[psycho835]

Has one ever been stated? If no, well here's my valiant efort:
Accuracy: 5
Reach: 1/2
DV: (STR+3)P/(STR+5P)
AP: -4
Availability: 10R
Cost: 4000Y
NOTE: Can be wielded in either one (stats before slash) or two hands (stats after slash). When wielded in both hands, it is compatible with Kunst des Fechten. When wielded in one hand, it can be used with Fiore del Liberi.

Thoughts? Suggestions?

[Reaver]

Away from books ATM,

How does that compate to the mono sword (1 handed sword) and the Katana (the classical  2 handed sammy sword)

[I_AM_ZHOUL!!!]

Has one ever been stated? If no, well here's my valiant efort:
Accuracy: 5
Reach: 1/2
DV: (STR+3)P/(STR+5P)
AP: -4
Availability: 10R
Cost: 4000Y
NOTE: Can be wielded in either one (stats before slash) or two hands (stats after slash). When wielded in both hands, it is compatible with Kunst des Fechten. When wielded in one hand, it can be used with Fiore del Liberi.

Thoughts? Suggestions?

A Katana is a single sided blade Bastard Sword... contrary to popular belief it was in no way special except for being about 4 centuries earlier in creation. Any European Bastard Sword would use the same stats as a Katana, you just describe it differently.

[Bulshock]

I have to agree with Zhoul on this, stats should be about the same as the Katana.  Though I feel the katana has far too high of accuracy.  If you want it different keep it to the same stats as the Katana but lower Accuracy to 5 and raise Armor Pen to -4.  If used one handed gets the same stats as a regular sword.  (So lower damage and lower armor pen.)

[Critias]

Has one ever been stated? If no, well here's my valiant efort:
Accuracy: 5
Reach: 1/2
DV: (STR+3)P/(STR+5P)
AP: -4
Availability: 10R
Cost: 4000Y
NOTE: Can be wielded in either one (stats before slash) or two hands (stats after slash). When wielded in both hands, it is compatible with Kunst des Fechten. When wielded in one hand, it can be used with Fiore del Liberi.

Thoughts? Suggestions?

I think those're a little high, just comparing them to the "sword" and the "katana" (which might as well just say "two handed sword") in the Core rulebook.

That said, I also think there's no real need to stat it out.  Me?  I'd just look at "sword" and "katana" and say "Hey, if you want a big sword balanced to be used with both hands sometimes, pay for the more expensive sword (the katana).  When you wield it with one hand treat it like a sword, when you wield it with both hands treat it like a katana (by giving yourself +1 accuracy and 1 better AP)," and I'd call it a day.

[Medicineman]

make it simpler
a Bastardsword   single handed uses the Sword Data and two handed uses the Katana Data/Values
Cost = Katana

@ Martial Arts
a Bastardsword can NOT be used singlehanded for Fiore dei Liberi.( its too heavy .The Strain to your Wrists is too much to bear, even for a Char with STR 6. a Longsword would be the largest/heaviest  Sword with whom You could practise Fiore Dei Liberi )
using it Two Handed for Kunst des Fechtens is OK though

Hough!
Medicineman

[I_AM_ZHOUL!!!]

make it simpler
a Bastardsword   single handed uses the Sword Data and two handed uses the Katana Data/Values
Cost = Katana

@ Martial Arts
a Bastardsword can NOT be used singlehanded for Fiore dei Liberi.( its too heavy .The Strain to your Wrists is too much to bear, even for a Char with STR 6. a Longsword would be the largest/heaviest  Sword with whom You could practise Fiore Dei Liberi )
using it Two Handed for Kunst des Fechtens is OK though

Hough!
Medicineman

Bad information here... that's not what swords weigh. Longswords average weight is 1.3kg (2.83 lbs) while Bastard Swords don't normally exceed 1.6kg (3.52 lbs.) Even going all the way up to big Two Handed swords will only get up to 3kg (6.6 lbs.) Swords are very very light & extremely well balanced so the weight is almost entirely in the hand. In that a European Bastard Sword is even better to use 1 handed than a Katana because the center of Balance is closer to the handle.

The misconceptions about sword weights is remarkably widespread but at no point is 7/10ths of a pound going to "break your wrist even for a Str 6 Character."

[Medicineman]

Bad information here... that's not what swords weigh.

Its not only about the Weight . they are often quite similar (You're right with that) but they CAN differ by more than 1 or 1.5 Kilograms and that IS a Difference, especially if You want to do more than just Chop down at the Enemy.
Swords are not automised and the Weight of the same Category could differ by 1/2 a Kilo ( especially Long Sword or Bastardsword. a Claymore or Two Handed Sword maybe even by a Kilogram)

its about the Movement, the Momentum and changing it, which comes with Fiore Dei Liberi
It simply can not be done with a larger or heavier Sword than a Long Sword ( I wouldn't even do it with a Long Sword, but I was STR 3 (or 4 at best ) )

Swords are very very light & extremely well balanced so the weight is almost entirely in the hand.

