[emsquared]

Is it legit to take an Incompetent Neg Quality in a skill that you can't use untrained? Or that you don't even have the stat to use (like Compiling, Decompiling, Registering)?

Aside from being cheap (and giving you Notoriety), it seems like kind of a loop-hole, no? Free BP? Like why wouldn't a non-magic character just load up on MAG linked skill incompetencies?

[rasmusnicolaj]

I don't think the rules say you can't but your GM should disalove it.
I think incompetences (and all negative qualities) should be a hindrace at some point and give opportunities to roleplay. I also think negative qualities should be based on a solid backstory for the character.
For example one of the characters in our group is shy so he has taken incompetence in leadership.

Rasmus

[RdMarquis]

Even the books suggest that you shouldn't allow that quality for skills that will never come up, for the character or the game in general. The example given is Pilot Aerospace in a street gang based game. Besides, characters without Magic or Resonance are basically Incompetent in the related skills to begin with. They can't use them, so they don't know how.

[emsquared]

Even the books suggest that you shouldn't allow that quality for skills that will never come up, for the character or the game in general. The example given is Pilot Aerospace in a street gang based game.

But take Medicine or Hardware or Software or Automotive or Nautical Mechanic. These could all very plausibly come up for any character but they already are untrained prohibited, pretty much incompetent anyway if it's not a role in your build, not sure why you'd allow BP grabs for those...

[RdMarquis]

Well, personally, I wouldn't, for the reason you mentioned. It depends on the GM. You could make the case that although those skills are prohibited untrained, taking Incompetent means learning any of them is no longer an option for the character, which merits bonus BP. Though, you really would have to make sure this quality isn't abused. It probably isn't a good idea to let anyone take this quality more than once.

[All4BigGuns]

Incompetent: Hardware would bone a player WAY too hard in most cases, that's why I wouldn't allow that one. As to others, as long as it isn't Magic or Resonance linked, I could care less if someone takes it, despite the fact that it doesn't close off learning the skills entirely, it just doubles the cost to learn them.

[JustADude]

Now, how about a Hacker character with Incompetent (Cybercombat) and Codeblock (Matrix Attack)?

Nobody in their right mind engages in Cybercombat directly, but they're still "technically" part of the listed core skill-set for matrix types. Not sure if it's "legit" or "cheese", there.

[Dinendae]

Now, how about a Hacker character with Incompetent (Cybercombat) and Codeblock (Matrix Attack)?

Nobody in their right mind engages in Cybercombat directly, but they're still "technically" part of the listed core skill-set for matrix types. Not sure if it's "legit" or "cheese", there.

I'd say it would be legit; if your GM is doing their job, at some point you will get engaged in cybercombat. Maybe you took too long in a node, maybe your stealth didn't work out as well as you hoped (poor dice roll), or maybe you just ran into a security decker that's comparable to your hacker in abilities. Every time you go into the matrix, there's always that chance. Now whether cybercombat will mean much other than an enemy getting in to your comlink is another question.

[foolofsound]

My rule of thumb is: The player can only take Incompetencies in skills if they also took a skill or skills in the same skill group, or otherwise related field.

This way, a player with First Aid and Medicine could take Incompetence with Cybertechnology, or a Magician/Technomancer could take Incompetence with Banishing/Decompiling, but a player could not take Incompetence in Pilot Aircraft unless they also took Parachuting or Aeronautics Mechanic.

[JustADude]

My rule of thumb is: The player can only take Incompetencies in skills if they also took a skill or skills in the same skill group, or otherwise related field.

This way, a player with First Aid and Medicine could take Incompetence with Cybertechnology, or a Magician/Technomancer could take Incompetence with Banishing/Decompiling, but a player could not take Incompetence in Pilot Aircraft unless they also took Parachuting or Aeronautics Mechanic.

Good rule.

Eliminates most of the cheese, and still lets people buy Incompetent for skills that nobody ever takes anyway.

[farothel]

I had once an ex-military character who had incompetent in gunnery.  She had most of the other fighting skills, but not that one.  The backstory being that she was the only one in basic training who managed to jam the tank gun, after which given her other skills they put her as scout in special ops.  It turned out it never came up as a skill roll, but they did drive around for some time with a vehicle with turret mounted LMGs, so it could have.

As said before and this goes of course for all negative qualities, ask you GM.  If he approves, okay, otherwise take something else.  And if you really take a cheesy one you think will never come up, trust your evil GM to make it happen anyways.

[Glyph]

I would disallow skills the character could not ever have in the first place (sorcery or conjuring skills for a non-mage, resonance skills for a non-technomancer), as well as the more esoteric ones such as orbital launch weaponry.

For other skills, two things to keep in mind, as far as making it a disadvantage, are - 1) it gives you a point of Notoriety, and 2) you are treated as unaware in that skill.

I agree with farothel that excessive cheesiness can be self-defeating.  If you have a moderate allergy to silver, then once in a blue moon you will run into someone wearing silver jewelry or shooting silver bullets.  If you have a moderate allergy to dinosaur poop, then Aztechnology's cloned pterodactyl experiments will escape to the skies of Seattle, where the pollution, combined with a greasy diet of pigeons, devil rats and the occasional squatter, will give them bad diarrhea, and your character will continually find himself, literally, dumped on.

[Kontact]

Incompetent is the worst.  There is no better way for a player to advertise that they don't want to roleplay than to take Incompetent in anything.

Either the player picks some skill that they will never have any reason to learn or use (because they're greedy and don't want their disadvantages to be interesting or disadvantageous,) or they pick a skill that they might have reason to learn or use, but which would be completely insane for a person to be unable to learn, do or understand (because they have no concept of their character as a person who exists in a world.)

There are not enough rolleyes smileys in the entire internet for this shit quality, so I'll have to make do with this.

[All4BigGuns]

Incompetent is the worst.  There is no better way for a player to advertise that they don't want to roleplay than to take Incompetent in anything.

Either the player picks some skill that they will never have any reason to learn or use (because they're greedy and don't want their disadvantages to be interesting or disadvantageous,) or they pick a skill that they might have reason to learn or use, but which would be completely insane for a person to be unable to learn, do or understand (because they have no concept of their character as a person who exists in a world.)

There are not enough rolleyes smileys in the entire internet for this shit quality, so I'll have to make do with this.

In your opinion. You may think that, but that does not make it a hard fact for all.

[Makki]

Incomptence (Palming): could be fun to play someone totally clumsy dropping everything.
Incompetence (Blades): He always ends up cutting himself.
Incompetence (Pilot Groundcraft): He never learned and feels hopelessly unable to cope with all that trafic. As long as the autopilot works he should be fine though...