[WhiskeyHammer]

Im looking to confirm some of the answers I came up with to some minutiae questions during chargen. I wasnt able to find any direct mention of the below but maybe somebody knows of an errata or FAQ that addresses them... or failing that consensus on interpretation would be nice.

• Adept initiates can potentially get two power points per initiation level. The first coming from the meta-magic and the second coming from raising the magic attribute to the new maximum.
• Mages with even drastically reduced essence can still initiate to drastic levels. Say for an example, a mage with an augmentation/surgery addiction can still level his magic to something like 10 or higher, so long as he has at least 1 essence?
• Unless otherwise noted, if a firearm includes a smart gun system it is the external variety.
• Adding a vision enhancement to an internal smartgun system increase the availability rating of the weapon whereas adding a vision enhancement to an external smartgun system increases the availability rating of the smartgun accessory itself.
  
• Integral accessories cannot be removed.
• A purchased firearm comes with one clip.
• A ready weapon action is required to deploy a folded stock even if the weapon was already in hand and charged.

[Michael Chandra]

1: Initiating does not raise your Magic, it merely raises the maximum your magic can be at. You'd still have to separately raise your magic.
2: Yes, and he has very little leeway inbetween then, and costs themselves a LOT of karma in lost Magic.
3: I'm not so sure on that one, I'd have to doublecheck every weapon with one to check first. I'd suspect internal actually.
4: I'd have to check but seems fair.
5: Yes, they can't be removed.
6: An empty one, yes.

[ZeConster]

Im looking to confirm some of the answers I came up with to some minutiae questions during chargen. I wasnt able to find any direct mention of the below but maybe somebody knows of an errata or FAQ that addresses them... or failing that consensus on interpretation would be nice.

• Adept initiates can potentially get two power points per initiation level. The first coming from the meta-magic and the second coming from raising the magic attribute to the new maximum.
• Mages with even drastically reduced essence can still initiate to drastic levels. Say for an example, a mage with an augmentation/surgery addiction can still level his magic to something like 10 or higher, so long as he has at least 1 essence?
• Unless otherwise noted, if a firearm includes a smart gun system it is the external variety.
• Adding a vision enhancement to an internal smartgun system increase the availability rating of the weapon whereas adding a vision enhancement to an external smartgun system increases the availability rating of the smartgun accessory itself.
  
• Integral accessories cannot be removed.
• A purchased firearm comes with one clip.
• A ready weapon action is required to deploy a folded stock even if the weapon was already in hand and charged.

• Yes.
• Yes, although if you only have 1.XX Essence, your maximum Magic will be (6-5) + Initiation Grade, so you'd need to Initiate a total of 9 times (each time raising your Magic afterwards so the max Initiation Grade goes up) to get 10 Magic.
• Not so sure about this one. I think in 4th edition, at least, any accessory that comes included with a firearm is considered integral.
• I... guess so? Not really something I put any thought into.
• Unless/until they add rules for removing them in another book, yes.
• Yes - otherwise the bullets will fall out.
• You definitely need an action for that - not sure if it's a Ready Weapon action, though.

[Unahim]

I constantly cringe when they use the word "clip" in the book. Damn you, gun nuts, for teaching me the right usage of the words clip and magazine...

[WhiskeyHammer]

3: I'm not so sure on that one, I'd have to doublecheck every weapon with one to check first. I'd suspect internal actually.

I thought internal too. But looking through the entire list of firearms, there 11 firearms that include a smartgun systems. Only two of which are specifically named internal. So either the designers made accidental omissions on 80% of the smartgun firearms or, more realistically, the only smartgun systems that are internal are those that specifically mention it... at least until an errata or FAQ states otherwise.

4. I... guess so? Not really something I put any thought into.

It comes up during chargen and buying weapons off the blackmarket. For example if a weapon comes with an internal smartgun system, and I wanted to throw a vision magnification enhancement on the smartgun's capacity 1 camera then the +2 availability rating might push it over the 12max, so specifying where that +2 can make a noticeable difference when building a character and later in the game when trying to find gear.

7. You definitely need an action for that - not sure if it's a Ready Weapon action, though.

That's what I said. A full simple seems excessive for just the folding stock. Or at the very lest seems like a good candidate for a wireless type free action.

