. 20+ dice won't stop you from standing out.

2. I allow broken characters. Nothing is more fun then to ignore that massive dice pool to resist magic by targeting your environs instead of you. Sorry did the concrete go soft and then hard again? Too bad.

3. Want to here a funny joke? A troll walks into a hallway with four Knight Errant cops using high velocity SMG's with APDS EX Explosive rounds....

4. Yes Knight Errant can do that because Damien Knight is a legend and until you are too I think he can do whatever the hell he wants to do.

ACTUAL House/Optional rules come up next. If it's not mentioned it's by the books standard rules.

- No armor encumbrance when wearing one piece of armor.
- Allow skills to be regrouped if all ratings are the same.
- High strength affects weapon recoil.
- Use maximum armor modifications.
- Use armor suit capacity.
- Free contact points : Charisma x 2
- Skill defaulting includes modifiers
- Essence loss only reduces MAG/RES maximum.
- Characters can spend up to 70 BP on positive qualities (this is because of the type of game)
- Character can spend up to 100 BP on Nuyen (this is another game type rule)

If anyone uses this rule set let me know how it turns out. And thanks to everyone who added options to this thread for high powered gameplay.

[Mirikon]

I like it. Definitely going to be higher power than normal, but it'll be fun to play. You run this on the site, I definitely want in.

[All4BigGuns]

Actually I was wondering on what I should do for that. Certainly allowing initiation and submersion was going to be there but I had no idea on how to handle it. That's a good idea 1 BP = 2 Karma. So far my list is the following.

- 485 BP with 35 spent on qualities and 50 on nuyen. These do not affect the cap.
- Access to metamagic and submersion for the cost of 1 BP to 2 Karma.
- Anything I think they should have will be added such as skills, safehouses, and backup gear stashes.
- Runners will play 3 missions before the actual game starts to gain "extra" contacts.
- Starting availability is 18.

House Rule Set: No amount of power will save you from stupidity! This is also for anyone interested in playing this game if I get enough interest I might try to run it on the forums here. Also Special Snowflake Syndrome and Power Gaming is fun and I won't kick players for trying it. Here is why.

1. I allow ridiculous characters. Nothing gets me excited like planning the arrest of a nine foot tall lizard that glows in the dark. Be smart people, stealth isn't always about a high dice pool. 20+ dice won't stop you from standing out.

2. I allow broken characters. Nothing is more fun then to ignore that massive dice pool to resist magic by targeting your environs instead of you. Sorry did the concrete go soft and then hard again? Too bad.

3. Want to here a funny joke? A troll walks into a hallway with four Knight Errant cops using high velocity SMG's with APDS EX Explosive rounds....

4. Yes Knight Errant can do that because Damien Knight is a legend and until you are too I think he can do whatever the hell he wants to do.

ACTUAL House/Optional rules come up next. If it's not mentioned it's by the books standard rules.

- No armor encumbrance when wearing one piece of armor.
- Allow skills to be regrouped if all ratings are the same.
- High strength affects weapon recoil.
- Use maximum armor modifications.
- Use armor suit capacity.
- Free contact points : Charisma x 2
- Skill defaulting includes modifiers
- Essence loss only reduces MAG/RES maximum.
- Characters can spend up to 70 BP on positive qualities (this is because of the type of game)
- Character can spend up to 100 BP on Nuyen (this is another game type rule)

If anyone uses this rule set let me know how it turns out. And thanks to everyone who added options to this thread for high powered gameplay.

Looks good and fun as hell. Any way to convince you to do this in Play-by-Post?

[Lethe]

House Rule Set: No amount of power will save you from stupidity! This is also for anyone interested in playing this game if I get enough interest I might try to run it on the forums here.

announcing enough interest! Never tried that kind of game.

[All4BigGuns]

House Rule Set: No amount of power will save you from stupidity! This is also for anyone interested in playing this game if I get enough interest I might try to run it on the forums here.

announcing enough interest! Never tried that kind of game.

*raises hand about fifty times and then pulls out the trick for winning elections and gets dead people to express interest*