[martinchaen]

Pardon me for pushing in, but "Licensed decker" seems like a perfectly valid wage-slave job to me.

Also "Permit for restricted cyberprograms" or "License to own and use restricted cyberprograms" would work, at least for my table. It's similar to how the Archetypes have licenses for their guns.

[joe15552]

Pardon me for pushing in, but "Licensed decker" seems like a perfectly valid wage-slave job to me.

Also "Permit for restricted cyberprograms" or "License to own and use restricted cyberprograms" would work, at least for my table. It's similar to how the Archetypes have licenses for their guns.

That's a good suggestion.

[Celtibero]

quote from page 231: "some matrix actions are illegal, making them more risky than legal actions. The Matrix was built with security in mind, but of course they couldn't make it hacker proof. The list of illegal actions is pretty simple: all Attack and Sleaze actions are illegal."

this is the canon, if you disagree you are free to argue that it should be different, just don't go about saying hacking is legal, because when it comes to fluff it is not legal, period.

Spider get away because they can, they have the corps backing them, covering them, take your pick, and corps spy on each other, they take as much illegal activity against each other as much as they can in order to get that extra edge, but that does not make any of those actions legal. its unfair? yes it is chummer.

"Of course, G-men, security spiders, IC, and other users who are officially sanctioned by GOD never rack up an Overwatch Score, even if they're misbehaving. Such is life on the Matrix. And in the meat world , too, Come to think about it" page 232

[Celtibero]

on a fake SIN rate 4 just go with a plausible activity say the guy is an "security consultant" or "programmer"  or even a "software developer"

you familiar with the comic character "Groo the wanderer" from Sergio Aragonés?

after a few hours you actually say that something (very) similar to what i proposed earlier is actually a good suggestion.... dont know if i should laugh or cry, or maybe laughing so hard i cry better not... kids asleep

[joe15552]

quote from page 231: "some matrix actions are illegal, making them more risky than legal actions. The Matrix was built with security in mind, but of course they couldn't make it hacker proof. The list of illegal actions is pretty simple: all Attack and Sleaze actions are illegal."

you are talking about actions, not programs, but while we are on the subject, here are some actions that are not attack or sleeze actions: Control device, Disarm Data Bomb, Edit File, Enter/Exit host, Grid Hop, Invite Mark, Jack Out, Jump intro Rigged Device, Matrix Perception, Matrix Search, Reboot Device, Send message, Switch Interface Mode, and Trace Icon

Almost all of these actions can be enhanced with hacking programs.

[Celtibero]

disclaimer: if you are not familiar with Groo and google it, its not an insult, ill explain why if it must be, but do not take it as an insult m8.

[joe15552]

on a fake SIN rate 4 just go with a plausible activity say the guy is an "security consultant" or "programmer"  or even a "software developer"

you familiar with the comic character "Groo the wanderer" from Sergio Aragonés?

after a few hours you actually say that something (very) similar to what i proposed earlier is actually a good suggestion.... dont know if i should laugh or cry, or maybe laughing so hard i cry better not... kids asleep

Why would I not say something that you proposed earlier is a good suggestion?

[Celtibero]

nope... you actually skipped that post i reckon

[joe15552]

nope... you actually skipped that post i reckon

Why are you saying this?

[Celtibero]

quote from page 231: "some matrix actions are illegal, making them more risky than legal actions. The Matrix was built with security in mind, but of course they couldn't make it hacker proof. The list of illegal actions is pretty simple: all Attack and Sleaze actions are illegal."

you are talking about actions, not programs, but while we are on the subject, here are some actions that are not attack or sleeze actions: Control device, Disarm Data Bomb, Edit File, Enter/Exit host, Grid Hop, Invite Mark, Jack Out, Jump intro Rigged Device, Matrix Perception, Matrix Search, Reboot Device, Send message, Switch Interface Mode, and Trace Icon

Almost all of these actions can be enhanced with hacking programs.

hacking programs....by themselves they do nothing, they are just cyber programs, its what they are used for (outside the boundaries of law) that sets them as restricted, it may be fairly legit to protect your hardware against illegal bricking, that's not illegal, but using those programs to facilitate criminal activities (i.e. hacking) is why they are under the close scrutiny of the law (same as certain cyberware, firearms and ammo)

The program itself may not be illegal, but like i said earlier, if you have stated on a permit "hacking programs" that's going to arouse suspicion, (on a best case scenario the KE agent might be thinking you are making fun of him) and that's the last thing a (non suicidal) shadowrunner should do, correct?

