[Redmercury]

Does anyone else think assault cannons are way too weak in comparison to snipers? I mean, with the right modifications and ammo a sniper is basically an assault cannon that's easier to get and doesn't cost as much to operate. I've never looked into it but I would assume you can't slap a silencer on an assault cannon. I won't dispute the recoil penalty, that makes sense, but am I missing something? Where's my incentive to buy any assault cannon (save a Gauss cannon) over a sniper?

[Inconnu]

Because you have a far better argument for aking the door off the hinges with a assault cannon.

[Redmercury]

But no RAW to back it up. Just GM discretion. Something doesn't sit right with a high powered APDS shot destroying a large section of say, a wooden door. (or syntheboard, whatever they use in 2070)

[UmaroVI]

The Ares Thunderstruck Gauss Cannon is dramatically better than the other assault cannons and is really what you should be comparing.

[Xzylvador]

Could be remembering wrong, but wasn't there some improved assault rifle round in one of the books which improved damage and AP?

[Mäx]

Well one quite a big edge assault cannons have(other then including thunderstruck in their number) is that they use Heavy Weapons skill, witch is generally speaking hell a lot better skill then longarms.

[Shadowjack]

Personally, I would give the player a penalty if they tried to run around with a sniper rifle and use it like  a mobile weapon. Imo snipers should be stationary while firing. Assault canons are more mobile.

[UmaroVI]

But no RAW to back it up. Just GM discretion. Something doesn't sit right with a high powered APDS shot destroying a large section of say, a wooden door. (or syntheboard, whatever they use in 2070)

This actually isn't true. The Barrier rules are fairly derpy, but single bullets are very bad at destroying barriers. A high-powered ADPS shot will shoot targets on the other side of the door fine, but it will still only do 2 DV to the door itself if you shoot the door directly. See SR4A 166. Note that most Assault Cannons do actually fire explosives, so they do DVx2 to barriers. Gauss rifle rounds are not on the table so they presumably are unmodified against barriers, but the AP still makes them good at destroying barriers.

[Redmercury]

Thanks Umaro, that's what I needed to see.

[WellsIDidIt]

If you're counting Assault Cannon rounds as explosives (stated to be a "highly stable explosive rounds") for the purpose of barriers, then the Sniper Rifle could just be loaded with Explosive rounds or EX-Explosive rounds and do the same thing. They use the same terminology. As for Guass Cannons, they fire a dart, which is going to fall under "projectile" or "bullet" for DV purposes.

One of the issues with SR is that Heavy Weapons do a lot less damage than they really should. By its definition the Assault Cannon should be firing something very large compared to normal weaponry, it fires the same round as small tank cannons which should be in the 80-120mm range if I'm not mistaken. The Sniper Rifles usually top out in the .50 - 20mm range.

Personally I think that Cannons should get a Blast zone like explosives and have their DV dramatically increased.

All that in mind, Cannons do have a major advantage to Sniper Rifles. They don't require an edge test when used in non-Sniper situations (pg. 319 SR4A).

[Mäx]

One of the issues with SR is that Heavy Weapons do a lot less damage than they really should. By its definition the Assault Cannon should be firing something very large compared to normal weaponry, it fires the same round as small tank cannons which should be in the 80-120mm range if I'm not mistaken. The Sniper Rifles usually top out in the .50 - 20mm range.

Yeah, nope.
Assault cannon rounds are most likely 20mm and up, but nowhere near 80mm thats just ridiculous(panther has a fraking 15 round detachable magazine)

[Novocrane]

If we're counting anything as explosive for the purposes of penetration, wouldn't it need to explode where we're counting it?

Otherwise, I'm off to coat my hardliners with binary explosive. One flavour each.

[WellsIDidIt]

Yeah, nope.
Assault cannon rounds are most likely 20mm and up, but nowhere near 80mm thats just ridiculous(panther has a fraking 15 round detachable magazine)

Straight from the book for the Panther XXL, "This enormous assault cannon fires special ammunition common to the primary weapon in many small tanks. It comes with a smartgun system."

It fires the same kind of ammunition that small tanks use on their primary cannon. I cannot think of a single small tank that uses a 20mm round that was made after WWII. Everything modern pretty much uses a round in the  80mm - 120mm range.

Yes it's ridiculous. You can chalk it up to someone writing the section not knowing much about weaponry if you want, but it's still the facts according to the book. It should be in the 20mm-25mm range, but it isn't.

If we're counting anything as explosive for the purposes of penetration, wouldn't it need to explode where we're counting it?

Explosive Round and Assault Cannon rounds both explode.

[PeterSmith]

It fires the same kind of ammunition that small tanks use on their primary cannon. I cannot think of a single small tank that uses a 20mm round that was made after WWII. Everything modern pretty much uses a round in the  80mm - 120mm range.

Tracked infantry fighting vehicles are classified as tanks, they're just not considered main battle tanks. As such you'll find plenty of autocannons on them, which fall in the range of 20-40mm weapons.

[Ted Fast]

Personally, I would give the player a penalty if they tried to run around with a sniper rifle and use it like  a mobile weapon. Imo snipers should be stationary while firing. Assault canons are more mobile.

A Assault Cannon has bigger rounds and would thus need a thicker barrel to handle the pressure that a AC-round would generate going down the barrel.  Adjusting sights and steadying a AC and SR would take about the same amount of time I assume*. By my guesstimation a Assault Cannon would be about as long as a Sniper Rifle but more ungainly thanks to the extra weight from the heavier barrel.

So I ask you, why exactly would a Assault Cannon be more mobile then a Sniper Rifle?

*Adjusting sights and what-not would only be necessary in a long-range battle. Gyromounts would eliminate the problem for both weapons.