Not so much with a Bastard Sword that can be carried with one Hand but you most often need both Hands to fight with it effectifely

In that a European Bastard Sword is even better to use 1 handed than a Katana because the center of Balance is closer to the handle.

not the One I used to fool around with ( I wouldn't call it fighting myself. Training, yes but not fighting)

 

  The misconceptions about sword weights is remarkably widespread but at no point is 7/10ths of a pound going to "break your wrist even for a Str 6 Character."

according to my own Experience I've had with Sword, Long Sword and Bastardsword
a Bastard Sword is unsuitable for the one Handed Maneuvers you need for Fiore Dei Liberi (especially a Bastard Sword in one Hand and a Swordbreakerdagger in the other)
fighting with a Bastardsword with two Hands and using Manuvers presented in Kunst des Fechtens is OK though

With a Swords Dance
Medicineman

[Sendaz]

Honestly many bastard swords you will come across are only slightly larger than a regular longsword, with a longer hilt to allow a 2 handed grip which also has an additional weight on the end, bringing that center of gravity closer to the hands.  These versions can easily be handled 1 or 2 handedly and was what I had back in the day during the service when the feel of steel was appealing. 

Sure there are some oversized monsters out there, like someone who insists on combining a broadsword into the bastard sword design because it looks cool thanks to manga/anime, but that is more down to the smith's taste and what the customer wanted.

[psycho835]

according to my own Experience I've had with Sword, Long Sword and Bastardsword
a Bastard Sword is unsuitable for the one Handed Maneuvers you need for Fiore Dei Liberi (especially a Bastard Sword in one Hand and a Swordbreakerdagger in the other)
fighting with a Bastardsword with two Hands and using Manuvers presented in Kunst des Fechtens is OK though

Really? Hmm, all right, I'll take your word for it. Admittedly, while I read up on the german school I never before bothered with Fiori. And the whole mess started mostly because I wanted a weapon compatible with Kunst des Fechten that isn't useless when wielded in one hand, so...

I have to agree with Zhoul on this, stats should be about the same as the Katana.  Though I feel the katana has far too high of accuracy.  If you want it different keep it to the same stats as the Katana but lower Accuracy to 5 and raise Armor Pen to -4.  If used one handed gets the same stats as a regular sword.  (So lower damage and lower armor pen.)

As for stats, I was going for something betwen mono-sword and claymore. But yeah, modified katana stats ARE a better idea. Still, that's  trading two for one. How does AC5/DV+4/AP-4 sounds? Or would AC6/DV+3/AP-4 be better?

[Bulshock]

I have to agree with Zhoul on this, stats should be about the same as the Katana.  Though I feel the katana has far too high of accuracy.  If you want it different keep it to the same stats as the Katana but lower Accuracy to 5 and raise Armor Pen to -4.  If used one handed gets the same stats as a regular sword.  (So lower damage and lower armor pen.)

As for stats, I was going for something betwen mono-sword and claymore. But yeah, modified katana stats ARE a better idea. Still, that's  trading two for one. How does AC5/DV+4/AP-4 sounds? Or would AC6/DV+3/AP-4 be better?
[/quote]
Sometimes trading 2 for 1 is the better choice.  With Accuracy it might be best to go one for one though.  I would hesitate to add more damage to it, as 1 point of damage can be the same (for boxes of health), as 2-3 points of AP.

[I_AM_ZHOUL!!!]

@Medicineman... What is the quality of the swords you are training with? Are these relatively cheap swords or high quality like an Albion? Because the difference is substantial... I can't afford them but having gotten to use them before, you can definitely pull off a lot more maneuvers at much higher strike speed. The balance of blades like that especially with their faithfulness to medieval designs makes a huge difference. Fiore Dei Liberi is a Slashing Style not a fencers Thrusting Style that could definitely use a Bastard Sword, especially one based on medieval design. Which as Sendaz pointed out doesn't have a longer blade so much as a longer hilt which pulls the Balance of the sword even closer to the hand. Takes less effort from the wrist to slash & return to guard as such. Using the dagger in that style is like using a slightly more dangerous buckler... it has a small amount more offensive power with a little less defense. But I'm talking about Bastard Swords not Hand and a Half swords which are closer to Broadswords in design but we're a poorer man's sword in that the quality & balance of the blades was inferior. Or they were being used from horseback so the weight & balance made overhand chopping motions superior to get through Armor, and the negatives of the sword from a standing fight were turned into positives by higher positioning.

[Sendaz]

To be fair, I always took the terms Bastard and Hand and Half to be pretty interchangeable, I was not aware they may have reflected two different subdivisions of swords.

That's what I get for ordering out of the back of MA mags.

[I_AM_ZHOUL!!!]

To be fair, I always took the terms Bastard and Hand and Half to be pretty interchangeable, I was not aware they may have reflected two different subdivisions of swords.

The longer bladed ones are Hand and a Half swords... otherwise known as Horse Swords. They were a later variation to try to keep swords relevant in the wake of heavier armor. But picks & maces where far superior to damaging heavily armored opponents. So Hand and a Half swords became a poorer man's sword since they were usually made out of a cheaper steel with balance being not as important. Some Knights continued to use them but they were essentially being used as narrow hammers by the end of the 14th century. Their cheapness led to a much higher production of them as opposed to traditional Bastard Swords, so they kinda overtook that same slot from a broad historical point of view.

[Medicineman]

@ Zhoul

@Medicineman... What is the quality of the swords you are training with?

it's been 10,12,15 Years Ago , while I did some Medievil Reenactment
( between 1995 and 2005)
I'm sorry but I don't really remember which Quality or Company they whre made of, but I suppose standard German Quality. nothing unsuitable for Fighting but nothing toooo Fancy/Expensive like Albion

 

The balance of blades like that especially with their faithfulness to medieval designs makes a huge difference

I know

Oh I found two interesting You tube Videos
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nb2Cvd_amEc

and

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FWWpzXOuk_s

that I can totally Agree with

HokaHey
Medicineman