[Celtibero]

nope... you actually skipped that post i reckon

Why are you saying this?

because if you had read the post you might have said "that may be a good suggestion" earlier, that's all

[joe15552]

disclaimer: if you are not familiar with Groo and google it, its not an insult, ill explain why if it must be, but do not take it as an insult m8.

Why would I take the existence of a comic book character as an insult? Do explain.

[ismilealot]

*1.) ShadoWarrior - "HANDSOME JACK" : ELVEN FACE  : backstory and character complete
*2.) Triskavanski - "THE PROFESSOR" : HUMAN TECHNOMANCER  :  backstory and character complete
  4.) The DarkMessiah HUMAN ADEPT : backstory complete
*5.) Jim - TOBIAS JONES - DWARF MAGE  : backstory and character complete
*6.) Ericen - ANATAR "SHADE" SHADOWSTAR : HUMAN RIGGER  :  backstory and character complete
*7.) Celtibero - JAMES "DEADEYE" CUSSACK HUMAN GUNNER  :  backstory and character complete

Please post your characters in the Neverland thread gentlemen so we can get this run started.

[ismilealot]

Joe, I happen to like rules lawyers. I happen to like guys who argue legalities with me. And I absolutely love guys with such a strong sense of their chara's they know what cliff edge their chara's absolutely will and will not jump off of. But, all your early arguments have been more of the, "No, this is legal. So if you're going to say that my fake licenses aren't viable in your game than you should let players know that their legally purchased equip, fake licenses and all aren't viable in your game." When all I asked was for you to come up with a cover story, and call the licenses that and hacking programs in parenthesis. No intention on my part to do anything with those licenses than any other GM does. Useful sometimes, subject to the occaisional scrutiny where the ratings matter. But, then you saw posts from other people, and you let me get a good look at you. This has been the most adriot bit of snarky trolling I've ever seen. You're comments haven't given anything remotely close to being bannable and on the surface have seemed reasonable, while being snide, sarcastic and baiting. (Nice job on the baiting btw, you baited on multiple levels simulatanously in an excellent bait & switch subjects tactic.) So, I had intended to give you a bit more rope and see what you made with it. But, bottom line is that this is a cooperative story-telling game. And in that game it's essential that the players are able to work cooperatively with each other. And, snide, sarcastic baiting of the other players just isn't fun for anyone but you. So I'm dropping you from the game. You were my absolute fave backstory, and I wanted a rules lawyer in the game. But, I need a player that can play well with others.

[joe15552]

Joe, I happen to like rules lawyers. I happen to like guys who argue legalities with me. And I absolutely love guys with such a strong sense of their chara's they know what cliff edge their chara's absolutely will and will not jump off of. But, all your early arguments have been more of the, "No, this is legal. So if you're going to say that my fake licenses aren't viable in your game than you should let players know that their legally purchased equip, fake licenses and all aren't viable in your game." When all I asked was for you to come up with a cover story, and call the licenses that and hacking programs in parenthesis. No intention on my part to do anything with those licenses than any other GM does. Useful sometimes, subject to the occaisional scrutiny where the ratings matter. But, then you saw posts from other people, and you let me get a good look at you. This has been the most adriot bit of snarky trolling I've ever seen. You're comments haven't given anything remotely close to being bannable and on the surface have seemed reasonable, while being snide, sarcastic and baiting. (Nice job on the baiting btw, you baited on multiple levels simulatanously in an excellent bait & switch subjects tactic.) So, I had intended to give you a bit more rope and see what you made with it. But, bottom line is that this is a coopeative story-telling game. And in that game it's essential that the players are able to work cooperatively with each other. And, snide, sarcastic baiting of the other players just isn't fun for anyone but you. So I'm dropping you from the game. You were my absolute fave backstory, and I wanted a rules lawyer in the game. But, I need a player that can play well with others.

Sorry to hear that. No sense arguing that. You're the gm.