Additionally, the wording on the Yamaha Raiden, Ares Antioch-2, and Panther XXL need clarification. The Raiden's smartgun system may or may not be integral, the Anticoh-2 lists a smartlink instead of a smartgun (probably typos), and the Panther just says a built-in smartgun without specifying whether that means internal or integral.

[Crunch]

I would guess that "built-in" was synonomous to Internal for all practical purposes.

[ZeConster]

7. You definitely need an action for that - not sure if it's a Ready Weapon action, though.

That's what I said. A full simple seems excessive for just the folding stock. Or at the very lest seems like a good candidate for a wireless type free action.

You'd need wireless or a smartgun to make it a Free Action: manually, you'd need to fold it out, then click it into place or something so it won't fold back in whenever pressure's applied.

[Unahim]

What's more likely: That the gun comes with a smartgun inbuilt, or that those manufacturers just happen to sell their guns in a boxed set with a smartgun system attachement, without giving you the option to buy one of their guns without it?

Yeah, it's internal.

[WhiskeyHammer]

Whats more likely: the designers intended to make the smartgun systems internal, forgot to tell anyone, then felt the need to point out two other firearms as being specifically internal for... kicks? funnsies? for the sake of redundancy (then why not every firearm)?

Or: the firearms which are marked as internal are internal smartgun systems, and those that arent, by process of elimination are external.

The first one requires a pretty major mistake on the part of the designers followed by, not one but, two instances of isolated amnesia. The second... doesn't.

Im not saying that the first isnt possible only that its the less likely and less defensible interpretation.

[Michael Chandra]

I find it the most reasonable one, though.

[Unahim]

Whats more likely: the designers intended to make the smartgun systems internal, forgot to tell anyone, then felt the need to point out two other firearms as being specifically internal for... kicks? funnsies? for the sake of redundancy (then why not every firearm)?

Or: the firearms which are marked as internal are internal smartgun systems, and those that arent, by process of elimination are external.

The first one requires a pretty major mistake on the part of the designers followed by, not one but, two instances of isolated amnesia. The second... doesn't.

Im not saying that the first isnt possible only that its the less likely and less defensible interpretation.

Erm, so the ones that aren't mentioned as being external are, by process of elimination, internal? Your reasoning holds no grounds. And if you want to play Occam's Razor with me: What's more likely, that they forgot the word "internal" a few times, or that they assumed everyone would figure out that "by process of elimination" (which I already discredited) it's external? Yeah, pretty sure the "We forgot." one is -far- more likely.

And then that still doesn't address the fact that mods that come with the gun don't take up any mod spaces, but an external smartgun takes up a slot. An internal one does not.

[ZeConster]

Erm, so the ones that aren't mentioned as being external are, by process of elimination, internal? Your reasoning holds no grounds. And if you want to play Occam's Razor with me: What's more likely, that they forgot the word "internal" a few times, or that they assumed everyone would figure out that "by process of elimination" (which I already discredited) it's external? Yeah, pretty sure the "We forgot." one is -far- more likely.

Considering that the phrasing in the archetypes isn't exactly constant either; there's plenty of mistakes in the book; in 4E, Arsenal said that if an off-the-rack weapon has upgrades, those are assumed to be slot-less modifications (and only 2 of those smartgun systems were explicitly listed as "internal" or "integrated"); and you've got this quote:

Integral accessories (those that come with the weapon) don’t take up mount locations.

I'd say the "inconsistent writing" theory is not only slightly simpler than "they assumed people would realize any accessory that isn't explicitly listed as integral isn't integral, even though a different section in the rules contradicts this theory", it also has a more solid basis.

[Zar]

I bet if you google an image of the item you are speaking of, you can tell if it's bonus devices are internal or external.  Or just wait for the equipment book to show you a picture of the 5e version.  Until then the GM should decide and move on. 

[Michael Chandra]

Nice suggestion, Zar!

P427: Ingram Smartgun X, comes with a Smartgun, does not explicitly state Internal but no Smartgun is visible on the image.

[Unahim]

I'd call the images circumstantial evidence at best, not enough to make or break the point in their own right, but with the evidence already supporting internal, it certainly pushes it over the edge.